[Politics] Brexit

[Garry Nelson's teacher]

Raab's speech is at 11.00 (live on R5) with the detailed briefing papers to follow at 12.00

 

[pastafarian]

Tell me why it is impossible to have a peoples vote on the finalised trade deal before we have left the EU? Because that sounds like nonsense to me. Oh wait, it is nonsense. You're making it up.

A finalised trade deal can only be agreed with the UK when the UK is a third country, ie a country that is no longer a EU member.
The EU will not conclude a trade deal for an existing member leaving membership until it is no longer a member of the EU.
It is in the negotiating guidelines published by the EU Council

"agreement on a future relationship between the Union and the United Kingdom as such can only be finalised and concluded once the United Kingdom has become a third country"

http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2017/04/29/euco-brexit-guidelines/

 

[hans kraay fan club]

A finalised trade deal can only be agreed with the UK when the UK is a third country, ie a country that is no longer a EU member.
The EU will not conclude a trade deal for an existing member leaving membership until it is no longer a member of the EU.
It is in the negotiating guidelines published by the EU Council

"agreement on a future relationship between the Union and the United Kingdom as such can only be finalised and concluded once the United Kingdom has become a third country"

http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2017/04/29/euco-brexit-guidelines/

Don't be silly.

'Will not CONCLUDE' a deal, is absolutely not the same thing as 'will not agree the terms of what such a deal would be'. As well you know.

 

[Simster]

A finalised trade deal can only be agreed with the UK when the UK is a third country, ie a country that is no longer a EU member.
The EU will not conclude a trade deal for an existing member leaving membership until it is no longer a member of the EU.
It is in the negotiating guidelines published by the EU Council

"agreement on a future relationship between the Union and the United Kingdom as such can only be finalised and concluded once the United Kingdom has become a third country"

http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2017/04/29/euco-brexit-guidelines/

That doesn't prove your point at all though - it is simply semantics for "the UK is to an all intents and purposes an EU country until it leaves, at which point any negotiated deal takes effect".

The UK & EU are negotiating a deal that would then be finalised and concluded when we leave. However, that deal (or lack of deal) ought to be accountable to the people of this country before we exit. That's democracy. If it is a good deal and parliament agrees, then I don't think another referendum would be necessary. So all I'm saying is that rather than whinging about remoaners and weasels, you ought to be holding your own people to account for getting a good Brexit deal.

 

[pastafarian]

Don't be silly.

'Will not CONCLUDE' a deal, is absolutely not the same thing as 'will not agree the terms of what such a deal would be'. As well you know.

so you are saying a future relationship and trade can be finalised and concluded before we leave and become a third country

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Jesus wept, showing your true chip on the shoulder colours.
Many of us were anti EU before Boris had even uttered "political career", how daft are you to equate all leave votes to the wealth of those in the Bullingdon Club?......let me answer this way..........no wonder you lost..........and still you continue with the stupid.............im so pleased your side has learned nothing.

Goodness. I took it that GNT was simply taking an amiable dig at those Brexiters who like to think that they are the true sons of toil whilst Remainers tend towards the rich metropolitan elite. I'm sure you've rattled on about the Remainer elite in the past.

I can't believe it is good for you to get so cross.

 

[Two Professors]

What do you run the Tuck Shop at playtime .......

Assistant

 

[BigGully]

Assistant

I can imagine a log jam at his self imposed lorry park at the school gates for his delivery of puffs and flying saucers .......

 

[Two Professors]

All seems very straightforward,and laid down in print,so Pasta is right,as usual.

 

[pastafarian]

That doesn't prove your point at all though - it is simply semantics for "the UK is to an all intents and purposes an EU country until it leaves, at which point any negotiated deal takes effect".

The UK & EU are negotiating a deal that would then be finalised and concluded when we leave. However, that deal (or lack of deal) ought to be accountable to the people of this country before we exit. That's democracy. If it is a good deal and parliament agrees, then I don't think another referendum would be necessary. So all I'm saying is that rather than whinging about remoaners and weasels, you ought to be holding your own people to account for getting a good Brexit deal.

we will already have exited

the finalised trade deal is planned to be be completed during the implementation period, and by the end of that period (dec 2020) They wont start the nitty gritty until we have left( march 2019)
we will be well out of the EU by dec 2020.........the trade aspect will not be finalised before march next year..............this is what watford zero didnt understand either

 

[pastafarian]

Goodness. I took it that GNT was simply taking an amiable dig at those Brexiters who like to think that they are the true sons of toil whilst Remainers tend towards the rich metropolitan elite. I'm sure you've rattled on about the Remainer elite in the past.

I can't believe it is good for you to get so cross.

In English?

 

[pastafarian]

All seems very straightforward,and laid down in print,so Pasta is right,as usual.

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starting to think its only leavers that read these EU documents

 

[pastafarian]

All seems very straightforward,and laid down in print,so Pasta is right,as usual.

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Its also astonishing not one of the moaners this morning understood this.............they are getting serious dud info from somewhere

 

[hans kraay fan club]

so you are saying a future relationship and trade can be finalised and concluded before we leave and become a third country

Nothing can be CONCLUDED or FINALISED until we've left. The documents can't be signed, etc, until then.

We all understand that, and none of it prevents the details of those agreed positions being presented to the public for consideration.

Again, as you well know, despite constant attempts to misrepresent the situation.

 

[Two Professors]

I can imagine a log jam at his self imposed lorry park at the school gates for his delivery of puffs and flying saucers .......

 

[Two Professors]

Its also astonishing not one of the moaners this morning understood this.............they are getting serious dud info from somewhere

Think they listen to Watford zero brain cells too much!

 

[Simster]

Nothing can be CONCLUDED or FINALISED until we've left. The documents can't be signed, etc, until then.

We all understand that, and none of it prevents the details of those agreed positions being presented to the public for consideration.

Again, as you well know, despite constant attempts to misrepresent the situation.

If the deal is dreadful or there is no deal then I fully expect either parliament to throw it out or to pass the buck back to the electorate. That's democracy, and no amount of crying from pastafarian is going to change that. I'll say it again, pro-Brexit need to be holding their negotiators to account to ensure the deal is a good one. If it is, then nobody can have any complaints about Brexit going ahead.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I was listening to 5 live over the weekend where the owner of a haulage firm was saying that if no deal is struck, he'll be out of business within two weeks. Don't worry, the interviewer told him that pastafarian says tough shit because he doesn't want anyone to get in the way of leaving the EU, as long as he's happy.

And let’s not forget businessman [MENTION=5101]BigGully[/MENTION] says that companies should be able to adapt. He knows this because of the wide and broad experiences of numerous sectors he’s had.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Nothing can be CONCLUDED or FINALISED until we've left. The documents can't be signed, etc, until then.

We all understand that, and none of it prevents the details of those agreed positions being presented to the public for consideration.

Again, as you well know, despite constant attempts to misrepresent the situation.

In numerous walks of life draft contracts are discussed, debated and agreed upon before they’re finalised. Why can’t this moron understand and agree?

 

[pastafarian]

Nothing can be CONCLUDED or FINALISED until we've left. The documents can't be signed, etc, until then.

We all understand that, and none of it prevents the details of those agreed positions being presented to the public for consideration.

Again, as you well know, despite constant attempts to misrepresent the situation.

We have left the EU

The future trade deal ( final deal)has been agreed and concluded with the UK as a third country outside the EU

The peoples vote want a peoples vote on this final deal before it is signed.

They want an option in the peoples vote to remain in the EU

How do we remain in the EU when we have already legally left it and are now a third country outside it? It is impossible