Are there any drug cheats in football?

[Kinky Gerbil]

This is so naive. Footballers are bigger, faster and stronger than they have ever been. The game is played at a higher pace than it has ever been. Top footballers play upwards of 60 games a year, yet you think that something that allows you to run more, and recover faster would make no difference? Footballers need a high degree of natural talent to make it, of course they do. Therefore, do you think the best cyclists and athletes in the world were just talent-less bums who started taking EPO then could win all the races because of that? Do you think Lance Armstrong was just some fat kid from Texas who stumbled across a guy selling blood boosters, bought a load then became the best cyclist in an era of cheats?

Read this http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2013/jan/29/operation-puerto-doctor-footballers-fuentes and this http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/10027763/Operation-Puerto-judge-sparks-outrage-by-ordering-destruction-of-blood-bags.html. Now think about the high energy pressing game favoured by Barcelona and the Spanish National Team. It isn't conclusive proof but it is mighty suspicious.

I do think you need to take in consideration the newish view on the footballing diet on the speed of the game and the fitness levels.

It was not that long ago that players ate and drank what they wanted.

how often do we hear players are suffering from playing to much?

over the Christmas period you see a dramatic drop in the standards of games by the third game.

 

[Pantani]

Being faster, Stronger and being fitter is still not going to enable you to be a top top player or have such an affect on players as it does in athletics. drugs can not install the mental strength you need to be a top footballer.


I am not saying there is not drugs in Football, however it is not an athletic sport that you push yourself to the absolute limit like in cycling for example- you have to be fit - yes. but If Chris O Grady was taking steroids he would not be Ronaldo.

No he obviously wouldn't. But we both know that. Chris O'Grady taking PEDs might be a bit quicker though and more able to get in behind, adding another aspect to his game. So rather than being a League One hold up man, he may be actually good enough for a Championship side, say as good as David McGoldrick, or Clayton Donaldson.

You cannot completely deny the influence of physicality in modern football. Is Yaya Toure definitively a more skillful player than say Michael Carrick? I would say not. Toure is definitely bigger, stronger and faster though, one earns north of £250,000 a week, the other doesn't.

 

[Pantani]

I do think you need to take in consideration the newish view on the footballing diet on the speed of the game and the fitness levels.

It was not that long ago that players ate and drank what they wanted.

how often do we hear players are suffering from playing to much?

over the Christmas period you see a dramatic drop in the standards of games by the third game.

I am not saying that every footballer is on drugs. Do not get me wrong here. Diet and training methods have definitely improved, that does help to explain the faster pace of modern football. However it does not remove the fact that the modern player is measured on his physical ability, as well as his skill levels. The costs of many PEDs are so low it would be astounding if more footballers than have currently been busted are not cheating in this manner. If a low level pro cyclist can afford EPO, a lower league footballer definitely can. Knowing all this can you honestly believe that there has been only one player in the English leagues, ever, who has taken performance enhancing drugs?

 

[beorhthelm]

is there testing in Football? yes. has it caught people? yes. have they caught many? no. so we could conclude that testing occurs, testing has been shown to be effective, but with such a poor discovery rate, there is not a drugs problem in football.

 

[Tricky Dicky]

Almost certainly. I would think a minority of those cheats will be taking "performance enhancing" stuff, but most of those guilty, I would think, would be "recreational". Just a guess.

 

[Pantani]

is there testing in Football? yes. has it caught people? yes. have they caught many? no. so we could conclude that testing occurs, testing has been shown to be effective, but with such a poor discovery rate, there is not a drugs problem in football.

I suppose you could conclude that, if you believe drug testing to be a binary concept.

There were 2,286 drug tests in English football last season (from FA website) for 5,000 ish professional players (my estimate, cannot find actual figures). Testing? Yes, but an adequate amount of testing to catch cheats out? Clearly not.

Cycling had over 20,000 drug test last season for 1,300 professionals.

Athletics, which has just been proved to be extremely dirty, yet they test far far more than football too.

Even Baseball, spiritual home of steroid abuse, tests more than English football.

 

[Megazone]

No drug can improve a players touch.

 

[beorhthelm]

I suppose you could conclude that, if you believe drug testing to be a binary concept.

There were 2,286 drug tests in English football last season (from FA website) for 5,000 ish professional players (my estimate, cannot find actual figures). Testing? Yes, but an adequate amount of testing to catch cheats out? Clearly not.

why "clearly not"? because you want there to be more positives? cycling and athletics have had more testing because they are known to be dirty, if they found more reason to test footballers i would expect the testing incidence to go up. as it is, less than a handful of positives in a decade, mostly for recreational, when as you say there are thousands of test, seems more testing would be pointless.

 

[Stat Brother]

why "clearly not"? because you want there to be more positives? cycling and athletics have had more testing because they are known to be dirty, if they found more reason to test footballers i would expect the testing incidence to go up. as it is, less than a handful of positives in a decade, mostly for recreational, when as you say there are thousands of test, seems more testing would be pointless.

You also have to take into account the nature of the tests.

Anyone with access to or using PED's such as EPO, will also have access to masking drugs that will clear the athlete through a urine test.
I'd imagine they are even sold as a 'package' or BOGOF!

