[Football] Caicedo and MacAllister, How Well Have They Done Since They Left Us?

[phoenix]

The TNT commentator said last night "Chukwuemeka is coming on for the ineffectial Moises Caicedo" That says it all for me.

 

[beorhthelm]

'Caicedo and MacAllister, How Well Have They Done Since They Left Us?'​

Don't know, don't care. Naive of the club tho to think they could just take the money and trust in the algorithm to replace like for like with no loss of momentum

its been said before, part of the algorithm is the players move on. we couldnt hold on to either player, Mac Allister had some gentleman's agreement and Caicedo attracted the proverbial money truck. the failing was perhaps not bringing in a new midfielder to replace during the tail end of the season, though that would be risky.

as to the how well they've done, appears Caicedo has struggled and maybe wasnt ready to go, do it on his own, while Mac Allister has put a rocky start behind and is storming it.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

its been said before, part of the algorithm is the players move on. we couldnt hold on to either player, Mac Allister had some gentleman's agreement and Caicedo attracted the proverbial money truck. the failing was perhaps not bringing in a new midfielder to replace during the tail end of the season, though that would be risky.

Um, okay. My point was that you don't just flog off players of that calibre - two in one window! - and expect to just carry on like it's business as usual. Club's happy enough to take the money, club has to be prepared to suck up the subsequent hit in momentum

 

[ConfusedGloryHunter]

'Caicedo and MacAllister, How Well Have They Done Since They Left Us?'​

Don't know, don't care. Naive of the club tho to think they could just take the money and trust in the algorithm to replace like for like with no loss of momentum

I thought the plan was to keep Caicedo and have Billy Gilmour Billy Gilmour step up to replace Big Mac? Good plan that almost worked except Caicedo forced a move and no one can complain they didn't get a good fee out of it all.

I reckon it was more of a mistake to not get fullback cover in the summer. Even then we could have got away with this if March had not been injured (Tariq injury was sadly, to be expected). It was part of this mistake to think Milner could cover fullback beyond emergencies mid game.

On the other hand they have gotten an awful lot right so I'm not massively raging here.

 

[MJsGhost]

Um, okay. My point was that you don't just flog off players of that calibre - two in one window! - and expect to just carry on like it's business as usual. Club's happy enough to take the money, club has to be prepared to suck up the subsequent hit in performance

Who's to say the club isn't prepared to suck up a wobble in performance for the kind of money that secures its future?

Progress was never going to be perfectly linear and an offer (Caicedo) so far over his worth made the risk of a slight regression in performance (while other/new players come up to speed) acceptable. Probably. (IMO)

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

I thought the plan was to keep Caicedo and have Billy Gilmour Billy Gilmour step up to replace Big Mac? Good plan that almost worked except Caicedo forced a move and no one can complain they didn't get a good fee out of it all.

I reckon it was more of a mistake to not get fullback cover in the summer. Even then we could have got away with this if March had not been injured (Tariq injury was sadly, to be expected). It was part of this mistake to think Milner could cover fullback beyond emergencies mid game.

On the other hand they have gotten an awful lot right so I'm not massively raging here.

Same. Just think they're a bit naive to think they can flog off the Footballing Family Jewels and - just like that! - replace them with an equivalent set of Footballing Family Jewels. The higher up the footballing food chain you get, the harder it becomes. There has to be a hit in terms of momentum

 

[beorhthelm]

I thought the plan was to keep Caicedo and have Billy Gilmour Billy Gilmour step up to replace Big Mac? Good plan that almost worked except Caicedo forced a move and no one can complain they didn't get a good fee out of it all.

I reckon it was more of a mistake to not get fullback cover in the summer. Even then we could have got away with this if March had not been injured (Tariq injury was sadly, to be expected). It was part of this mistake to think Milner could cover fullback beyond emergencies mid game.

On the other hand they have gotten an awful lot right so I'm not massively raging here.

probably, definatly and yes. we're doing OK, but lost the consistency we had.

 

[US Seagull]

'Caicedo and MacAllister, How Well Have They Done Since They Left Us?'​

Don't know, don't care. Naive of the club tho to think they could just take the money and trust in the algorithm to replace like for like with no loss of momentum

So here's the thing. Is "momentum" really Tony's goal at the moment, I wonder? I wouldn't be entirely surprised if Tony's thinking is for us to spend a few seasons bouncing around midtable building up the team, our reputation and bank account. Maybe now is not the time to go all in. Just like after promotion we didn't panic buy a whole bunch of new players and try to force them into the squad al la Forest last season.

