Argh! - Any US Immigration Experts Here?

[sam86]

Me and the Mrs have booked to go to Vegas in January for her 30th birthday. Exciting times. However, when booking I completely forgot an incident that happened over a decade ago.

When I was 14, I went to Canada with my family, and visited Niagara Falls, whilst there we tried to visit the States falls, but as we did not have American dollars we got denied entry at the border crossing, had our eyes scanned and passports added to their systems. I'm now reading if you've ever been denied entry into the states, you need to apply for a Visa, which costs £100, and can only be obtained via a face to face interview at the U.S. embassy in London.

All sounds rather ridiculous for something that happened when I was 14 and had no real control over.

I've found out my brother, who also went to Niagara Falls, has recently gone to San Diego. Upon getting there the system flagged his passport as having trouble. He was interviewed for over an hour, and eventually let in. The interviewer explained if he'd flown into a bigger airport, they may not have took the time to research the incident, and turned him away immediately. However, I'm not sure that is true? They'd surely discuss the situation with every individual denied entry?

He would have been 17 at the time, so perhaps not classed as a minor, where as I would have been. Perhaps that makes a difference?

So, do I pay circa £150 to get to London, have a face to face meeting, and get a Visa, or do I just go for it? If interviewed my knowledge of the event is as much as I have put into this thread.

I've also asked this on forums specific to U.S Immigration, but I can't help but ask NSC, if even just for the few hilarious responses I'm expecting.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

All you need is an ESTA surely? Unless youve been to a "training" camp for men in Pakistan recently?

 

[sam86]

All you need is an ESTA surely? Unless youve been to a "training" camp for men in Pakistan recently?

My brother had an ESTA, and apparently that wasn't enough (although did eventually get in).

It suggests if you've ever been deported, denied entry, have a criminal record, etc. you need a Visa. An ESTA is not enough.

I can't help but think the Visa application is for cases a bit more severe than mine though!

 

[Goldstone1976]

All you need is an ESTA surely? Unless youve been to a "training" camp for men in Pakistan recently?

Nope, not if he's been denied entrance in the past.

Speaking from long experience of the US Immigration office (an L1A and then green card), I wouldn't risk just turning up. Individual officers can and do just turn away people, sometimes without even an interview. Of all the main international airports, Vegas is perhaps the most lax in my experience, but it's a hell of a long way to go to risk just being put on the next plane home (at full fare chargeable to you).

If you decide to go the ESTA route, you will be lying on the form (there's a question that asks if you've ever been denied entrance, and if so, the ESTA can't be used). Technically, the immigration officer could have you arrested for a Federal offence if s/he catches you.

Nope - go to Grosvenor square, pay the money, get the visa and ask them to clear your passport off the blacklist so that the next time you go, you can use ESTA. Allow at least 4 hours at the embassy.

Good luck...!

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

My brother had an ESTA, and apparently that wasn't enough (although did eventually get in).

It suggests if you've ever been deported, denied entry, have a criminal record, etc. you need a Visa. An ESTA is not enough.

I can't help but think the Visa application is for cases a bit more severe than mine though!

In that case go and clear it up with the Embassy.

 

[ozseagull]

Nope, not if he's been denied entrance in the past.

Speaking from long experience of the US Immigration office (an L1A and then green card), I wouldn't risk just turning up. Individual officers can and do just turn away people, sometimes without even an interview. Of all the main international airports, Vegas is perhaps the most lax in my experience, but it's a hell of a long way to go to risk just being put on the next plane home (at full fare chargeable to you).

If you decide to go the ESTA route, you will be lying on the form (there's a question that asks if you've ever been denied entrance, and if so, the ESTA can't be used). Technically, the immigration officer could have you arrested for a Federal offence if s/he catches you.

Nope - go to Grosvenor square, pay the money, get the visa and ask them to clear your passport off the blacklist so that the next time you go, you can use ESTA. Allow at least 4 hours at the embassy.

Good luck...!

