Anyone else getting close to finally moving into the Hyypia out camp?

[mwrpoole]

I've moved reluctantly into the Sami out camp.

We've taken the lead in 5 of our last 6 games (twice against Norwich) but failed to hold onto it for very long. Except Wigan of course who were more goal shy than us.

We had a very defensive bench on Saturday, and of the 2 attacking players, Solly clearly wasn't able to play for 70+ minutes so he didn't come on for Kaz. Bad luck perhaps, but that's the way it goes when you're struggling. He should have brought Solly on and if need be, taken him off again with 10-15 minutes to go. If he wasn't fit to play a large part, he shouldn't have been the only attacking midfielder/wide player on the bench. Holla it seems was never going to feature unless both JFC & Gardner got injured, so he should have been replaced by Paddy in the squad.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing of course......

 

[Mellotron]

This weekend I moved from 70% - 30% in favour of Hyypia in, to 60% - 40% in favour of Hyypia in... Similar to [MENTION=12101]Mellotron[/MENTION], I've been vocally supportive of him, but his steadfast refusal to see what is unfolding in front of him is starting to worry me. In particular, there were 2 or 3 things on Saturday that started to knock my confidence in him:

1) Replacing Lua Lua with Ince: Lua Lua was having realy luck against their right back and I would have prefered to see Baldock or March (or Teixeira or McCourt if they'd been on the bench);
2) The farcical free-kick "routine" where they takers were studiously ignoring Hyypia's pleas to take it a certain way;
3) When Colunga was sent off, was Hyypia screaming from his bench for him to get a move on? No, he was slumped, arms folded in his seat.

That combined with his insistence in playing both JFC and Gardner has me seriously vexed.

LuaLua's injury early in the game I think could be a real "butterfly effect" moment. We were looking really, really in control of the game before that, and had a solid yet attacking shape. I KNEW that Hyypia wouldn't bring on March that early, so was gutted to see it be Ince and for us to choose to hand initiative back over. Our shape was much more negative from then on. Real shame. Who knows what would've happened if Kaz hadn't got injured.

 

[JBizzle]

LuaLua's injury early in the game I think could be a real "butterfly effect" moment. We were looking really, really in control of the game before that, and had a solid yet attacking shape. I KNEW that Hyypia wouldn't bring on March that early, so was gutted to see it be Ince and for us to choose to hand initiative back over. Our shape was much more negative from then on. Real shame. Who knows what would've happened if Kaz hadn't got injured.

Agree, and I think this is where the manager take some if not all of the responsibility. Having Ince AND Holla on the bench but neither Teixeira nor McCourt meant that, knowing March couldn't last longer than maybe 20-30 mins we were left with Ince being the only option (unless you try Baldock instead).

Our game could have completely different had our front three midfielders gone from Lua Lua, Colunga, Bennett to Colunga, Teixeira, Bennett. Keep them guessing, keep them on the defensive, don't hand the impetus back to them.

 

[Mellotron]

pure bad luck (deflected 2nd v Fulham).

Thing is, if you have an invisible central midfield and actively INVITE the opposition to continually shoot from the edge of the area...

Not really bad luck, is it? One of them is bound to go in eventually.

 

[downham seagull]

Still in!

 

[The Fifth Column]

The Hyppia 'in' camp earlier today:

 

[Hungry Joe]

Over the last four home games I've gone from 'In' to 'Fence' to 'Out'. As others have said, this is down to Hyypia not learning from mistakes, being tactically naive, tinkering with the squad every game unless your surname is Forster-Caskey (for some bizarre reason), totally fecking-up the midfield, and generally looking clueless, which has transferred to the players. Hyypia may well one day become a good manager if he has time to work at a lower level and learn from an experienced assistant, but he's out of his depth right now and will take us down barring a minor miracle.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

The Hyppia 'in' camp earlier today:

Very, very funny.

 

[brightonrock]

Thing is, if you have an invisible central midfield and actively INVITE the opposition to continually shoot from the edge of the area...

Not really bad luck, is it? One of them is bound to go in eventually.

True, the run and shot was undoubtedly helped by the absence of any pressure whatsoever - but the shot was dogsh!t, scuffed and heading well wide, until it hit their winger on the shin and left DS stranded. We could have half a dozen bodies in the way of a pot shot but a wicked deflection still has the same result. I remember Emnes getting a ridiculous deflection a season or two ago that wrong-footed TK...better defence, same result. Both a result of luck on the attacker's part, rather than judgement.

 

[marshy68]

I was very pro-Hyypia early on, and have defended him numerous times against people who I thought were being far too reactionary. All throughout the season we've seen some really nice passages of play, and occasions where we have been the better team and not won.

However, his handling of the midfield has been a shambles. We've brought in:

Holla
Toko
McCourt
Texieira

And not a single one of them is being used.

If our midfield on Saturday is any of the following;

JFC ; Gardner
JFC ; Ince
JFC ; Ince ; Gardner
Ince ; Gardner

I will (sadly) be finally moving to a position of Hyypia out, as it will show that he really isn't learning quickly enough from his mistakes. Our central midfield was non-existent in the 2nd half against Fulham, and is very clearly not working at present.

