[Albion] Brighton fans meltdown: arrived (Was incoming)

[Bold Seagull]

The only positions that matter are those at the end of the season after everybody's played everybody else home and away.

You wouldn't say a team had won the league if they spent every week at the top except the last and finished 2nd.

A league season is an unfolding narrative from game week 1 to game 38. I doubt any of us ignore the league table each week just because the final position is the only one that matters.

I can certainly say at the end of a season who contested the title and relegation, who slumped from early promise and who struggled but came good at the end. Pretty boring just to see it in only black and white.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

It seems to me that last year's achievements may have made some of us presume that we automatically belong in the highest echelons of European football and that us fans are being let down by every disappointing result, so in response to the recent spate of woe is us/sack everyone threads, here's a little context.

Last season's 6th place was the best finish in the club's history. 21/22's 9th was the second best, third was 13th in 1981/82. We're currently 10th and 13 points ahead of the team in 14th. It seems safe to say that this will probably at least equal the third best league finish we've ever achieved. We've done this whilst playing in Europe for the first time and we topped our group. We still currently have a positive goal difference. Last season was the only in our existence that we'd finished a season in the top flight with a positive goal difference.

This is the squad from last year's FA Cup semi-final, along with details of how it's changed this year and the player's availability this term. To give a fuller picture I've added some of last year's squad who were not available for that game. The availability detail is not to provide excuses, but to show the various challenges the squad has faced whilst getting to where we are this year.

Name	Still in Squad?	Replacement	Availability
Sanchez	Gone	Verbruggen	Okay
Gross	Yes		Played 44 matches in 22/23. With internationals has played 45 this year with 7 games to go
Webster	Yes		Injured in November missed 10 matches - played only 6 since then and only once for the full 90
Dunk	Yes		Played 42 matches in 22/23. Has played 41 this year with 7 games to go
Estupinan	Yes		Missed 15 matches October to January
Caicedo	Gone	Dahoud	Gone
Mac Allister	Gone	Baleba	Okay
March	Yes		Injured in October - out for the season
Enciso	Yes		Meniscus tear in second game of the season - missed 30 games and hasn't yet played 90 minutes all year.
Mitoma	Yes		Out for three games before international absence. Back injury in February - Out for the season
Welbeck	Yes		Missed 11 Matches October to December
Colwill	Gone	Igor	Okay
Undav	Loaned	Pedro	Missed 9 games in Feb/March
Steele	Yes		Okay
Ayari	Gone	Milner	Missed 17 games through injury. Hasn't played since January
Gilmour	Yes		Missed the last 6 games through injury
van Hecke	Yes		Already played 37 matches this season. 5 more than he has played in any previous full season
Veltman	Yes		Missed 8 games Dec-Feb
Buonanotte	Yes		Already played over double the minutes he played last season
Offiah	Sent on loan. Returned due to illness	Hinshelwood	Injured in Feb - Out for the season
Lallana	Yes		Okay
Ferguson	Yes		Currently injured.
Trossard	Went in January 2023	Adringa	Missed a few games with a hamstring injury just before the ANC
Sarmiento	Loaned	Fati	Missed 13 games Dec-Feb

We are the only team in the top 10 that is not also in the top ten of the division's largest salaries: https://www.spotrac.com/epl/payroll/

Over the last five seasons the rest of the top ten have transfer balances that range from -€367.96m (West Ham) to -€909.58m (Chelsea). In the same period we have made €12.66m. We're the only team to have made a transfer profit over that period and remain in the division.

None of this implies that fans can't be frustrated when our form is bad, or worried that it's not going to click again. None of this excuses poor performances and our coaching team wouldn't let it. However, it's provided as a gentle reminder that our success is against the odds. It's always going to be an uphill battle. There will always be knock backs and they'll often be frequent. We're always going to be raided by richer opponents. We're always going to need periods of renewal whilst younger players bed in and improve. None of this has been at all likely and it is actually far more likely that it ends than it sustains.

We're on an incredible ride and this rollercoaster will have a lot of dips along with the incredible peaks. When we experience the dips, logic suggests that it's better to all stay in the car and trust that there may be a peak coming than to throw stuff at the ride controller, or call for him to sack the engineer.

Sorry this is so long: if anybody wants the abridged version:- Amongst the excitement, we've suffered a bit this year, but we've faced it together and if we stick together, we will be stronger for it in the future. We will never have an automatic right to three points against anybody in this league. Stop these silly threads. If Palace were doing them on their forum, we'd be massively amused at the sheer hubris.

Remind me - why are you called Stato?

Fantastic post BTW.

 

[Bold Seagull]

With player sales and injuries we probably haven't hit the same levels.

But another major factor is that opposition teams have learned that a low block is the best way to deal with our tactics. This has made it much harder to to play that brilliant incisive football. In fact, it has lead to quite long tedious periods of play as we pass the ball around looking for ways through the block.

Last season Moyes said that Brighton had a unique style of play which was hard to play against. This season he parked the bus and played on the counterattack.