I agree with this. It sounds as though this is a special birthday holiday. Risking it would not go down well with your other half surely?

The US immigration system is far stricter than ours and individual officers personalities vary hugely.

As also mentioned you would be lying on the ESTA which isnt advisable. I would pay the money rather than risk being sent home (at your own expense).

Also...... get your parents to pay for the trip to London and the Visa. It was their fault after all!!!

 

[MJsGhost]

Nope, not if he's been denied entrance in the past.

Speaking from long experience of the US Immigration office (an L1A and then green card), I wouldn't risk just turning up. Individual officers can and do just turn away people, sometimes without even an interview. Of all the main international airports, Vegas is perhaps the most lax in my experience, but it's a hell of a long way to go to risk just being put on the next plane home (at full fare chargeable to you).

If you decide to go the ESTA route, you will be lying on the form (there's a question that asks if you've ever been denied entrance, and if so, the ESTA can't be used). Technically, the immigration officer could have you arrested for a Federal offence if s/he catches you.

Nope - go to Grosvenor square, pay the money, get the visa and ask them to clear your passport off the blacklist so that the next time you go, you can use ESTA. Allow at least 4 hours at the embassy.

Good luck...!

THIS

But then stick £150 on red when you arrive so you can make back the cost of your London trip.

Easy!

 

[Goldstone1976]

You got denied entry for not have American Dollars!?
What sort of country do they run over there. That is ridiculous.

Much of US immigration has gone way OTT since 9/11. Still, it's their country and their rules. There's really only three options: don't go; try the ESTA route and risk being sent home or imprisoned; play by their rules.

I used to get frustrated dealing with "Homeland Security" through my various dealings with them. Never did any good. The one guy I worked with who made the mistake of taking the piss out them got a permanent ban from the US (and thus lost his job, since travel to the US was mandatory for him).

 

[Seagull over Canaryland]

Do not give US Immigration any reason to deny you entry because they will seriously mess you around.

In my experience there is generally no problem at all but a couple of years ago I witnessed a UK family with young children getting the full treatment at US immigration at Orlando airport. Just arrived off a long flight from the UK and the passengers had already been kept waiting for over an hour within sight of the immigration desks in very humid conditions. There was some sort of discrepancy with the family's paperwork and a rather unpleasant scene then unfolded in front of hundreds of very tired passengers. The family did not kick up a fuss although they looked fed up plus were being made an example of in front of hundreds of passengers. Yet it all seemed as if there was some innocent error in their paperwork but clearly needed to be resolved. Eventually a senior official arrived and the family was led away behind closed doors but with their children now very distressed.

Most of the US Immigration staff were polite but a handful were extremely unpleasant and overbearing when many Brits in the queues starting heckling them and filming the situation on their mobiles it started to descend into a nasty incident with many punters shouting 'we don't want to holiday here now, let us go home'. In response some US Immigration staff said some very stupid things about how Brits are not welcome. When many sensible punters including some genteel Grandmotherly types asked if the air conditioning could be turned on one official said 'no chance, if you can't behave then tough sh*t, we're in charge here'. That prompted another volley of comments. It felt like we entering some sort of banana republic. fortunately there must have been a shift change because all of a sudden a new group of officials arrived and the queue was processed a heck of a lot faster.

I'm sure they have to put up with several numpty UK tourists arriving with incomplete paperwork each day but allowing things to escalate so needlessly and then aggravating the situation was incompetent. I know they have to uphold 'homeland' security and have very strict rules within the immigration halls but there was a complete lack of empathy with hundreds of punters coming as tourists to probably the biggest family holiday destination in the World. It was as if the officials had been given a gun and a badge and then had their brains removed and trained in how to cause confrontation rather than diffuse it. I know the UK Border control staff can seem humourless (not sure I'd want to do their job) but at least you never get repeatedly abused.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

Do not give US Immigration any reason to deny you entry because they will seriously mess you around.

