BA Strikes

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

i'm also off to budapest for nye but not sure if affected. on the confirmation it says that malev air is flying us over on belhalf of ba. am i right in thinking my trip away is dead and burried?!

I hope you're lucky! I do know Malev are a 'partner' airline with BA, so you could be OK.

When are you flying and from where? (We were BA from Heathrow on the 29th) They (Malev) do fly from Gatwick so you could be lucky.

We originally tried to go on the Malev Flight - but the timings didn't work, and then we were told that the Malev flight had been withdrawn anyway, and only the BA was available.

According to the Malev website they do have flights from Gatwick.

Good Luck!

 

[Benny Seagull]

I hope you're lucky! I do know Malev are a 'partner' airline with BA, so you could be OK.

When are you flying and from where? (We were BA from Heathrow on the 29th) They (Malev) do fly from Gatwick so you could be lucky.

We originally tried to go on the Malev Flight - but the timings didn't work, and then we were told that the Malev flight had been withdrawn anyway, and only the BA was available.

According to the Malev website they do have flights from Gatwick.

Good Luck!

yeah it's from gatwick early new year's eve and i am very excited about going. guess we'll just wait and see.

 

[goldstone]

The majority of BA cabin staff are not worried about the reduction of numbers on board. They are realistic that this probably has to happen and are quite prepared to work a bit harder during flights.

The main problem is that BA plan to bring in new crew on lower salaries and offer them lower allowances and a very large part of BA crew salaries are made up from allowances.

The crew on the present package are naturally concerned that most of the best flights (those currently paying the highest allowances) would be allocated to the new crew to save BA money, and their salaries would as a result be severely depleted.

A reasonable concern. But does it justify striking three days before Xmas? No!!

 

[Perry Milkins]

. I can put on a good MINCE and a camp accent if I need to.

What do you mean 'put on'?

 

[Easy 10]

What do you mean 'put on'?

You got me there, sweetcheeks.

*busted*

 

[Perry Milkins]

You got me there, sweetcheeks.

*busted*

I thought so..

*McFly*

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

The majority of BA cabin staff are not worried about the reduction of numbers on board. They are realistic that this probably has to happen and are quite prepared to work a bit harder during flights.

The main problem is that BA plan to bring in new crew on lower salaries and offer them lower allowances and a very large part of BA crew salaries are made up from allowances.

The crew on the present package are naturally concerned that most of the best flights (those currently paying the highest allowances) would be allocated to the new crew to save BA money, and their salaries would as a result be severely depleted.

A reasonable concern. But does it justify striking three days before Xmas? No!!

OK, most sensible post so far there. I get it now and can see why they felt they have no choice but to strike. Won't help matters though will it.

If I was them I would be thinking short term as well, if you thought that your salary was going to be cut by 30% because of sharp practices from the board then I suspect you would be pissed off too but somewhere in their minds they will know this is going to damage them as much as the passengers and Willy Walsh.

I do have a bit more sympathy for them than I did this morning

Thanks Goldstone.

 

[Boroseagull]

We'll get our money back on the flights, but how does it work with Hotels that were booked direct?

Hopefully your holiday insurance policy will cover it.

 

[Bluejuice]

Hate to tell you this but for most of the eighties and the part of the nineties they were around it was actually Dan Air that was the second biggest airline. Next came Britania whilst BCal and Air Europe were 4th and 5th.

BCal went under because they paid too much for too little, Air Europe when bust because they tried to run before they could barely walk. As a Charter Airline they did okay but it was the collapse of Intasun and the other ILG Tour Operators along with their abortive attempt to compete with BA as a scheduled carrier that put them out of business.

As a matter of fact Dan Air appointed a new MD just before Air Europe went under and it was his bright idea to try to take over the routes that the demise of Air Europe left. This was equally unsuccessful and left Dan Air being sold off to British Airways for One Penny and they in turn, made most of the staff redundant and only kept the newer Boeing 737s from the Dan Air fleet. The remainder were mainly scrapped.

Whilst I'd agree with your assessment of their failings I'm still fairly confident that in terms of passengers and routes served Air Europe were second only to British Airways at the time of their collapse. Also I'd say their performance as a charter carrier was far better than OK. Their rate of growth was phenomenal at that time and hence their biting off more than they could chew with aggressive expansion tactics.

Anyway, back to BA, what I'm still struggling with is how the union vote could be so massively in favour of action. Clearly the debate here is about the more senior, well paid cabin crew having to do more work on long haul flights whereas the younger, more recent starters only have to face the two year pay freeze as any sort of imposition, hardly out of place with the rest of the industry and its sufferings. Or for that matter, hardly out of place with the economy as a whole, it isn't as if many people can expect handsome pay rises in the near future unless you're some banker - who seem to be somehow above the realms of realism.

Is it that Unite is made up of predominantly senior staff who have enjoyed year on year above inflation pay increases who all of a sudden don't want to be "insulted" by being expected to muck in with their colleagues?

AND am I not right in thinking that there have been NO compulsory redundancies as yet, only voluntary? So this argument about sticking up for colleagues who are going to lose their jobs stinks too.

