[Cricket] Bitter celebration

[Dick Head]

Was the Muslim cricketer right to be offended, in the sense that his religious beliefs were not being respected? That seems to me to be a relevant question.

As far as I can see, there is no prohibition in the Koran or any Hadith against having alcohol sprayed over a Muslim willingly, let alone unknowingly. It isn't haram.

Drinking it certainly is:

"Narrated Abu 'Abdur-Rahman As-Sulami: that 'Ali bin Abi Talib said: "'Abdur-Rahman bin 'Awf prepared some food for which he invited us, and he gave us some wine to drink. The wine began to affect us when it was time for Salat. So they encouraged me (to lead) and I recited: 'Say: O you disbelievers! I do not worship what you worship, and we worship what we worship' - so Allah, Most High, revealed: O you who believe! Do not approach Salat when you are in a drunken state until you know what you are saying (4:43)."[17]

(Chapters of Tafsir Vol.5 Book 44 Hadith No. 3026).

"O you who have believed, indeed, intoxicants, gambling, [sacrificing on] stone alters [to other than Allah ], and divining arrows are but defilement from the work of Satan, so avoid it that you may be successful.

Satan only wants to cause between you animosity and hatred through intoxicants and gambling and to avert you from the remembrance of Allah and from prayer. So will you not desist?

And obey Allah and obey the Messenger and beware."

Koran 5 : 90-92

There is disagreement as to the punishment for drinking it, though. Some scholars prescribe twenty lashes, others say it must be forty.

But I can't see anything about how many lashes you get for getting it inadvertently sprayed over you by a Kufr cricket team mate.

Tl;dr

 

[Grombleton]

Luckily for you, Muslims won't touch gammon.

Thread peaked with this post. Bravo sir.

 

[The Fifth Column]

Comments which illustrate it's not just the Essex players who need to learn more.

Feel free to educate me then. All I've done is post an opinion that I think it is a gross over reaction by the club to what was a perfectly normal celebration that would have sufficed with an apology if the player concerned was upset or offended by it. Instead, in a perfectly modern and woke response the club embark on a diversity training program and posters here can't wait to jump on the 'I'm not a racist and respect other peoples religions and cultures' bandwagon like it somehow scores them some lifestyle brownie points. Like most threads of this nature, if you dare to post any hint of a contrary opinion the standard response is, 'you're a gammon'.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Edit, is Muslim a race?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Is gammon?

 

[Is it PotG?]

Is gammon?

No, it's the hind leg of pork after it's been cured.

I hope this helps.

 

[Dick Head]

Feel free to educate me then. All I've done is post an opinion that I think it is a gross over reaction by the club to what was a perfectly normal celebration that would have sufficed with an apology if the player concerned was upset or offended by it. Instead, in a perfectly modern and woke response the club embark on a diversity training program and posters here can't wait to jump on the 'I'm not a racist and respect other peoples religions and cultures' bandwagon like it somehow scores them some lifestyle brownie points. Like most threads of this nature, if you dare to post any hint of a contrary opinion the standard response is, 'you're a gammon'.

A bit of knowledge, empathy and good will will probably go a lot further than a 'soz, mate'.

 

[Guinness Boy]

No, it's the hind leg of pork after it's been cured.

I hope this helps.

Someone ought to tell [MENTION=35289]Baker lite[/MENTION]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[nickjhs]

Personally I couldn't give a damn about offending someones religious beliefs, however forcing someone to take part in a ritual that will offend is a different matter. From what I can see the alcohol was deliberately poured on him and what choice does he have but to laugh it off.

 

[Whitechapel]

Being sprayed with beer, and drinking it, are two different things.

One may get you intoxicated, the other won't.

Eating meat isn’t the same as having meat touching you, but I doubt there are many vegetarians who’d thank you for hurling raw meat at them.

 

[Chicken Run]

Is gammon?

No, definitely not, but you didn’t answer my question?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Curious Orange]

Eating meat isn’t the same as having meat touching you, but I doubt there are many vegetarians who’d thank you for hurling raw meat at them.

I doubt anybody would like having raw meat hurled at them in all fairness.