Not that it's not frustrating right now. We all want to go higher every season. And maybe RDZ wants that too. And maybe he'll leave if the plan is to effectively trend water for a little while.

 

[A1X]

I don't know who at the club would be the one players and their agents go and talk to when they're demanding a move away, but whoever that is should have a big framed picture of Moises Caicedo hanging above their desk in the eye-line of all those players who are demanding moves out of the club as a reminder of what happens when you leave

 

[MJsGhost]

Just think they're a bit naive to think they can flog off the Footballing Family Jewels and - just like that! - replace them with an equivalent set of Footballing Family Jewels. The higher up the footballing food chain you get, the harder it becomes. There has to be a hit in terms of momentum

What has made you think that they believe it's that simple?

What has made you think that they don't factor in a hit to momentum?

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

What has made you think that they believe it's that simple?

What has made you think that they don't factor in a hit to momentum?

They doubtless have. Which doubtless results in RDZ being rightfully pissed off

 

[raymondo]

Same. Just think they're a bit naive to think they can flog off the Footballing Family Jewels and - just like that! - replace them with an equivalent set of Footballing Family Jewels. The higher up the footballing food chain you get, the harder it becomes. There has to be a hit in terms of momentum

I imagine Bloom and PB totally anticipated a hit in momentum for this season.

 

[ConfusedGloryHunter]

Same. Just think they're a bit naive to think they can flog off the Footballing Family Jewels and - just like that! - replace them with an equivalent set of Footballing Family Jewels. The higher up the footballing food chain you get, the harder it becomes. There has to be a hit in terms of momentum

"Flogged off" sounds a bit too casual to me. They knew Ali Mac was going and planned for it in the same "model" as Biss and Stroppy Trossy - player comes for a few seasons then we sell them on for profit. At the same time they fought very hard to not sell Caicedo, that was not part of the plan. Hence the Cucurellaesque stupid price tag and I think the minute he walked out the door they knew our season was not going to go as well as we were all dreaming. I imagine even RDZ might have adjusted his goal of winning the league down to top 4 instead.

 

[MJsGhost]

They doubtless have. Which doubtless results in RDZ being rightfully pissed off

Post #26 above is a bit odd seeing as you accept that the club has factored in a dip in form/momentum

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Post #26 above is a bit odd seeing as you accept that the club has factored in a dip in form/momentum

In what parallel universe would that stop RDZ feeling royally frustrated?

 

[MJsGhost]

In what parallel universe would that stop RDZ feeling royally frustrated?

Where have I said that RdZ wouldn't be frustrated?

My point is that although you concede that the club "doubtless have" factored in a dip in performance/momentum from selling off players, your earlier post (#26) was that the club was naive to think they could replace them "just like that"

 

[BLOCK F]

I don't know who at the club would be the one players and their agents go and talk to when they're demanding a move away, but whoever that is should have a big framed picture of Moises Caicedo hanging above their desk in the eye-line of all those players who are demanding moves out of the club as a reminder of what happens when you leave

I take your point, but he is only a young man and, if not at Chelsea, I am sure he will come good under another manager and or club. In the meantime, he will fill his boots with dosh that will give him and his family security for life.
Worse things could happen to a young fella!

 

[martin tyler]

Not seen much of either but did watch the game last night.
Macallister was superb last played in front of the pool back 4 tackled well and was spraying passes all over.
Caicedo looked a bit lost tbh. Not sure if it’s the coaching but there were times he pressed alone, got caught out here and there, on the 2nd goal he was well out of position. Made a couple good tackles but overall the midfield of Caicedo Fernandes and Gallagher were overrun by the Liverpool 3.

 

[Weststander]

"Flogged off" sounds a bit too casual to me. They knew Ali Mac was going and planned for it in the same "model" as Biss and Stroppy Trossy - player comes for a few seasons then we sell them on for profit. At the same time they fought very hard to not sell Caicedo, that was not part of the plan. Hence the Cucurellaesque stupid price tag and I think the minute he walked out the door they knew our season was not going to go as well as we were all dreaming. I imagine even RDZ might have adjusted his goal of winning the league down to top 4 instead.

to top 7, to top half

 

[ConfusedGloryHunter]

to top 7, to top half

Avoid relegation...