[Politics] Brexit

[beorhthelm]

I see it as quite a sensible idea.

its not really, as presented. context is everything and if it had been made at another time and place, it might seem a usful idea. after all, its a legal requirement to report on the make up of empolyees by other criteria. in the shadow of Brexit is comes across as crass nationalism, and was never going to go down well. pasty tax of the conference.

 

[The Rivet]

its not really, as presented. context is everything and if it had been made at another time and place, it might seem a usful idea. after all, its a legal requirement to report on the make up of empolyees by other criteria. in the shadow of Brexit is comes across as crass nationalism, and was never going to go down well. pasty tax of the conference.

With whom?

 

[pastafarian]

its not really, as presented. context is everything and if it had been made at another time and place, it might seem a usful idea. after all, its a legal requirement to report on the make up of empolyees by other criteria. in the shadow of Brexit is comes across as crass nationalism, and was never going to go down well. pasty tax of the conference.

it really cant be crass nationalism one day and a useful idea on another day.
seems you against it for the sake of being against it.

 

[beorhthelm]

With whom?

anyone that wants to portray brexit as being about xenophobia and little englanders, and anyone that doesnt want brexit to get bogged down in accusations of xenophobia and little englanders.

 

[The Rivet]

anyone that wants to portray brexit as being about xenophobia and little englanders, and anyone that doesnt want brexit to get bogged down in accusations of xenophobia and little englanders.

?...

 

[beorhthelm]

it really cant be crass nationalism one day and a useful idea on another day.

of course it can, its in the presentation. if breakdown of employees by nationality was made by a Labour minister to promote diversity it would be hailed by the Guardian as a great policy.

 

[pastafarian]

of course it can, its in the presentation. if breakdown of employees by nationality was made by a Labour minister to promote diversity it would be hailed by the Guardian as a great policy.

well now you put it like that

 

[GT49er]

So you're happy with GBP at a 31 year low against the USD. That's fine, but how far would it need to fall for it not to be ok in your view.

Personally, couldn't care less.



Next question?

 

[Jim in the West]

seems quite a sensible idea.
If the data is collected and compared correctly you could ask questions why does a tech firm in nottingham need to source more skilled workers from abroad than a tech firm in the same industry in another part of the country.You could ask why are we lacking in these skills? What can be done about it?
Its only demonising if you want it to be. People like you consistently talk about big companies being more accountable to the locale where they are based. If they are disproportionately not employing local people and favouring cheap foreign labour...why? why shouldnt they be pressured into pumping some of their massive profits back into the local community with training schemes or some other resource that helps local unemployed?

I think you're right - a lot depends on the way the information is used. The problem is, we know the background to this is a way of reducing the number of non-British workers. If (for example) the government said "there are too many blue-eyed people in the workplace", and then asked all companies to create a register of how many blue-eyed staff they had, I would have every right to be concerned (as someone with blue eyes).

I also think the assumption that companies are employing "foreigners" because they are cheap is often wide of the mark. The EU citizens who work for me (in Finance, IT, secretarial functions) responded to job ads along with a load of Brits. They got the jobs because they were the best applicants. We didn't suddenly pay them less because they are Spanish or Greek or Portuguese.

I have just got back from a CBI dinner - probably 1,000+ people there. The speeches were serious in nature, and pretty much the only laugh was when one of the speakers mentioned Andrea Leadsom. The laughter was born out of disbelief. What has this country become? One where bigots and racists have free reign to belittle and abuse decent citizens from elsewhere in Europe who are doing their damnedest to add value to OUR economy,

 

[pastafarian]

I think you're right - a lot depends on the way the information is used. The problem is, we know the background to this is a way of reducing the number of non-British workers. If (for example) the government said "there are too many blue-eyed people in the workplace", and then asked all companies to create a register of how many blue-eyed staff they had, I would have every right to be concerned (as someone with blue eyes).

I also think the assumption that companies are employing "foreigners" because they are cheap is often wide of the mark. The EU citizens who work for me (in Finance, IT, secretarial functions) responded to job ads along with a load of Brits. They got the jobs because they were the best applicants. We didn't suddenly pay them less because they are Spanish or Greek or Portuguese.

I have just got back from a CBI dinner - probably 1,000+ people there. The speeches were serious in nature, and pretty much the only laugh was when one of the speakers mentioned Andrea Leadsom. The laughter was born out of disbelief. What has this country become? One where bigots and racists have free reign to belittle and abuse decent citizens from elsewhere in Europe who are doing their damnedest to add value to OUR economy,

1/ just as well no one has suggested a register of blue eyed people or anything near it
2/ bigots and racists have not suddenly been granted free reign to belittle and abuse foreigners,whoever said that is a prick

 

[jaghebby]

Most people on here are not arguing for cuts in immigration. They are asking for managed immigration via border controls and
perhaps a points and work visa based system. These things are not possible within the EU. If the economy expands and we
need more migrants then I have no problem with that. Why would I ? My grandparents were immigrants and I have lived and worked around the world including in places with high immigration and many different cultures. What these places have in common is that they were not places operating within an area of free movement of people of 500m and they were able to manage the system as suited their economy and society. The EU model is not used elsewhere and it is not the only way to operate a sensible and humane immigration policy. The pro EU lobby sometimes seems to make assumptions that their way is the only way when perhaps they need to travel a bit more and open their minds to other ideas.