As ever the context of any given situation can be far more nuanced than black and white statements can ever be. Not all Muslims abstain from drinking, not all vegetarians refuse to cook meat, not all Palace fans are spotty teenaged thickos... etc, etc.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Well, this makes a change, I wonder which regular from the Bear Pit started this thread ?

 

[A1X]

I love threads like this where someone from a culture has said they aren't comfortable with something that has happened and loads of people who aren't part of that culture rock up to tell them they're wrong to think that.

 

[Curious Orange]

Well, this makes a change, I wonder which regular from the Bear Pitstarted this thread ?

View attachment 128911

Watch it, you'll have the animal welfare mob after you sharing disgusting images like that!

 

[schmunk]

not all Palace fans are spotty teenaged thickos...

That's correct - they welcome spotty thickos of all ages.

 

[rippleman]

IIRC when England won the World Cup and the champagne came out, Adil Rashid and Moeen Ali socially distanced themselves from the spraying about party. Not sure anybody really noticed or cared tbh. As a minority within the squad they removed themselves from the situation presumably recognising that was the right thing to do rather than spitting the dummy and demanding that the champagne celebration shouldn't have happened.

Of course, non-alcoholic champagne should be used for the celebrations so no players have to remove themselves. Plenty of opportunity to hit the hard stuff back in the dressing room.

In this situation though, deliberately pouring alcohol over the head of a muslim player was daft, irresponsible and disrespectful.

 

[zefarelly]

IIRC when England won the World Cup and the champagne came out, Adil Rashid and Moeen Ali socially distanced themselves from the spraying about party. Not sure anybody really noticed or cared tbh. As a minority within the squad they removed themselves from the situation presumably recognising that was the right thing to do rather than spitting the dummy and demanding that the champagne celebration shouldn't have happened.

Of course, non-alcoholic champagne should be used for the celebrations so no players have to remove themselves. Plenty of opportunity to hit the hard stuff back in the dressing room.

In this situation though, deliberately pouring alcohol over the head of a muslim player was daft, irresponsible and disrespectful.

If they'd used Fosters it would have been ok I guess, cheaper than AF Champers as well.

 

[ConfusedGloryHunter]

It is obviously one or two extremely excited young men who didn't know or forgot that pouring alcohol on a particular team mate could cause offence. An unfortunate faux pas that, since they are a sports team with an overseas market of many millions of Muslims, needs to be dealt with publicly to pacify the bigots or whatever Muslim versions of Gammons are called. Frankly a quick little diversity talk is far better than online persecution by enraged trolls and is the best thing to protect the careers and mental health of all those involved including the "victim".

 

[Killer Whale]

Instead, in a perfectly modern and woke response the club embark on a diversity training program and posters here can't wait to jump on the 'I'm not a racist and respect other peoples religions and cultures' bandwagon like it somehow scores them some lifestyle brownie points. Like most threads of this nature, if you dare to post any hint of a contrary opinion the standard response is, 'you're a gammon'.

This is always the great irony of performative wokeness.

Its denizens are desperately anxious to virtue signal their tolerance of other cultures faiths and beliefs, and hatred of bigotry. And the technique they constantly use is to be THEMSELVES unutterably ageist and bigoted towards middle aged and elderly white people.

Look at me, how morally virtuous I am for telling you you aren't entitled to express a differing opinion!

 

[Killer Whale]

There's nothing I like more in the evening than an unnecessarily scholarly lecture in race relations from a Yorkshireman,

Islam is eminently worthy of study, and I must admit I find it very interesting. Especially its early history. The manner in which it replaced Christianity in its heartland of the Middle East is staggering. Both in its speed and permanence, it basically wiped it off the map. There was a reason for this, and it lies in the theology.

It amazes me that most non Muslims know so little about it. But the Muslim population doubled between the 2001 and 2011 censuses. We await the results of the 2021 one, obviously, but every sign is that this exponential growth has been maintained from a much larger base. No-one disputes that it is going to be more and more important in our national life going forward, surely?

The fact that we as a culture we are so terrified of causing offence to it, as this non story shows, is very telling.

Take a look at the demographic projections for this country. Pew have done some good work on it. By 2050 (as far ahead as 1990 is back) the UK will have been transformed. Everyone will be studying Islam soon, I am just ahead of the curve.