[Politics] Are baby boomers taxed enough?

[Tyrone Biggums]

Boomers have paid tax all their lives.

Most of the people who bitch and moan about them enjoy all the niceties of modern life that their taxes helped create and build.

Some people like to try and make out they all had it easy and everything was gifted too them.

Growing up as Gen X I still remember quite well the sacrifices and hard work a great portion of the Boomers had to put in to get to where they are now.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

In summary. My folks bought a place 2.5 times my dad’s income in 1980 for about 16k. It is now worth close to a million quid. So someone wanting to buy it would need 100k deposit and a wage of about 400k if borrowing 2.5 times. Clearly not happening in many cases. It is being clever and working hard earning all this free money is it. Ffs. It is just luck.

If not capital gains then it should be inheritance tax. Parents divorced and between them own three houses now worth a combined 1.2 million at a guess. My dad’s pension is more than my wage (which is over 50k). My brother and sister plus myself should get nailed for inheritance tax. Why should we get lots of benefit because my parents made so much cash just by living in a sodding house?

Because the Government doesn't deserve a single f***ing cent of it is why.

Your parents took the risk, they deserve the reward.

If they had lost the house because they couldn't keep up with the payments the government wouldn't have bailed them out so they could keep it.

Yet when they pay it off and it goes up there's the parasitic Governments wanting their share of something they had no share or risk involved in.

That's why private owners and their families should get all the benefits from it.

 

[The Antikythera Mechanism]

Yep, OK boomer.

Boomer parents had WW2. Therefore deserve much wealth.

Young people has boomers as parents. Therefore deserve f*** all.

For your information, when my Mum died and left me and my brother the family home, I gave my share to my two sons. This was over 7 years ago, so has avoided IHT. What I’ve got, I’ve worked for. Try it.

 

[Bakero]

"Won't millennials inherit a lot of this boomer wealth?", I hear you ask. Well, yes, in many cases they will.

However, over 50% of those that haven't made it onto the property ladder have parents who also don't own their own home.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Generation Xers are going to be a lot worse off than boomers in retirement, in the private sector you need to stashing away 20 percent plus of your salary to have a reasonable retirement. Very few can do that.

Boomers generally have had so many things good. But it wasn’t good enough so in 2016 they gambled it all on their kids and grandkids futures. Mostly a pretty selfish bunch

Such crass generalisations. As a boomer, I voted Remain in 2016, as did Mrs DiS, and we have to a greater or lesser extent felt angry about it ever since, angry about the politicians who so seriously misjudged and/or just lied about what BREXIT would bring.
And I know PLENTY of Boomers who feel exactly the same way.

 

[heathgate]

More on the demographic time bomb.

I hear lots of boomers say “if you can’t afford kids then don’t have them” so now people are not. The data is genuinely scary. With those in 20s and 30s unable to afford a home and therefore start a family where are the workers coming from? So in 20 years when the remaining boomers are very old who will be the workers paying their pensions? Genuinely it is a huge issue that has such strong links to cost of housing it is a no brainer to make it more affordable.

If I get a chance tomorrow I will share data on this. We should be taxing the boomers sitting on massive pots of gold due to property prices and helping young families. And no this is not me. My kids are teenagers. I was lucky and got into property just in time and benefitted from low interest rates. This is for the current 20/30 year olds thinking of starting a family but decide they can’t afford it. The country needs them to have babies so offering free childcare for all would be a VERY worthwhile investment. Also increasing the child benefit thresholds that have sat at 50-60k for over a decade for massive drag on those.

It is genuinely nuts that this is not a bigger story. Without babies now the country is screwed in 30 years unless we get lots of immigration, which is ironically hated (relatively and obviously on average) by boomers.

So explain how the population of this nation is increasing by 500k per year then, half of which is migration... ?.... I dont see that easing any time soon, especially if Labour get in and open the gates.

 

[Deleted member 37369]

Such crass generalisations. As a boomer, I voted Remain in 2016, as did Mrs DiS, and we have to a greater or lesser extent felt angry about it ever since, angry about the politicians who so seriously misjudged and/or just lied about what BREXIT would bring.
And I know PLENTY of Boomers who feel exactly the same way.

Same here and same for Mrs HS … crass generalisations, as you say!

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Because the Government doesn't deserve a single f***ing cent of it is why.

Your parents took the risk, they deserve the reward.

If they had lost the house because they couldn't keep up with the payments the government wouldn't have bailed them out so they could keep it.

Yet when they pay it off and it goes up there's the parasitic Governments wanting their share of something they had no share or risk involved in.

That's why private owners and their families should get all the benefits from it.

