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Anyone watch the 9/11 conspiracy programme on C4?
- Thread starter oapdodge
- Start date
Beach Hut
Brighton Bhuna Boy
The only bit that could factually happen was terrorist profiting legitimately via the Stock Exchange - more than likely this happens.
clapham_gull
Legacy Fan
- Aug 20, 2003
- 25,877
Yep, and pretty much covered in a similiar Sky programme the other day. There was a very very detailed documentary last year as to why the Towers fell on the BBC.
What the Saudis knew and what Israel knew - well that's unanswered. Also (and not covered particularly well here) was why the Bush administration decided to drop the Bin Laden investigation that Clinton started... although the Bush administration seemed to pretty much turn over all that Clinton was trying to do on simply idiological grounds.
I tend to think that the administration are trying to cover up gross errors in security which has led people to think that the government was involved.
I don't buy the idea that the government was involved simply for an excuse to attack Iraq (although it did give them the "excuse").
Isn't it obvious that it would have been easier for them to plant evidence of WMD in Iraq than blow up the Twin Towers ? ..and they didn't even manage that.
However when you get so many unanswered questions and a less than thorough investigation that Michael Meacher a respected British MP is willing to put his face up.. well you have to ask questions.
I believe he wrote the forward to the book that alot of theories are based "9/11 The New Pearl Harbour" or something.
What the Saudis knew and what Israel knew - well that's unanswered. Also (and not covered particularly well here) was why the Bush administration decided to drop the Bin Laden investigation that Clinton started... although the Bush administration seemed to pretty much turn over all that Clinton was trying to do on simply idiological grounds.
I tend to think that the administration are trying to cover up gross errors in security which has led people to think that the government was involved.
I don't buy the idea that the government was involved simply for an excuse to attack Iraq (although it did give them the "excuse").
Isn't it obvious that it would have been easier for them to plant evidence of WMD in Iraq than blow up the Twin Towers ? ..and they didn't even manage that.
However when you get so many unanswered questions and a less than thorough investigation that Michael Meacher a respected British MP is willing to put his face up.. well you have to ask questions.
I believe he wrote the forward to the book that alot of theories are based "9/11 The New Pearl Harbour" or something.
Donny Osmond
New member
- Jul 6, 2003
- 618
I always found it funny that within about half our of the 9/11 (11/9 in English) that Bin Laden was the only suspect when even now there is no evidence against him.
Why didn't Bush accept Afghanistans offer to hand over Bin Laden if they gave them evidence that he did it?
Becuase there is none?
That would also explain why Bin Laden has not been found.
Why didn't Bush accept Afghanistans offer to hand over Bin Laden if they gave them evidence that he did it?
Becuase there is none?
That would also explain why Bin Laden has not been found.
clapham_gull
Legacy Fan
- Aug 20, 2003
- 25,877
I work with a foreign guy (not Muslim I might add) who is very knowledgable about world events.
He also because of his background takes a lot of notice about events in the former Soviet Union.
When the planes hit I was at work and run back up to my office to tell him what had happened. He looked very thoughtful for a moment and then said "Bin Laden".
A while later I asked him why he said that so quickly. He had read in the Times Newspaper that Russian intelligence believed that Bin Laden was planning a massive attack on American home soil.
It would seem everyone else knew, why not America.
I guess Bin Laden was the main suspect simply because groups associated with him had bombed the world trade centre before. Bin Laden had seen how terrorist groups could take down a world power in Afghanistan whilst fighting against the Russians.
It seems that the intelligence powers of America are not what we believed them to be. They don't (unlike Israel) tend to send agents overseas very much to infiltrate foreign groups (someone correct me if I'm wrong), and they have little expertise in inflitrating Arab nations.
It would seem that American spies are very much American tourists and stick out a mile.
He also because of his background takes a lot of notice about events in the former Soviet Union.
When the planes hit I was at work and run back up to my office to tell him what had happened. He looked very thoughtful for a moment and then said "Bin Laden".
A while later I asked him why he said that so quickly. He had read in the Times Newspaper that Russian intelligence believed that Bin Laden was planning a massive attack on American home soil.
It would seem everyone else knew, why not America.
I guess Bin Laden was the main suspect simply because groups associated with him had bombed the world trade centre before. Bin Laden had seen how terrorist groups could take down a world power in Afghanistan whilst fighting against the Russians.
It seems that the intelligence powers of America are not what we believed them to be. They don't (unlike Israel) tend to send agents overseas very much to infiltrate foreign groups (someone correct me if I'm wrong), and they have little expertise in inflitrating Arab nations.
It would seem that American spies are very much American tourists and stick out a mile.
Bobby's Gull
DAFT Bint
Wanted to watch it, but it seems that a lot of the theories don't prove much just like the Diana ones.
I think the attacks could have been prevented and the US intelligence was manipulated. A lot of the conspiracy theories will be dis-information to make other theories seem part of a scheme just too far fetched. I think a few claims seemed credible mainly the presence of the Israeli spies. If the Mossad spies had specific intelligence on the 9/11 attacks I'd suspect the Americans would also have been aware unless Israeli or Saudi groups decided to benefit from the anti arab/terror factor. For me the real question is did the US themselves know and hope to exploit??
It was a terrible act committed by a new type of terrorist. If they'd taken a bomb onto the plane it was quite likely to have been detected - but using the entire plane as a bomb?
When something happens for the first time it's almost impossible to stop - who knows what to look out for? Looking back on the event everyone has perfect hindsight (reports of a big attack on the US, Arabs taking flying courses, intercepted phone calls), but it takes another leap of the imagination to put it all together correctly.
