Anyone miss the Poyet passing style?

[kevo]

Because usually managers leave under two circumstances :

1. They are sacked because of poor results
2. They go to a "bigger" club

Poyet didn't leave under either of these circumstances and the board have taken a very large gamble. It may pay off ( hopefully ) but if it doesn't, maybe if we get relegated ?, then the board need to understand that they will be held accountable.

Well said.

 

[Bigsul]

I do.

Yeah, I know it was sometimes frustrating and didn't always have an end product, but it was a joy to watch compared to some of the awful kick and rush stuff we witnessed tonight.

In April, we drew against another mediocre Championship side, Charlton - another frustrating result, but the style and technique of our football was superb. I almost didn't care that we hadn't won, we played with pure class and flair - and Charlton, to be fair to them, earned a point by defending superbly. There were countless games last season where the team played some of the best football I've ever witnessed as a Brighton fan.

Tonight we made a team who haven't won all season look half-decent. We suddenly seem to have lost the ability to pass the ball. It's all try everything as fast as possible and punt and hope. Where the **** has the style and technique from last season gone?

We are heading towards becoming a very ordinary Championship side - try and play with speed, even if half the passes go astray. There's no way on the evidence of those last two performances that we're going to be in with a chance of promotion. And for everyone who says they're happy for us to be an "ordinary Championship side", just think what might have been....

There's no doubt in my mind that we would have won the title last year if Ulloa had been with us from August - all we were lacking was a clinical finisher. And if Poyet had stayed, there's also no doubt we would be up there again - challenging for the Premier League, and dominating the opposition with the sheer class of our football. What a massive missed opportunity.

I know Poyet had a big gob and an even bigger ego, but the same can be said of many top managers (from Clough to Mourinho). I really hope someone's oversensitivity hasn't deprived us of the chance to create a fantastic chapter in the history of our football club.

Can't escape the feeling that last season could be the closest we will get to the top flight for a while. For all the talk of saving money and FFP, there seems to be very little talk about why fans bother to turn up in the first place. People come to the Amex to be entertained by the football. The club willingly got rid of its best asset - a charismatic manager who developed a superb team which played with flair. If he'd stayed, we would be in with a decent shout of going up - and in style. If we continue to play like Sheffield Wednesday we can kiss that dream goodbye, that's for sure.

My thought on this, and I haven't read all of the other posts:

I was a Poyet fan, especially of the way he had us playing football. But not always what he said. I think Poyet trained a group of players to play in one style, and he trained them very well with discipline. I think that he did not have a Plan B because the players couldn't cope with a Plan B. I think that this may be the problem - the players are struggling to up their game, play with differing game plans, depending on the game. As soon as Ulloa went off last night they could not adapt. I do not think we will ever hear exactly what Oscar thinks, as he will not openly criticise the team, unlike Poyet. If he is a good manager he will be doing this behind the scenes. I saw some fight in the team last night, and some skill, but no plan, especially at the end. So some good work on the training ground will sort that out, and Oscar will come good. Here's hoping.

 

[drew]

The football we played under Gus was the stuff of legend.

We didn't sing "we're ****ing brilliant" for nothing - we genuinely were ****ing brilliant under Gus.

Over time it will come increasingly clear what a phenomenal manager he is.

I find it phenomenal that he hasn't got a job yet!!!!!

How could we have had 5 by half time when we only had 4 shots on target throughout the game? That's the most worrying thing for me with this team. Ipswich - 0 shots on target
Bolton - 2 shots on target
QPR - 1 shot on target

Perhaps you should go to games rather than rely purely on stats!

 

[Coach_Carter_92]

I don't know whether people noticed or are choosing to ignore it, but whenever our center-halves had the ball, our midfield options were all being either a) man marked by touch tight defenders, or b) creating space for them to move into.

One problem i have noticed is our players' reluctance to actually run with the ball or dribble. Yes Buckley and Lua Lua can beat their man fairly frequently but no one else seems to try and exploit space. Numerous times our full backs receive the ball out wide with space in front but they never run into it, instead playing it back inside or backwards.

Something to work on imo.

 

[somerset]

.....our midfield is simply not functioning, no early outlet for the four defenders, pressure and rash passes ensues.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I find it phenomenal that he hasn't got a job yet!!!!!



Perhaps you should go to games rather than rely purely on stats!

I am a season ticket holder, haven't missed a home match and frequently go to away games. Stats are useful for making a point for debate rather than having a go at another poster.

 

[Bold Seagull]

.....our midfield is simply not functioning, no early outlet for the four defenders, pressure and rash passes ensues.

I think this is more like it.