Errrrr the EU system is free movement of labour not just free movement! The right to free movement applies where the legal relationship of employment is entered into in or shall take effect within the territory of the European Community. We already have border controls as we are not part of Shengan. I disagree that most people are for managed migration most people who voted for Brexit want it reduced. Even the leave campaign itself in an referendum broadcast suggested that after Brexit people would get seen much quicker in A&E. This clearly demonstrates that an aim of Brexit is to reduce migration as all the EU migrants were filling up A&E! (We all know this is poppycock as most EU workers who come here to work and are young and fit so less likely to need the services of A&E. Where as the strain on A&E services is largely because of an aging population!)

 

[GT49er]

Errrrr the EU system is............QUOTE]

.......................soon to be discontinued in the UK.



I'm happy with that. maybe you're not. But, for instance, I wasn't happy with Thatcher becoming PM. So, I had to like it, or lump it. Recognise the scenario?

 

[jaghebby]

1/ just as well no one has suggested a register of blue eyed people or anything near it
2/ bigots and racists have not suddenly been granted free reign to belittle and abuse foreigners,whoever said that is a prick

The fact of the matter is that more British People and British Nationals aged 16-64 are now in work since records began in 1971. The rate is 74.5% given this high rate there is probably not much slack in the system to continue to fill the posts being created as the economy grows. So exactly where is the argument that all these EU nationals are taking the Jobs of British People? It is patently a false hood and a clear twisting of the facts! From my perspective this shows the country is doing rather well as part of the EU. Perhaps in 10 or 20 years time when the full impact of Brexit is realised I hope the ratio between those in work and unemployed has'nt reversed!

 

[studio150]

Errrrr the EU system is free movement of labour not just free movement! The right to free movement applies where the legal relationship of employment is entered into in or shall take effect within the territory of the European Community. We already have border controls as we are not part of Shengan. I disagree that most people are for managed migration most people who voted for Brexit want it reduced. Even the leave campaign itself in an referendum broadcast suggested that after Brexit people would get seen much quicker in A&E. This clearly demonstrates that an aim of Brexit is to reduce migration as all the EU migrants were filling up A&E! (We all know this is poppycock as most EU workers who come here to work and are young and fit so less likely to need the services of A&E. Where as the strain on A&E services is largely because of an aging population!)

But will people get seen quicker in A&E if there are fewer nurses and doctors as those that migrated here to fill the roles leave our shores.

 

[studio150]

Personally, couldn't care less.



Next question?

So there is now one person who is happy to pay higher pump prices when filling up their vehicle.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Errrrr the EU system is free movement of labour not just free movement! The right to free movement applies where the legal relationship of employment is entered into in or shall take effect within the territory of the European Community. We already have border controls as we are not part of Shengan. I disagree that most people are for managed migration most people who voted for Brexit want it reduced. Even the leave campaign itself in an referendum broadcast suggested that after Brexit people would get seen much quicker in A&E. This clearly demonstrates that an aim of Brexit is to reduce migration as all the EU migrants were filling up A&E! (We all know this is poppycock as most EU workers who come here to work and are young and fit so less likely to need the services of A&E. Where as the strain on A&E services is largely because of an aging population!)

Yes I understand EU free movement of labour. That is what I was referring
to.

 

[Jim in the West]

1/ just as well no one has suggested a register of blue eyed people or anything near it
2/ bigots and racists have not suddenly been granted free reign to belittle and abuse foreigners,whoever said that is a prick

The atmosphere now is that it's ok to be anti-immigrant. Whether you like it or not, that's what's happening. Call me a prick if you like!

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

The atmosphere now is that it's ok to be anti-immigrant. Whether you like it or not, that's what's happening. Call me a prick if you like!

Really ? At the CBI ? That wouldn't surprise me to be fair. Amongst the people I know the
atmosphere is not to be anti immigrant but to be anti unlimited immigration.Misrepresentation by the CBI in their quest
for cheap labour and by journalists looking for cheap stories doesnt change the real world I'm afraid.

 

[pastafarian]

The atmosphere now is that it's ok to be anti-immigrant. Whether you like it or not, that's what's happening. Call me a prick if you like!

sorry, i wasnt calling you personally a prick
i was responding to your quote

I have just got back from a CBI dinner - probably 1,000+ people there. The speeches were serious in nature, and pretty much the only laugh was when one of the speakers mentioned Andrea Leadsom. The laughter was born out of disbelief. What has this country become? One where bigots and racists have free reign to belittle and abuse decent citizens from elsewhere in Europe who are doing their damnedest to add value to OUR economy,

whoever speaking at the CBI that portrayed this country has morphed into bigots and racists is a prick......wasnt aimed at you.....who was it out of interest?

you have to be a right bellend to agree with knobs like that. You are right to disassociate yourself with bigots like him.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

sorry, i wasnt calling you personally a prick
i was responding to your quote



whoever speaking at the CBI that portrayed this country has morphed into bigots and racists is a prick......wasnt aimed at you.....who was it out of interest?

you have to be a right bellend to agree with knobs like that. You are right to disassociate yourself with bigots like him.

Big business is playing the race card because they have discovered that if you shriek hysterical insults at people then enough will back down so you can get your own way. Metropolitan liberals are now the advocates of the multinational company agenda of driving inequality by increasing the profit from capital at the expense of labour. It's a crazy world.