When something happens for the first time it's almost impossible to stop - who knows what to look out for? Looking back on the event everyone has perfect hindsight (reports of a big attack on the US, Arabs taking flying courses, intercepted phone calls), but it takes another leap of the imagination to put it all together correctly.
SK1NT
Well-known member
did make me think!
1) the twin towers, looked like a contolled explosion.
2)the security video of the missle into the pentagon.where was the plane?
1) the twin towers, looked like a contolled explosion.
2)the security video of the missle into the pentagon.where was the plane?
Donny Osmond
New member
- Jul 6, 2003
- 618
the security video would have a slow frame rate I would guess and a plane going 4-5 hundred mph would be unlikely to be picked up.
Ex Shelton Seagull
New member
They missed out my favourite 11/9 theory, the one about a fax that told all Jews working in the WTC not to turn up for work the following day. It's so stupid it just makes me laugh. The idea that the Israeli government could plan to kill thousands and thousands of civilians but got so squeamish over the thought of killing a few hundred of it's own citizens that it sent out a fax that told everyone what was going to happen the following day! What a giveaway!
"Anybody seen Berkowitz this morning?"
"That's odd, where are the Cohen brothers today?"
I also like the theory that all of the telephone calls made from the planes wre faked. Essentially the theory states that the US government sent out agents to track everyone who used those 4 flights over the previous 6 months. These agents then learned how to imitate all of the passengers voices (only roughly mind) and learned the names and telephone numbers of their next of kin. All of them.
On 11/9 these agents then sat down at a big computer terminal, overseen by some sort of commanding officer, that was located at NORAD headquarters. They then rang up the next of kin of everyone who possesed a mobile phone on those 4 flights and told them that they loved them very much. They also made up the Flight 93 storming after that plane was shot down. Now those agents had to have some serious acting talent because not only were all the relatives fooled at the time, they are still being fooled to this day because those tapes have been played over and over again on the TV and those relatives STILL think that it is their loved ones voices on those tapes. Pretty amazing.
Of course there's also a middle-eastern theory which suggests that 11/9 didn't happen at all and that we were all hypnotised into thinking it did.
Ahem.
"Anybody seen Berkowitz this morning?"
"That's odd, where are the Cohen brothers today?"
I also like the theory that all of the telephone calls made from the planes wre faked. Essentially the theory states that the US government sent out agents to track everyone who used those 4 flights over the previous 6 months. These agents then learned how to imitate all of the passengers voices (only roughly mind) and learned the names and telephone numbers of their next of kin. All of them.
On 11/9 these agents then sat down at a big computer terminal, overseen by some sort of commanding officer, that was located at NORAD headquarters. They then rang up the next of kin of everyone who possesed a mobile phone on those 4 flights and told them that they loved them very much. They also made up the Flight 93 storming after that plane was shot down. Now those agents had to have some serious acting talent because not only were all the relatives fooled at the time, they are still being fooled to this day because those tapes have been played over and over again on the TV and those relatives STILL think that it is their loved ones voices on those tapes. Pretty amazing.
Of course there's also a middle-eastern theory which suggests that 11/9 didn't happen at all and that we were all hypnotised into thinking it did.
Ahem.
Sitting Room Only
New member
clapham_gull said:
I think after the second plane hit everyone instantly thought it was Bin Laden's handy work didn't they?
I don't believe any of the theories that the American government helped plan the attacks - thats just ludicrous. I'm no expert on security but i do find it strange however that the only security videos they had outside of the PENTAGON were time lapse.
Spiros
Well-known member
I used to think that any suggestions that the US Govt would allow the attacks to happen were ridiculous. A couple of things from that programme now nag a bit though:
(1) A 'think tank' of senior politicians, including Cheney, Rumsfeld and Jeb Bush produced a report predicting the US becoming the single great world power over time, but said it would happen much more quickly if they had a 'Pearl Harbour' type event to kick-start it. They didn't need to carry out the act for themselves, just let it happen by having poor security and (unusually) no F16s in the air once the planes went off course
(2) The bit about the mossad agents in New Jersey. To me it is perfectly plausible that Israel knew in advance of the attacks and watched thinking 'Have some of what we've been getting from the Palestinians and then join us against all Arabs'
Given all that, and my extensive experiences of working with Americans, it is equally plausible that Al Qaeda got away with it because of gross incompetence on the part of a number of US agencies.
(1) A 'think tank' of senior politicians, including Cheney, Rumsfeld and Jeb Bush produced a report predicting the US becoming the single great world power over time, but said it would happen much more quickly if they had a 'Pearl Harbour' type event to kick-start it. They didn't need to carry out the act for themselves, just let it happen by having poor security and (unusually) no F16s in the air once the planes went off course
(2) The bit about the mossad agents in New Jersey. To me it is perfectly plausible that Israel knew in advance of the attacks and watched thinking 'Have some of what we've been getting from the Palestinians and then join us against all Arabs'
Given all that, and my extensive experiences of working with Americans, it is equally plausible that Al Qaeda got away with it because of gross incompetence on the part of a number of US agencies.
clapham_gull
Legacy Fan
- Aug 20, 2003
- 25,877
Sitting Room Only said:
Yeah, but my point was that he was expecting it - he'd read something was gonna happen in the newspapers !
I don't believe the conspiracy either. Some people within the American agencies were worried something was gonna happen but the big chiefs ignored the warnings.
I've just been reading about the first attack in 1993.
They planned a similiar thing but it would have caused much greater devastation. They had planned to topple one tower onto to other whilst simultaneous releasing cyanide gas.
It failed because apparently they ran out of money and didn't have enough explosives.
Worrying thing is that they had obviously done their homework on the structure of the towers and were willing to wait many years to have another go.
Whatever increased security that was or wasn't put in place at the towers wouldn't have stopped the planes though.