I moved after saturday to firmly out. Mainly because everyone in the stadium could see we need a change leading up to the equalizer and certainly after it. Hyppia sat firmly on the bench with his arms folded. Then I think on 78 minutes with a break in play all the players came to the touch line eventually Hyppia got out of his seat... just not good enough, not enspiring enough and the changes that he made were wrong and he made the wrong changes too late.

 

[GT49er]

Our game could have completely different had our front three midfielders gone from Lua Lua, Colunga, Bennett to Colunga, Teixeira, Bennett. Keep them guessing, keep them on the defensive, don't hand the impetus back to them.

Agree in principle, but don't think Tex was an option, as we already had two Bennetts, Gardner, Hughes and Bent on the field. McCourt would have been worth a try, though.

 

[Return of the Rev]

I think hippy is getting into the out camp tbh

 

[BensGrandad]

Agree in principle, but don't think Tex was an option, as we already had two Bennetts, Gardner, Hughes and Bent on the field. McCourt would have been worth a try, though.

That is only 4 loans with the 5th being Halford on the bench that to me was the mistake he should have been replaced by Tex as an attacking option as we were at home and needed a win.

 

[Hotchilidog]

it staggers me how people have a constant go at JFC, Gardner, Stockdale, Bruno etc

And Baldock who has been a Million pound total waste of space never gets a mention...

Goals are where we are falling short.

This cant be laid at the feet of our Keeper, Defenders and holding midfielders..

Disagree I think we have been far too focused on the front men and the elephant pin the room is the complete lack of a strong midfield. JFC, Ince and Gardner are often overrun and do not provide us with a solid base to build meaningful attacks. Whilst individually they are all capable of doing nice things (even Gardner plays the odd decent pass), as a collective unit they lack authority and strength. We have gone from being a game controlling ball hawk team, to one that is now spends more time chasing games and reacting rather than dictating.

Whilst I am not clamouring for Sami's departure, I wouldn't be that upset if he went, but whoever manages the team has to address this issue. The midfield is killing us I'm afraid. Either the other midfielders we have get a chance to stake a claim or we recruit from elsewhere. The only silver lining for me is that midfielders are easy to find and cheaper than strikers.

 

[lawros left foot]

You can get away with not scoring goals , you can get away with letting goals in, you can't get away with doing both. This is our problem, sort one of these out ,we'll be ok. I reckon he has two more games, Derby, and Millwall, if we lose both of these, he's toast. I'm sorry TBs big gamble doesnt appear to have worked, l hope his next one is a royal flush, not a busted flush, because I think its an all in scenario

 

[glasfryn]

Saturday finally convinced me to move camp.
I have been in the "He will change it round camp, and give him a bit more time", but the tactical shambles on Saturday pushed me over the top.
Up until Kaz went off we were looking good.
Then he switched Benno over to the left in Kaz's place, alongside Colunga, and left nobody on the right in front of Bruno.
We were then so narrow that Parker ran the midfield, and Bruno was stranded.
Why didnt he leave Benno on the right, put Colunga wider on the left as he was at Norwich, and beef up the midfield, or at least bring Baldock on. Bringing Ince on
meant pushing JFC further forward and he was gobbled up by Fulham.
Sorry Sami, thanks but cheerio.

could not have put it better myself
exactly this

 

[Hungry Joe]

Disagree I think we have been far too focused on the front men and the elephant pin the room is the complete lack of a strong midfield. JFC, Ince and Gardner are often overrun and do not provide us with a solid base to build meaningful attacks. Whilst individually they are all capable of doing nice things (even Gardner plays the odd decent pass), as a collective unit they lack authority and strength. We have gone from being a game controlling ball hawk team, to one that is now spends more time chasing games and reacting rather than dictating.

Spot on

 

[beefypigeon]

Does anybody else think Tony is playing mind games here, waiting for Sami to blink first?

Sacking Sami I assume will be quite costly as we'd have to pay him a nice hefty sum. Maybe Tony is biding his time and waiting for a resignation? We know he isn't afraid to gamble, and maybe he's of the opinion that we should have more than enough to get out of trouble with half a seasons games left to play if things don't change in the next month.

I haven't been to enough games to make an informed decision on whether I'm in the 'In' or 'Out' camp, but from league position alone he is on borrowed time as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Billy the Fish]

I really don't like calling for the manager's head this early so I won't say I'm in the OUT camp as I find it a rather uncooth, seedy and grimy place that's mostly frequented by scumbags......

....But I honestly don't think things are going to get any better. If we sacked him tomorrow and brought in McDermott I think we'd be comfortably mid table by the end of Jan with an outside chance of the play-offs

 

[Hungry Joe]

I really don't like calling for the manager's head this early so I won't say I'm in the OUT camp as I find it a rather uncooth, seedy and grimy place that's mostly frequented by scumbags......

....But I honestly don't think things are going to get any better. If we sacked him tomorrow and brought in McDermott I think we'd be comfortably mid table by the end of Jan with an outside chance of the play-offs

So you're in the 'Out' camp but are too worthy to admit it?