And Moyes has had the luckiest season imaginable with virtually no injuries and likely the most goals to chances ratio of anyone in the league.

We might have a ponderous build up to teams in a low block, but West Ham don't even bother having the ball, and have relied pretty much on Bowen having the season of his life. Take Pacqueta and Bowen out of their side as we've had to face in terms of our key players, and they would be in a relegation battle as they were last season.

Like golf, you can be brilliant from tee to green, but if you cannot putt, then you'll end up with an average score. West Ham's season has been rough to rough, but holing ridiculous putts.

 

[GT49er]

I thought 9th was conf league ?

Don't think so - it was 7th. last season, and even if the PL gets that 5th. Champions' League spot, that only takes it down to 8th. Maybe not even 8th. if Coventry win the FA Cup (unlikely, I know).

 

[sydney]

unfortunately social media and the internet has given bedwetters , hand wringers , irate grandmothers , incandescent teenagers and spoiled brats in general a forum to splurt their opinion out into the public domain .....ironically the internet is where this outstanding piece of actuality is written for all to read , i suggest it is shared far and wide , sent to the ARGUS , The Guardian , Sportbible etc. etc. etc ....pehaps it will shut some of the gits up.

 

[sydney]

Oh I think we have a huge amount of entitled fans!

it's the grandmothers on facebook spouting their opinions that do my firkin swede in....the standard reply of "dishes" normally gets a decent reaction.

 

[GJN1]

Post of the season without a doubt.

Actually, can we have a 'Post of the Season' award?

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

A league season is an unfolding narrative from game week 1 to game 38. I doubt any of us ignore the league table each week just because the final position is the only one that matters.

I can certainly say at the end of a season who contested the title and relegation, who slumped from early promise and who struggled but came good at the end. Pretty boring just to see it in only black and white.

That's all very well, but it doesn't alter the fact that we finished 9th, so we were a top half team team that season. That we were lower than that at various points doesn't diminish that achievement.

 

[Bold Seagull]

That's all very well, but it doesn't alter the fact that we finished 9th, so we were a top half team team that season. That we were lower than that at various points doesn't diminish that achievement.

Nor did my posts look to diminish it.

 

[Pliny the Gull]

Have really enjoyed last 2 seasons, and would be happy with RDZ still here next.
As an observation, his "Mentality" statements are interesting. Last season inspired confidence, trust and belief in the players, (Solly, Fergie, JPVan etc). They all seemed to thrive on the rewards of success (Europe, cup).
Injuries have not helped.
However this season for some reason IMO, they seem to have more of a fear of failure about them. Have to say some of the starting line ups, and late or not off the bench has not inspired confidence in certain players.

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

Nor did my posts look to diminish it.

You literally discounted that season from our recent (and hopefully continuing) run of top half finishes.

 

[Bold Seagull]

You literally discounted that season from our recent (and hopefully continuing) run of top half finishes.

Didn't mention finishes. We've not even finished this season yet either. You've chosen a bit of an odd argument to make tbh. It was clearly a positive post.

 

[Stato]

Remind me - why are you called Stato?

Cauze mi spallin wos dodgey.

 

[Bob!]

Don't think so - it was 7th. last season, and even if the PL gets that 5th. Champions' League spot, that only takes it down to 8th. Maybe not even 8th. if Coventry win the FA Cup (unlikely, I know).

Or Man Utd
Or Chelsea

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

Didn't mention finishes. We've not even finished this season yet either. You've chosen a bit of an odd argument to make tbh. It was clearly a positive post.

I wasn't intending to get into an argument over it, I assumed you'd just forgotten/miscounted.

I simply don't see any sensible argument for not considering a season in which we finished in the top 10 after all the matches have been played as a top half season. It's not as if it detracts from your original point to say we might (might) have three consecutive top half seasons instead of two.

 

[the wanderbus]

What happens if we get 8 places , West Ham finish 7th but win the Europa League thus qualifying for the champions league via European competition rather than domestic league? Does that then open up a conference league spot for 9th place?

 

[Bold Seagull]

I wasn't intending to get into an argument over it, I assumed you'd just forgotten/miscounted.

I simply don't see any sensible argument for not considering a season in which we finished in the top 10 after all the matches have been played as a top half season. It's not as if it detracts from your original point to say we might (might) have three consecutive top half seasons instead of two.

If we finish 9th this season, yes it is an identical finish to 21/22, but as 2 seasons, 21/22 v 23/24 will have been very different with one 9th coming from below and rising up, the other mainly challenging top 7 and falling to 9th. Identical finishes, but 2 very different seasons.

All I was saying is we've had two seasons challenging in the top half, and perhaps I should have explicitly said challenging for Europe to differentiate from finishing top half. .

 

[GT49er]

Or Man Utd
Or Chelsea

Manchester United won't reduce the places available. The only way one of the places available for a good league finish is lost is when a team outside the top 7/8 wins a cup.

