[Politics] Brexit

[nicko31]

It matters because of high rates of food poisoning in the US linked to poor farming practices. It’s alright though, just the stupid and poor to be affected eh.

Indeed and chlorine washing allows producers to exercise lower standards in animal husbandry, we shouldn't need to do it and we shouldn't accept it

Worst still in cattle is the use of growth hormone, widely used in the US and Australia. They will want that on the menu as well

 

[ManOfSussex]

Anybody stupid enough to eat in a crap restaurant like Donatellos or buy chicken from a supermarket rather than a butcher won't care anyway so why does it matter ?

It's a typical sneering, condescending, derogatory, smug middle class, liberal metropolitan elite attitude like this toward ordinary working class leave voters that give remain voters a bad name............oh.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Anybody stupid enough to eat in a crap restaurant like Donatellos or buy chicken from a supermarket rather than a butcher won't care anyway so why does it matter ?

For animal welfare reasons above all others if we buy chicken in a supermarket we always buy the most expensive on the shelf. The price difference between that and the cheapest always amazes me - getting on for 100% in Sainsbury's for example. Many people who buy cheap chicken buy it because, like those who don't give a toss about horribly-raised American poultry being shipped to Britain, they aren't much interested in animal welfare. But plenty others buy it because a £15 chicken is fantasy land. They are financially hard-pressed. Poor. For you to write off every last single parent buying cheap cuts in Lidl as being 'stupid' doesn't do you any credit. Still, I suppose if a country tears up trade deals with 70 plus countries it is bound to be a bit desperate to sign up to anything.

EU animal welfare standards are low enough without us forcing ourselves to sink even lower.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

A lot of chicken in supermarkets has been injected with water. Buy from a good quality butcher and they know what farm it's come from and it's journey.

The issue of profit-driven animal cruelty always puts me in a deeply irritated frame of mind so can I please ask you to take more effing care with the effing apostrophes in your effingly insensitive posts. Many thanks.

 

[Gazwag]

Thank god the fields are full of English workers picking all the fruit and veg before it goes rotten, just like the way the English did so in the war years. Thanks to them food prices wont increase and farmers businesses will survive.



Oh

 

[Westdene Seagull]

It's a typical sneering, condescending, derogatory, smug middle class, liberal metropolitan elite attitude like this toward ordinary working class leave voters that give remain voters a bad name............oh.

Do you think HT buys poor quality chicken ? He identifies as working class.

 

[Simster]

A lot of chicken in supermarkets has been injected with water. Buy from a good quality butcher and they know what farm it's come from and it's journey.

That's all well and good if a) there is a butcher nearby, b) you can afford their prices and c) your lifestyle lends itself to visiting multiple food shops, something that has become less prevalent over the past 3 decades.

Besides, Brexit happened off the back of working class people's votes, and this is a stab in the back to many of those people. How can it be right that we bend over and let the Americans roger us over a trade deal that doesn't seem remotely in our interests? Fair enough to let in their shit chicken, but at least let people make an informed choice - it turns out country of origin won't even be labelled because the USA insist on that.

At what point does Brexit become not worth it? Was staying in the EU really ever as bad as this?

And your rubbishing of this was more smug and belittling of British people than anything you've ever accused HT of. It was appalling.

 

[Klaas]

Do you think HT buys poor quality chicken ? He identifies as working class.

Avoiding the point he was making (very well) there.

 

[Klaas]

Look on the BBC website

Still not going to help me out? Asked you a simple question, got evasiveness and an insult.
I'm going to assume you're either ignorant of the facts or are just lying. Could have just admitted you got it wrong. Nothing wrong in that.
Doesn't really change my view that many brexiters don't know what they are talking about and/or are liars.

 

[Garry Nelson's teacher]

I'm just wondering - and this is genuine, and not intended as a wind up - if, given the mess (understatement) that this government has made of Covid, Leavers really trust Boris and co to deliver the Brexit that they wanted?

To clarify: Leavers might well align with the intent of the current government ('getting Brexit done') but has it got the competence to do it?