Governments are there to look after people.
Taxes are our way of contributing to that.
Our Government fails to provide a basic level of subsistence for far too large a proportion of the population.
The rich get richer and the poor get poorer.
The disadvantaged get trodden even deeper in to the ground and their children have even less chance of emerging from it unless they have a helping hand, unless Government acts.
“Parasitic Government” is an ignorant, cruel and horrible expression. Some people might be better thinking along the lines of “there but for the grace of God go I”. I can remember it used to be said that most people are just three salary cheques away from destitution.

 

[dazzer6666]

More on the demographic time bomb.

I hear lots of boomers say “if you can’t afford kids then don’t have them” so now people are not. The data is genuinely scary. With those in 20s and 30s unable to afford a home and therefore start a family where are the workers coming from? So in 20 years when the remaining boomers are very old who will be the workers paying their pensions? Genuinely it is a huge issue that has such strong links to cost of housing it is a no brainer to make it more affordable.

If I get a chance tomorrow I will share data on this. We should be taxing the boomers sitting on massive pots of gold due to property prices and helping young families. And no this is not me. My kids are teenagers. I was lucky and got into property just in time and benefitted from low interest rates. This is for the current 20/30 year olds thinking of starting a family but decide they can’t afford it. The country needs them to have babies so offering free childcare for all would be a VERY worthwhile investment. Also increasing the child benefit thresholds that have sat at 50-60k for over a decade for massive drag on those.

It is genuinely nuts that this is not a bigger story. Without babies now the country is screwed in 30 years unless we get lots of immigration, which is ironically hated (relatively and obviously on average) by boomers.

Agree re childcare and child benefit (although needs to be means-tested, maybe even on a regional basis to reflect housing costs although that’s probably impractical).

A large % of the ‘pots of gold’ the boomers are sitting on is still in their property though, so how do you tax it now ? For others (the cash rich), maybe we should incentivise the boomers to help their kids buy property perhaps ? Easily done - an additional IHT-free gift allowance on top of the current 3k p.a. specifically to purchase property?

 

[Icy Gull]

Such crass generalisations. As a boomer, I voted Remain in 2016, as did Mrs DiS, and we have to a greater or lesser extent felt angry about it ever since, angry about the politicians who so seriously misjudged and/or just lied about what BREXIT would bring.
And I know PLENTY of Boomers who feel exactly the same way.

Likewise, we were shocked and extremely pissed off about it, still are but it’s a fait accompli so accept it (My other half is even more riled about it than me too) Also Irritated that all us old codgers are pigeonholed as little Englanders.

 

[heathgate]

It is not double tax though. My folks have made hundreds of thousands on property. It isn’t taxed until second home. So you could buy a house for 20k and leave a million. All just by complete luck. No inheritance tax if they stayed together is there? They have divorced so it is different but if parents make a million quid then me, my brother and sister could each get over 300k and they never paid any tax on it (council tax doesn’t count here). They are not geniuses, just lucky.

Many people working harder than people who get a leg onto housing market and build property portfolio and just sit there making profit by doing sod all. It is really bad.

It is simply a quirk of history and global economics.... in the 20s and 30s in the States in particular, people lost everything, so what!?.... to castigate a generation because they took advantage of an economic and social fair wind, is disingenuous... during the 70s I had high interest rates, high income tax, high unemployment, constant strikes, IRA bombings, social unrest... no computers, no mobile phones, ...... are you going to compensate me for those trials and tribulations?... no, so just get on with your lives, nobody is owed a living, if you can't buy a place, rent one... before the 70s, the vast majority of the great unwashed in this nation rented..... and if you don't want this ever increasing demand on housing to continue, then get off your moaning arse and do something about migration... 300k per year net inward flow... sort that one out.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

But then, what this thread is about is not comparing the wealth of the young with the wealth of the old 40 years ago. It's about comparing the wealth of the young in 40 years time with what the old have now, and guessing what might happen.

Just on the last point.

There is absolutely no guesswork required. We have an ageing population, pensions timebomb (state pension will resemble a Ponzi scheme in its current form) and a labour gap that is only getting worse. Last presentation I saw was a shortage of 3 million now (rough numbers 1 million Brexit, 1 million early retirement and 1 million birth shortfall in 18 age group). They will be worse off, guaranteed in any like for like comparison.