In my experience there is generally no problem at all but a couple of years ago I witnessed a UK family with young children getting the full treatment at US immigration at Orlando airport. Just arrived off a long flight from the UK and the passengers had already been kept waiting for over an hour within sight of the immigration desks in very humid conditions. There was some sort of discrepancy with the family's paperwork and a rather unpleasant scene then unfolded in front of hundreds of very tired passengers. The family did not kick up a fuss although they looked fed up plus were being made an example of in front of hundreds of passengers. Yet it all seemed as if there was some innocent error in their paperwork but clearly needed to be resolved. Eventually a senior official arrived and the family was led away behind closed doors but with their children now very distressed.

Most of the US Immigration staff were polite but a handful were extremely unpleasant and overbearing when many Brits in the queues starting heckling them and filming the situation on their mobiles it started to descend into a nasty incident with many punters shouting 'we don't want to holiday here now, let us go home'. In response some US Immigration staff said some very stupid things about how Brits are not welcome. When many sensible punters including some genteel Grandmotherly types asked if the air conditioning could be turned on one official said 'no chance, if you can't behave then tough sh*t, we're in charge here'. That prompted another volley of comments. It felt like we entering some sort of banana republic. fortunately there must have been a shift change because all of a sudden a new group of officials arrived and the queue was processed a heck of a lot faster.

I'm sure they have to put up with several numpty UK tourists arriving with incomplete paperwork each day but allowing things to escalate so needlessly and then aggravating the situation was incompetent. I know they have to uphold 'homeland' security and have very strict rules within the immigration halls but there was a complete lack of empathy with hundreds of punters coming as tourists to probably the biggest family holiday destination in the World. It was as if the officials had been given a gun and a badge and then had their brains removed and trained in how to cause confrontation rather than diffuse it. I know the UK Border control staff can seem humourless (not sure I'd want to do their job) but at least you never get repeatedly abused.

I did a lot of travelling in the US for my old job, they were, without doubt, the most polite airport staff ive ever come accross EXCEPT at the major international hubs like Newark and JFK and Miami where they were utter knobs. All the internal connections were really smooth and well mannered.

 

[JTR938]

Visited the states 3 times this year and had 3 very differant experiances!
1- New York (Newark), Absolutely horrendous queues! about two and half hours to be seen only to experiance a full on interigation as to why we were there etc.. After 10mins or so we were waved through.
2- Houston, better queues but very patronising and rude staff. probaly the rudest I've ever experianced! sarcasm beyond belif.
3- Vegas (my 30th, you will love it if never been before), Fantastic staff, very freindly and could'nt do enough for us!

I would definatly take the advice of the others and pop up to London. To far to go to be dissapointed especialy with whats there! No doubt entering on a VISA will lead to a few questions but is a very small price to pay in the grand scheme of things.

 

[sam86]

I've managed to speak to my very busy brother, who has informed me he actually wrote to the U.S Border Agency before traveling, and they responded saying he'd be alright with just an ESTA. One would assume this letter helped with getting through in the end. One quick thing he said before having to shoot off is that we weren't actually listed as 'denied entry'. He had to go, so I don't know what we were classed as. I'll hopefully speak to him again later.

 

[Bozza]

Not worth the risk at all. They don't **** around.

 

[cloud]

Will the US Embassy have gone into shutdown yet? and indeed will the USA still be running a civilised society when you get there.

I'm not sure I'd want to risk it, you may find your insurance won't cover you if there are any problems.

Edit - looks like they are already closing down certain tourist attractions
http://london.usembassy.gov/ukpapress139.html

 

[Seagull over Canaryland]

I did a lot of travelling in the US for my old job, they were, without doubt, the most polite airport staff ive ever come accross EXCEPT at the major international hubs like Newark and JFK and Miami where they were utter knobs. All the internal connections were really smooth and well mannered.

I totally agree - internal flight connections in the US are generally effortless.

But why do so many UK travellers wait until they are called forward before they fumble through their bags for a passport or fail to have a completed immigration card etc......? I guess it mainly applies to holidaymakers rather than business travellers and that's why it must test the patience of officials at places like Orlando. Surely if you want to enjoy your onward journey without delay just take a second or two to check your papers are ready and shouldn't be a problem.