This does assume that Leavers have a view on the type of Brexit they wanted. I've never been convinced that many have, and I guess the response will be that any sort of Brexit, no matter how botched, is good enough for them.

The situation we are living through has many of the ingredients of the perfect storm: pandemic, cliff-edge recession, huge (Brexit) economic disruption, uncertainty (deal? no deal?) and the hands on the tiller are (let's be honest) naff. Even if we had the best, brightest and super-competent government, they would have too much on their plate to cope.

Over to the Leavers......……….

 

[Bold Seagull]

I'm just wondering - and this is genuine, and not intended as a wind up - if, given the mess (understatement) that this government has made of Covid, Leavers really trust Boris and co to deliver the Brexit that they wanted?

To clarify: Leavers might well align with the intent of the current government ('getting Brexit done') but has it got the competence to do it?

This does assume that Leavers have a view on the type of Brexit they wanted. I've never been convinced that many have, and I guess the response will be that any sort of Brexit, no matter how botched, is good enough for them.

The situation we are living through has many of the ingredients of the perfect storm: pandemic, cliff-edge recession, huge (Brexit) economic disruption, uncertainty (deal? no deal?) and the hands on the tiller are (let's be honest) naff. Even if we had the best, brightest and super-competent government, they would have too much on their plate to cope.

Over to the Leavers......……….

Well, I’ve posted several times, with no response from anyone in support of Brexit, that border checks between goods that will travel within the UK itself is a betrayal of Brexit and everything it stands for.

This singular policy, and ease of implementation is irrelevant, the very principle that within our own borders we will need to check goods going from one UK company to another. Control of our borders has become loss of control within them.

I guess the fear of leave voters criticising Brexit policy is it’s jumped on by remainers as ‘I told you!’, however you’ve got to stand against something you voted when the realization of it is plainly wrong.

Border checks in the UK are a betrayal. There should be outrage at this led by those who believed that we were taking back control, not losing it.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Do you think HT buys poor quality chicken ? He identifies as working class.

I always had you down as a big supporter of animal welfare and food standards. Maybe I was mistaken

It would appear that by voting to remain you could be voting for a roll back of the progress we have made on animal welfare ..... especially around chicken and egg production.

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/apr/24/real-cost-of-roast-chicken-animal-welfare-farms

So if you quite fancy chickens being tortured then vote to stay. As a chicken keeper I'll not be voting to stay in an organisation that will bow to American demands in TTIP that would lower our welfare standards to theirs.

OK, here's something new. The UK has some the tightest regulations on animal welfare in the world - particularly around food production. To the point that it's looking increasingly likely that even chicken and eggs produced from 'barn' kept poultry might be banned in the next decade - i.e. all chicken meat will come from free range. As part of the EU we will automatically become signed up to TTIP. One of the American's 'red lines' is that they want to be able to sell the EU their animal products but in many cases to do that they will need to either improve their animal welfare or the EU / the UK lowers theirs. Have a guess which way that is going ? Are you happy that those regulations will allow the return of chickens kept in cages just slightly big than a show box for the whole of their short lives for British supermarkets to sell ? That's what will happen if we sign up to TTIP by being members of the EU.

All fair points - I suspect the shoppers would quickly kill off hormone fed beef though. Maybe after leaving, the UK could become the world leader in animal welfare - ban live exports / imports ( something the EU aren't up for doing ) and not importing any Parmesan cheese ?

Good grief - I can only assume English isn't your first language as you seem to struggle to understand it. I'm interested in animal welfare - I've used Foie Gras as an example of the EU preventing the UK from implementing an action against such a poor practice. I haven't said animal welfare coming under UK control is the ONLY positive, the question was to suggest A positive - note the singular ( that means one by the way ).

I agree entirely with your last point but not sure how chlorinated chicken is anything to do with animal welfare ? Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't buy it but the chickens are already dead before the process is used.

 

[Baldseagull]

I always had you down as a big supporter of animal welfare and food standards. Maybe I was mistaken

It is a common thing in all of us to be fair to Westdene, we often have a belief and then search for the logical reasoning for that belief, quite a stunning example though of selecting the facts only when they suit your beliefs.