There won't be any millennials retiring at 55 from a middle management job on a final salary pension that's for sure.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

It is simply a quirk of history and global economics.... in the 20s and 30s in the States in particular, people lost everything, so what!?.... to castigate a generation because they took advantage of an economic and social fair wind, is disingenuous... during the 70s I had high interest rates, high income tax, high unemployment, constant strikes, IRA bombings, social unrest... no computers, no mobile phones, ...... are you going to compensate me for those trials and tribulations?... no, so just get on with your lives, nobody is owed a living, if you can't buy a place, rent one... before the 70s, the vast majority of the great unwashed in this nation rented..... and if you don't want this ever increasing demand on housing to continue, then get off your moaning arse and do something about migration... 300k per year net inward flow... sort that one out.

If we didn’t have that level of LEGAL immigration, the Health Service and Care industries would probably collapse.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Governments are there to look after people.
Taxes are our way of contributing to that.
Our Government fails to provide a basic level of subsistence for far too large a proportion of the population.
The rich get richer and the poor get poorer.
The disadvantaged get trodden even deeper in to the ground and their children have even less chance of emerging from it unless they have a helping hand, unless Government acts.
“Parasitic Government” is an ignorant, cruel and horrible expression. Some people might be better thinking along the lines of “there but for the grace of God go I”. I can remember it used to be said that most people are just three salary cheques away from destitution.

Politicians are parasitic grifters. Pigs with their snouts in the public purse trough.

You only have to look at how they speak when they make a big deal about funding something, they talk like it's their money they are giving to people and how grateful we all should be to them.

Imagine taxing people less so that they had more in their pay packets to make better decisions for themselves than politicians make.

I don't know what it's like there but we have a system where the harder you work the more they penalise you. You put the extra long hours in and they take more and more from you.

It's the Governments keeping hard working poor people poor, not some uber rich person in some private industry. Who else is it stealing money from their pay cheques?

 

[Weststander]

How does inheritance tax address the lack of housing ?

How does inheritance tax affect the value of a house ?

How does rent control address the lack of housing ?

How does stopping someone building up a property portfolio address the lack of housing ?

The only thing that is going to bring house and rent prices down is by increasing the supply. For a number of home owners this is unpopular, firstly it means their home won't double in price in ten years and secondly they might have to get used to having more neighbours. Successive governments have pandered to them.

The UKs population has risen by 8 million since 2000 alone. Meanwhile the supply of houses has decreased.

Planning law needs to be ripped up and started again and we are going to have to get used to it.

This.

Yet almost everyone (of the left, centre and right) fights new home schemes near them. Aided by vote chasing politicians.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Politicians are parasitic grifters. Pigs with their snouts in the public purse trough.

You only have to look at how they speak when they make a big deal about funding something, they talk like it's their money they are giving to people and how grateful we all should be to them.

Imagine taxing people less so that they had more in their pay packets to make better decisions for themselves than politicians make.

I don't know what it's like there but we have a system where the harder you work the more they penalise you. You put the extra long hours in and they take more and more from you.

It's the Governments keeping hard working poor people poor, not some uber rich person in some private industry. Who else is it stealing money from their pay cheques?

On your first two paragraphs, not all politicians are the same. There are those in this country, plenty of whom have come to light in recent times, who are in it for what they can make for themselves. There are those who genuinely want to make it better for other people.

The poorest are supported - the working poor with, say, two parents working and still not able to make ends meet, with in-work benefits, which are still often not enough.

but my point is that there are plenty of people around who could afford to pay a lot more tax and probably wouldn’t notice it, but who could well spend a great deal of effort to pay less tax - tax avoidance (legal but not necessarily moral) or tax evasion (illegal).

and people like our mega-rich Prime Minister and his wife - local lad from my neck of the woods - haven’t got a hope in hell of realising what it’s like not to be able to afford to feed your kids properly.

 

[Live by the sea]

Because the Government doesn't deserve a single f***ing cent of it is why.

Your parents took the risk, they deserve the reward.

If they had lost the house because they couldn't keep up with the payments the government wouldn't have bailed them out so they could keep it.

Yet when they pay it off and it goes up there's the parasitic Governments wanting their share of something they had no share or risk involved in.

That's why private owners and their families should get all the benefits from it.

Exactly this . Why should the government get your families Money and no doubt waste it .

Money should be kept within families that have often taken risks to get it and passed down to their kids as the parents see fit .

I have no problem with this but there again I’m not jealous of other peoples success or good fortune , I say good for them , it’s the American way ,

 

[BN9 BHA]

Inspired by

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/tax/news/boomers-tax-pensions-wealth-divide-ifs/

Inspired by a link I can’t read unless I register……thanks

 

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

When Boomers shuffle off this mortal coil they will leave us with a legacy of poverty and mass societal break down due to rampant climate change. I hope they feel guilty, they should.

 

[banjo]

I’m sure once Baby boomers have all gone it’ll be Gen X getting the blame. Can’t wait.