 

[Pinkie Brown]

Seeing as you were 14 at the time, it would have been your parents, or whoever you were travelling with at the time that was the cause for refused entry. As a minor, your role in the incident was incidental, so should't really effect your right of entry. Does Grosvenor Square have a helpline or an email address for anomalies such as yours?

Also: There is such a thing as a 'technical refusal' which shouldn't affect any future attempt to enter the US. Its when the Visa or other anomaly isn't quite in order rather than the fact, they simply don't like you. Whether your earlier refusal was classed as 'technical'. I'm not sure?

The fact remains, US immigration law and the way it is applied is extremely inconsistent, contradictory and loaded with grey area's, depending on location. In fairness, my last two visits to the US have been a breeze when dealing with Immigration officers. The queuing was ages and I missed my connecting flights, but it literally took a couple of minutes once I made the booth.

On other occasions, particularly when crossing by road at some remote rural location in British Columbia/Idaho/Washington State, its been a pain in the arse. *Some* officers aren't too smart and you are dealing with small town mentality or those who have the hump because they have been posted to some remote outpost they don't want to be. (The view relayed to me by a Canadian RMP). Show them a UK passport, they scratch their heads, get out the manual as to procedure and if all goes well, you could be on your way in half hour or so after various checks etc etc. If they find an anomaly, as they did with me on one occasion, prepare for an extended grilling. In the days of the long green form I-94, the records were showing me as having not left the US six months earlier despite me having proof to the contrary which they eventually accepted.

My advice: Get some advice and don't chance it. You could well be fine. You may not. All depends if you get an officer with sense or a pleb. As I mentioned, the application of immigration regulations is varied. Grosvenor Square is a pain in the arse, but its best get the official position.

 

[Jim Van Winkle]

Nope, not if he's been denied entrance in the past.

Speaking from long experience of the US Immigration office (an L1A and then green card), I wouldn't risk just turning up. Individual officers can and do just turn away people, sometimes without even an interview. Of all the main international airports, Vegas is perhaps the most lax in my experience, but it's a hell of a long way to go to risk just being put on the next plane home (at full fare chargeable to you).

If you decide to go the ESTA route, you will be lying on the form (there's a question that asks if you've ever been denied entrance, and if so, the ESTA can't be used). Technically, the immigration officer could have you arrested for a Federal offence if s/he catches you.

Nope - go to Grosvenor square, pay the money, get the visa and ask them to clear your passport off the blacklist so that the next time you go, you can use ESTA. Allow at least 4 hours at the embassy.

Good luck...!

Not worth the risk at all. They don't **** around.

This and that. When I went to get my Green Card it was like the beginning of Scarface. Good luck.

 

[martyn20]

Don't ever give the US border 'a go', the Embassy route while it does cost is pretty straight forward, just do your research and have all the documentation you need and it will be fine. Any helpline will not give you a 100% answer either way and they will not be with you in the arrivals lounge.
If you get a Visa you get very good treatment in the UK and US though, you tend to feel like a VIP, fast and easy.
The US government shut down should be over tonight so stuff will begin to open up very quickly.

 

[johnhammond]

Not worth giving it a go - I've noticed they've been a lot stricter in the past few months (since everything in Boston), and whereas I would maybe see one person in a line get called aside for extra questioning, the 2 times since April it's been more like 1 in 6. You don't want to give them the option of pulling you aside if you can avoid it.

And as for the interview, try and get an appointment as early in the day as possible. They always run late, so it's good to get in before they do that. This past time I was in at 9 and out before 10. The first time I got there just before lunch and was there until after 5 I think.

 

[Vegas Seagull]

Vegas has gone downhill lately dropping room rates to fill expanding room capacity to try and offset a falling demand from a struggling economy and filling itself up with chavs. Do as some of the hotel owners are, go to booming Macau instead