We're not actually playing a long ball game, but rather than pass ourselves into trouble while in possession near our box, we're going for a safety first approach rather than trying too hard to play our way out of it. That is a lot different from an intentional long ball tactic whereby a full back is passed to and in plenty of space with time, launches it up the field.

There is a difference.

 

[Bigsul]

We still have the players capable of playing the Poyet way, and at times we still do it. However we play, it's good to know we have a back 4 comfortable with the ball at their feet and looking for passes.

What Oscar is trying to do, is to install a bit more pace and zip to the passing through midfield. In small patches so far this season it's worked well. It will take time to get better. As someone mentioned, maybe we've not quite got the players just yet, or they're still getting used to it.

One thing that I've not seen a single person comment on, is that both Ipswich and Wednesday had their back line play VERY high up the pitch, which compressed the midfield up, pretty much putting a stop to the quick zippy midfield passing, or at least meaning it has to be VERY accurate. Therefore, we have to adapt, and last night that turned into playing over the top. As I see it, we haven't suddenly turned into long ball merchants, we were trying to play over the top of a tight midfield for the quicker players to get onto, and in fact, this is where we were getting most joy last night. (as an aside, this was a game that would have suited CMS to a T)

Looks like we're not only developing a plan b, but plans c and d as well.

Relax people

This

 

[Cowfold Seagull]

Of course. You're spelling out what a lot of us think about this whole situation. In the back of my mind there's a thought that this season will be one of mid-table ups and downs and a bit of struggle, whilst we see Poyet's new premier league team get loads of plaudits on MotD for their new passing style.

But I'm also prepared to give Oscar time to implement his own style on the team, and only then can we judge. However I expect he will need a full off-season to get the right players in.

Yes agree with most of this, especially this being a season of transition with a new manager at the helm. What l don't understand though, is why Oscar feels the need to change our whole style of play. Why mend what isn't broken? I remember back in the early years at Withdean, Peter Taylor taking over from Micky Adams after we won promotion, and sensibly he just let the team, (with a few tweaks maybe), continue playing the same brand of football, and lo and behold we won promotion again.

Ok so not every game under Gus ended with a win, but at least we always played with flair, and most of the time our football was a delight to watch.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Yes agree with most of this, especially this being a season of transition with a new manager at the helm. What l don't understand though, is why Oscar feels the need to change our whole style of play. Why mend what isn't broken? I remember back in the early years at Withdean, Peter Taylor taking over from Micky Adams after we won promotion, and sensibly he just let the team, (with a few tweaks maybe), continue playing the same brand of football, and lo and behold we won promotion again.

Ok so not every game under Gus ended with a win, but at least we always played with flair, and most of the time our football was a delight to watch.

I don't think Oscar has changed us that much at all, in fact we were just as poor for periods under Gus as we are currently with Oscar.

Under Gus in his first season in the Championship, we didn't win for 9 matches (L5 D4), from 17.09.11 to 05.11.11, and we lost 4 of our 5 games in December, then didn't win for 8 games from mid March to the end of the season.

Again under Gus, last season we lost at home to Birmingham about this same time, and didn't win for 7 games after a great start.

At the moment, I don't think Oscar has done much to change our style. Our formation is the same, and we are trying to pass it, however the team isn't clicking quite as well as it did under Gus, which is understandable given the new personnel coming in and the injuries we've had.

In fact possession wise we had 64% last night, 58% at Ipswich, 59% Bolton, 47% QPR, 57% Reading, 65% Millwall....

These are not the stats of a side that has given up on its principles of possession football. We do, when under pressure look to hit space more, and rightly I think, when a team is defending a high line, we are looking to put a ball over the top, which worked 2 or 3 times last night. It doesn't mean he's transformed our style, or we're suddenly a long ball side.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I don't think Oscar has changed us that much at all, in fact we were just as poor for periods under Gus as we are currently with Oscar.

Under Gus in his first season in the Championship, we didn't win for 9 matches (L5 D4), from 17.09.11 to 05.11.11, and we lost 4 of our 5 games in December, then didn't win for 8 games from mid March to the end of the season.

Again under Gus, last season we lost at home to Birmingham about this same time, and didn't win for 7 games after a great start.

At the moment, I don't think Oscar has done much to change our style. Our formation is the same, and we are trying to pass it, however the team isn't clicking quite as well as it did under Gus, which is understandable given the new personnel coming in and the injuries we've had.

In fact possession wise we had 64% last night, 58% at Ipswich, 59% Bolton, 47% QPR, 57% Reading, 65% Millwall....

These are not the stats of a side that has given up on its principles of possession football. We do, when under pressure look to hit space more, and rightly I think, when a team is defending a high line, we are looking to put a ball over the top, which worked 2 or 3 times last night. It doesn't mean he's transformed our style, or we're suddenly a long ball side.