 

[Dave the hatosaurus]

It seems to me that last year's achievements may have made some of us presume that we automatically belong in the highest echelons of European football and that us fans are being let down by every disappointing result, so in response to the recent spate of woe is us/sack everyone threads, here's a little context.

Last season's 6th place was the best finish in the club's history. 21/22's 9th was the second best, third was 13th in 1981/82. We're currently 10th and 13 points ahead of the team in 14th. It seems safe to say that this will probably at least equal the third best league finish we've ever achieved. We've done this whilst playing in Europe for the first time and we topped our group. We still currently have a positive goal difference. Last season was the only in our existence that we'd finished a season in the top flight with a positive goal difference.

This is the squad from last year's FA Cup semi-final, along with details of how it's changed this year and the player's availability this term. To give a fuller picture I've added some of last year's squad who were not available for that game. The availability detail is not to provide excuses, but to show the various challenges the squad has faced whilst getting to where we are this year.

Name	Still in Squad?	Replacement	Availability
Sanchez	Gone	Verbruggen	Okay
Gross	Yes		Played 44 matches in 22/23. With internationals has played 45 this year with 7 games to go
Webster	Yes		Injured in November missed 10 matches - played only 6 since then and only once for the full 90
Dunk	Yes		Played 42 matches in 22/23. Has played 41 this year with 7 games to go
Estupinan	Yes		Missed 15 matches October to January
Caicedo	Gone	Dahoud	Gone
Mac Allister	Gone	Baleba	Okay
March	Yes		Injured in October - out for the season
Enciso	Yes		Meniscus tear in second game of the season - missed 30 games and hasn't yet played 90 minutes all year.
Mitoma	Yes		Out for three games before international absence. Back injury in February - Out for the season
Welbeck	Yes		Missed 11 Matches October to December
Colwill	Gone	Igor	Okay
Undav	Loaned	Pedro	Missed 9 games in Feb/March
Steele	Yes		Okay
Ayari	Gone	Milner	Missed 17 games through injury. Hasn't played since January
Gilmour	Yes		Missed the last 6 games through injury
van Hecke	Yes		Already played 37 matches this season. 5 more than he has played in any previous full season
Veltman	Yes		Missed 8 games Dec-Feb
Buonanotte	Yes		Already played over double the minutes he played last season
Offiah	Sent on loan. Returned due to illness	Hinshelwood	Injured in Feb - Out for the season
Lallana	Yes		Okay
Ferguson	Yes		Currently injured.
Trossard	Went in January 2023	Adringa	Missed a few games with a hamstring injury just before the ANC
Sarmiento	Loaned	Fati	Missed 13 games Dec-Feb

We are the only team in the top 10 that is not also in the top ten of the division's largest salaries: https://www.spotrac.com/epl/payroll/

Over the last five seasons the rest of the top ten have transfer balances that range from -€367.96m (West Ham) to -€909.58m (Chelsea). In the same period we have made €12.66m. We're the only team to have made a transfer profit over that period and remain in the division.

None of this implies that fans can't be frustrated when our form is bad, or worried that it's not going to click again. None of this excuses poor performances and our coaching team wouldn't let it. However, it's provided as a gentle reminder that our success is against the odds. It's always going to be an uphill battle. There will always be knock backs and they'll often be frequent. We're always going to be raided by richer opponents. We're always going to need periods of renewal whilst younger players bed in and improve. None of this has been at all likely and it is actually far more likely that it ends than it sustains.

We're on an incredible ride and this rollercoaster will have a lot of dips along with the incredible peaks. When we experience the dips, logic suggests that it's better to all stay in the car and trust that there may be a peak coming than to throw stuff at the ride controller, or call for him to sack the engineer.

Sorry this is so long: if anybody wants the abridged version:- Amongst the excitement, we've suffered a bit this year, but we've faced it together and if we stick together, we will be stronger for it in the future. We will never have an automatic right to three points against anybody in this league. Stop these silly threads. If Palace were doing them on their forum, we'd be massively amused at the sheer hubris.

Great post and inspired me to do a bit of research of my own.
Undoubtedly the exit from Europe and recent results have unsettled some of our fans so i thought i would compare our last 10 matches with the opening 10.

First 10 matches 7 League, 2 in Europa, 1 in C/cup W5 D1 L4 Goals for 23 Goals against 20 (worth pointing out 6 of them in the Villa debacle)
Last 10 matches 7 League, 2 in Europa, 1 in FA/cup W3 D2 L5 Goals for 9 (5 of them in the Sheffield Utd game !) Goals against 14

To me, perhaps obviously, the goals scored column is the major difference so i looked at our goalscorers and found that 18 of the 23 were shared amongst 5 players Pedro 5, Fergie 4, March 3, Mitoma 3, and Gross 3. This backs up exactly what you were saying re injuries/availability as 3 of those players have played virtually no part in the last 10 games(Mitoma's only appearance being in the aforementioned Sheffield game), Fergie's struggles have been well documented and Gross has been used maybe a bit too much.

 

[Curious Orange]

I'm currently reading We Want Falmer as a little reminder that these are currently the good old days.