If ALL those 2,286 tests were blood tests, then I will concede and step down from my "one day this is gonna blow up" stance.
If ALL those tests or the vast majority are urine tests, then they are merely PR exercises, designed to look good on paper, but never spoil the beautiful game.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

If I were a drugs tester the first place I would start would be rugby. When that went professional body-shapes changed - and look at them now. And able to run fast and for long periods. Of course you can get that from the gym and diet, but what about the lazy-arses and those who like to buck the system (a scrum is a playground for those who are trying to pull a fast one in front of the authorities).

And then I would look at footballers - there are a lot of ripped torsos and big muscular frames - which again can come from the gym and diet - but the same doubts apply.

Until a rigorous testing policy is enforced we will not know for sure - but it would be mad to think there is no problem. Were I on the fringes of a first team contract and I was offered something by my experienced agent to help me - it would be a tough call.

Anyway weren't some of the samples found at that Spanish doctor's lab suspiciously football related.

 

[knocky1]

No drug can improve a players touch.

Drop some acid, or any sensory perceptive drug, maybe even a spliff and invite round the England women's football team and you may be surprised.

 

[Pantani]

why "clearly not"? because you want there to be more positives? cycling and athletics have had more testing because they are known to be dirty, if they found more reason to test footballers i would expect the testing incidence to go up. as it is, less than a handful of positives in a decade, mostly for recreational, when as you say there are thousands of test, seems more testing would be pointless.

And why are those sports 'known to be dirty'? They were tested more than football is right now. The police got involved in France and Italy. Same in Spain, yet strangely when the evidence pointed towards footballers (and tennis players) the investigation stopped at cyclists and cycling. Read up about Operation Puerto, the links are further back in this thread. If you still believe that there has only been one person tempted, look at what the testing regimes are in cycling, athletics and swimming. All competitors in those sports have biological passports and are tested several times a year, football only tests once every two years on average (and this is if you assume that the FA only tests league players).

I would love football to be squeaky clean, I really would. I do not want another sport I love to go through what cycling has. Until the testing in football gets somewhere close to cycling, swimming and athletics (Russia excepted) then we can not logically believe that football is a fully clean sport.

 

[Pantani]

If I were a drugs tester the first place I would start would be rugby. When that went professional body-shapes changed - and look at them now. And able to run fast and for long periods. Of course you can get that from the gym and diet, but what about the lazy-arses and those who like to buck the system (a scrum is a playground for those who are trying to pull a fast one in front of the authorities).

Numbers banned from sports in the UK for drug offences:

28 Rugby Players
6 Boxers
2 Athletes
2 Cyclists
2 Ice Hocker players
2 Weightlifters
1 Bobsleigher (ist)?
1 Dartist
1 Footballer
1 Wrestler

It does appear that Rugby has a huge problem right now. I believe there are a few recent newspaper articles out there on this, thus far no one has been busted at the top level, just those lower down. Maybe the guys at the bottom just don't know what they are doing...

 

[jameswestport]

If I were a drugs tester the first place I would start would be rugby. When that went professional body-shapes changed - and look at them now. And able to run fast and for long periods. Of course you can get that from the gym and diet, but what about the lazy-arses and those who like to buck the system (a scrum is a playground for those who are trying to pull a fast one in front of the authorities).

And then I would look at footballers - there are a lot of ripped torsos and big muscular frames - which again can come from the gym and diet - but the same doubts apply.

Until a rigorous testing policy is enforced we will not know for sure - but it would be mad to think there is no problem. Were I on the fringes of a first team contract and I was offered something by my experienced agent to help me - it would be a tough call.

Anyway weren't some of the samples found at that Spanish doctor's lab suspiciously football related.

I doubt any footballers could get away with being that fat for fitness purposes.

 

[Pantani]

You also have to take into account the nature of the tests.

Anyone with access to or using PED's such as EPO, will also have access to masking drugs that will clear the athlete through a urine test.
I'd imagine they are even sold as a 'package' or BOGOF!

If ALL those 2,286 tests were blood tests, then I will concede and step down from my "one day this is gonna blow up" stance.
If ALL those tests or the vast majority are urine tests, then they are merely PR exercises, designed to look good on paper, but never spoil the beautiful game.

Just had a look at the latest FA document on drugs test, there is no mention of blood tests anywhere...

 

[Stat Brother]

If an athlete fails a urine test they are either so stupid they need to be removed from the gene pool or it's a cry for help!

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

Arsene Wenger is closer to it that any of us and he says there is a problem. And he has called for blood testing.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

here is the link.

 

[Hampster Gull]

Numbers banned from sports in the UK for drug offences:

28 Rugby Players
6 Boxers
2 Athletes
2 Cyclists
2 Ice Hocker players
2 Weightlifters
1 Bobsleigher (ist)?
1 Dartist
1 Footballer
1 Wrestler

It does appear that Rugby has a huge problem right now. I believe there are a few recent newspaper articles out there on this, thus far no one has been busted at the top level, just those lower down. Maybe the guys at the bottom just don't know what they are doing...

I suspect football has a significant problem but not showing through on the stats yet

 

[NooBHA]

If you can't cycle straight you're on the wrong drugs..

If you continually cycle straight on some of those stages of the Tour De France you would probably cycle over a mountain parapet