 

[Chicken Run]

Looking at the way the government are handling the current COVID 19 crisis I have no confidence of them delivering anything other than a no deal Brexit!

Edit . This is in rep. To Garry Nelson

 

[vegster]

A lot of chicken in supermarkets has been injected with water. Buy from a good quality butcher and they know what farm it's come from and it's journey.

I saw a programme on TV years back that showed lots of the ( legal!) tricks and dodgy processes used in food production. There was a huge trough full of Chicken breasts soaking in a water based solution for the simple reason that the meat absorbs the water and weighs more thanks to the water.

So, when an industrial scale producer is selling Chicken breasts at say £8 a kilo,if they can get them to absorb 10% of their weight in water that's a lot of cash.

A lot of our food processes are already dodgy, I dread to think what will happen under Johnson's government of chancers and yes men.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Well, I’ve posted several times, with no response from anyone in support of Brexit, that border checks between goods that will travel within the UK itself is a betrayal of Brexit and everything it stands for.

This singular policy, and ease of implementation is irrelevant, the very principle that within our own borders we will need to check goods going from one UK company to another. Control of our borders has become loss of control within them.

I guess the fear of leave voters criticising Brexit policy is it’s jumped on by remainers as ‘I told you!’, however you’ve got to stand against something you voted when the realization of it is plainly wrong.

Border checks in the UK are a betrayal. There should be outrage at this led by those who believed that we were taking back control, not losing it.

Apparently that was another principle that could be overridden the moment Johnson decided otherwise

NO SURRENDER obvs (self-determination/democratic will of the majority in NI). The Unionist community has only one major concern re being shafted and that's from 'principled' politicians who have spent much of their career supporting a United Ireland while cosying up to Republican terrorists..

Rubbish. The UK government is protecting the integrity of the UK (as they should) and following the wishes of the UK electorate (leave/take back control). The Irish government temporarily backed by the EU Commission are the problem.

I wonder whether any leaver has any sort of principle that can't be overridden by the saviour Johnson

 

[Klaas]

I guess the response will be that any sort of Brexit, no matter how botched, is good enough for them.

This is the conclusion I've drawn from listening to large chunks of the brexit vote the past few years. It's like a cult.

 

[sparkie]

This is the conclusion I've drawn from listening to large chunks of the brexit vote the past few years. It's like a cult.

...radicalised by too much belief in what the members read on facebook or similar

 

[Gwylan]

I wonder whether any leaver has any sort of principle that can't be overridden by the saviour Johnson

You're being a bit selective on that issue: the drawing of the border in the Irish Sea (and closer ties between NI and ROI) is one of the reasons why some people voted for Brexit.

 

[Mo Gosfield]

I saw a programme on TV years back that showed lots of the ( legal!) tricks and dodgy processes used in food production. There was a huge trough full of Chicken breasts soaking in a water based solution for the simple reason that the meat absorbs the water and weighs more thanks to the water.

So, when an industrial scale producer is selling Chicken breasts at say £8 a kilo,if they can get them to absorb 10% of their weight in water that's a lot of cash.

A lot of our food processes are already dodgy, I dread to think what will happen under Johnson's government of chancers and yes men.

Why would this current government reduce some of the highest quality control standards in the world? A lot of our food processes are not dodgy. Why use a throwaway comment when its totally untrue. We have tight environmental standards in this country, professionally enforced and action is always taken if something untoward is discovered. I am proud of our food production/processing standards in this country and our traceability procedures are second to none. At retail level, there is full traceability. At catering level it is slightly lower but pretty good. It is improving. Thankfully, the EU have finally caught up with the Dutch and their ' intensive ' pig farming methods and the huge volumes of chicken coming in from Thailand and its Far Eastern neighbours is now strictly monitored. Practices like Ireland importing cheap South American product ( e.g Corned Beef ) and labelling it as a product of the EU, have also been largely been stamped out.
Food processes are not dodgy. If there is an issue, it is usually the result of incorrect handling or storage of product.