What Easy said about the long haul staff getting put up when in far away exotic locations is all true, in direct comparison to the way rival airline staff have very little "turn around" time when far away from home.

The (younger) cabin crew I've heard from say they will not be striking as they have no intention of jeopardising their fairly decent jobs simply to back up the cause of some snooty overpaid senior flight attendants. Which begs the question, who make up Union's membership exactly?

Let's be honest, the treasury doesn't have anywhere near the sort of money it would take to sort this out after bailing out the banking industry so how can this possibly go well without the union backing down? It's a massive gamble if you ask me and it could potentially end in a seriously embarrassing collapse of our country's once proud national flag carrier.

In years gone by I bet the government wouldn't hesitate to step in and assist such an important and well recognised/respected British institution, but not now. They just can't do it. And where are BA supposed to come up with the extra money from? They just can't.

Who's in charge of this Unite union? Could it be they are twisting and bullshitting the facts to their members. Whoever it is has some serious questions to answer and I'd be very keen to have these supposed strike votes looked into. 94% of the 80% turnout in favour?? Can that many people really be so blind as to the damage they are causing to a national institution?

Bad management at BA certainly has a lot to answer for but this is NOT the way to solve inconsistencies in pay and working conditions right now.

This could end in a right mess

 

[Westdene Seagull]

They're a bunch of selfish tossers !!!!

I know the dispute isn't directly about salaries but they should count themselves lucky - they're the best paid in the industry :

AVERAGE CABIN CREW PAY
British Airways: £29,000
Easyjet: £20,200
BMI: £18,400
Monarch: £17,500
Virgin Atlantic: £14,400

The issue that really riles me is the BA proposal for "promotion based on merit" - what the f*** is it based on now then - best mince ? Of course it should bloody well be on merit !!!!

 

[Boroseagull]

Returning from South America last month with KLM & talking to the very efficient cabin crew it was said in conversation that they use 13 cabin staff on long haul. If they can do it, and passengers did not suffer, why can't BA?

 

[Easy 10]

Because they're not used to it, so its an "imposition".
(the word used by Unite).

 

[Raphael Meade]

worst cabin crew going.. out of the hundreds of flights i've taken this year, they're continually the rudest and most unhelpful of the lot. hope they go bust if this is what they wanna do to people over xmas...

strike has screwed travel plans for the hogmany! good job i'm taking the tourbus and not flying.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

So BA are going to Court, saying that UNITE sent out Ballot papers to employees that have already left.

There would have been no change to the vote, as 90%+ voted for a strike, but I suppose there's a bit of hope there.....

 

[Bluejuice]

But I don't understand who this 94% was. From what I can tell a lot of the more junior members of cabin crew are actually opposed to the strike and are jus thankful to have their BA jobs.

I would really like to know who make up the BA employees that Unite represents. Do young people just not get involved in unions these days? Is it too expensive for those on the lower end of the pay spectrum? WHY such a high percentage when the world and its brother can't see the justification in this?

I'm really sceptical that we aren't being made aware of all the facts here. Somebody somewhere is telling porkies

 

[beorhthelm]

But I don't understand who this 94% was. From what I can tell a lot of the more junior members of cabin crew are actually opposed to the strike and are just thankful to have their BA jobs.

wheres the info on the junior members from? i it is a very well attended ballot, 80 or 90% i think, so an overwhelming majority. in contrast to the usuall action we get which can be blamed squarly on the union leaders and their died hards, with paltry turnouts.

commentators are seriously suggesting BA might not survive this, then where will their jobs and pay go? banking on a bail out from the gov?

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

This strike has been widely mooted for months. I clearly remember reading about it in the Summer. Would have thought anybody who was thinking of booking BA might have considered giving them a wide berth from then on in and booked with the airlines that don't go on strike. But easy to be wise after the event eh?

 

[beorhthelm]

btw, just on telly, theres you tube footage of the vote declaration. you can hear the number votes is around 10k. whats the total number of cabin staff?

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

btw, just on telly, theres you tube footage of the vote declaration. you can hear the number votes is around 10k. whats the total number of cabin staff?

about 12,500

 

[thedonkeycentrehalf]

I flew with Gill Air from Manchester to Newcastle many years ago - a Shorts Bros plane that held about 20, but there were about 6 on the flight. Just before takeoff the stewardess asked us all what we'd like to drink. I said 'Gin & Tonic' so after takeoff she comes along with her trolley and deposits the best part of a litre bottle of Gordons, 2 tins of Schweppes and a glass with lots of ice and a slice. 'Help yourself, I'll be back in a minute' she says and goes off to serve the others. 30 mins later she comes back to relieve me of less than half a bottle of Gin and the other empties. I don't remember anything else about the flight and I was really glad I wasn't driving home. Not surprising they went bust I suppose.

Gill Air were wonderful with very personal service - they took over the Gatwick to Newcastle route when Dan Air went bust. Those Shorts planes were not the most comfortable with fixed seats and didn't get too high above the clouds so could get a bit bumpy. The planes had the seats taken out at night and the planes were used for shipping post around.