The bottom line is that we have to score goals.

 

[trueblue]

Don't agree that we resort to 'hoofing' it. Seems to me that if you're behind and you have players with the pace of Buckley and Lua Lua, it makes a lot of sense to go long when the other team's attack has broken down. It's a rare moment when they're at their most vulnerable having committed players forward. We just need to get better at it.

Under Gus, thankfully, we weren't chasing games too often but when we were, it was pretty hopeless. The slow build up would allow them to regroup and we'd rarely build the type of persistent pressure that led to that 3 goal burst against Bolton.

I'm not entirely convinced yet by OG but see the flexibility of his approach as one of the positives.

 

[Bwian]

The football we played under Gus was the stuff of legend.

We didn't sing "we're ****ing brilliant" for nothing - we genuinely were ****ing brilliant under Gus.

Over time it will come increasingly clear what a phenomenal manager he is.

Nothing like re-writing history. We didn't play 'the stuff of legend'. If we had, we'd be in the frigging Premier league now

We were good at times, we were brilliant at times and we were also terrible at times.

Over time it will come increasingly clear that your hero phucked up a golden opportunity-for him and this football club. I hope he gets a club soon then perhaps you'll sod off with him so you can re-kindle your love affair with him.

 

[Bwian]

The bottom line is that we have to score goals.

The bottom line is that our 2 main strikers have been unavailable for most of our season so far. No wonder we are struggling to score goals.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Nothing like re-writing history. We didn't play 'the stuff of legend'. If we had, we'd be in the frigging Premier league now

We were good at times, we were brilliant at times and we were also terrible at times.

It was the stuff of champions, the stuff of dreams. Get it right.

 

[stss30]

What a ridiculous comment. Spanish Dave's missed passes are down to him and not because we don't play 'decent possession football'. Does our style of play mean Dave's corners are worse than Tiny Cox's-failing to get off the ground? It seems to me that fully paid up members of the Poyet Fan Club are enjoying our poor form at the moment whilst forgetting their beloved Gus also went through many bad spells. If Poyet had been more committed to the cause towards the end of last season we'd have finished 2nd, not 4th. In fact, with the squad he had at his disposal last season we should easily have finished in 2nd place. Games like Bristol away come to mind-zero shots on target-Gus was not managerial perfection.

He has gone. Move on and support the new man ffs.

Nothing like re-writing history. We didn't play 'the stuff of legend'. If we had, we'd be in the frigging Premier league now

We were good at times, we were brilliant at times and we were also terrible at times.

Over time it will come increasingly clear that your hero phucked up a golden opportunity-for him and this football club. I hope he gets a club soon then perhaps you'll sod off with him so you can re-kindle your love affair with him.

Two of the best posts on the thread. Spot on sir.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

There's a lot of the same players as last season out there who seem to have suddenly forgotten the basics. That's not down to the manager.

 

[Barnham Seagull]

To me we only needed to evolve/tweak what we were doing, play the ball forward slightly more positively and have a more attacking mind-set. Instead we seem to ripped up all that was good and now look like a team that doesn't know each other and hoof it around everywhere.

Last season and this season were and are our big chance, on what I have seen so far we will be very lucky to be mid table. Next season several key players will be older and possibly past their best (Greer & Upson). Replacing these two is going to cost big money will we let the manager do this now that we are fully committed to FFP?

 

[martin tyler]

I don't think Oscar has changed us that much at all, in fact we were just as poor for periods under Gus as we are currently with Oscar.

Under Gus in his first season in the Championship, we didn't win for 9 matches (L5 D4), from 17.09.11 to 05.11.11, and we lost 4 of our 5 games in December, then didn't win for 8 games from mid March to the end of the season.

Again under Gus, last season we lost at home to Birmingham about this same time, and didn't win for 7 games after a great start.

At the moment, I don't think Oscar has done much to change our style. Our formation is the same, and we are trying to pass it, however the team isn't clicking quite as well as it did under Gus, which is understandable given the new personnel coming in and the injuries we've had.

In fact possession wise we had 64% last night, 58% at Ipswich, 59% Bolton, 47% QPR, 57% Reading, 65% Millwall....

These are not the stats of a side that has given up on its principles of possession football. We do, when under pressure look to hit space more, and rightly I think, when a team is defending a high line, we are looking to put a ball over the top, which worked 2 or 3 times last night. It doesn't mean he's transformed our style, or we're suddenly a long ball side.

Thank god some sense.

 

[Ninja Elephant]

Thank god some sense.

Pity it is nonsense.

We are a long way short of the organisational and tactical nous of Gus Poyet's Brighton and Hove Albion.