Another ARGUS Betrayal of BHAFC....

[Biscuit]

I'll try and swap my ticket so i can get in the civilised end and confront the stoke twat.

 

[Rougvie]

My plans to have a friendly word on Saturday about stirring the Knight thing up were thwarted by being distracted by a rather splendid Kareoke night in the sportsman, and having a few words with Nathan Lownes after the game !

Maxs dad makes raises some points in his post, but Naylor has CONSTANTLY run stories about us loosing Knight for the past 3 months, I dont care where he is from and who he supports, just give your LOCAL team a bit of backing

 

[Eddie the Seagull]

I stopped buying the ARSEGAS 6 months ago because of Naylors bigotted & negative views.

I urge others to do the same.

 

[Windmill]

I don't bother any more, it's a rag and Naylor is a twat.

 

[mk_bha]

I stopped buying the ARSEGAS 6 months ago because of Naylors bigotted & negative views.

I urge others to do the same.

i did the same around a year ago.

waste of space.

times is the only paper worth reading.

 

[BensGrandad]

I wrote to the Argus and if I can copy the reply( iam not very good with computers) I will here goes:




Dear Mr Lisher,
Thank you for your email. The Argus continues to cover Sussex sport in as great a depth as always. What we have done is expanded the number of pages devoted to sport so that we can provide a service on Premiership clubs, many of which have a strong following in Sussex. On this occasion, the new Premiership page was taken up by the previous night's Littlewood's Cup Action.
As to the Seagulls, we provide comprehensive coverage of the club and are hugely supportive but will not be slavish to the point where we don't report "bad" news about them either on or off the field.
Yours sincerely,
Simon Bradshaw
Editor

 

[Bwian]

All newspapers are shite and I stopped buying them 18 months ago-don't miss 'em one bit!

 

[El Presidente]

Dear Mr Lisher,
Thank you for your email. The Argus continues to cover Sussex sport in as great a depth as always. What we have done is expanded the number of pages devoted to sport so that we can provide a service on Premiership clubs, many of which have a strong following in Sussex. On this occasion, the new Premiership page was taken up by the previous night's Littlewood's Cup Action.
As to the Seagulls, we provide comprehensive coverage of the club and are hugely supportive but will not be slavish to the point where we don't report "bad" news about them either on or off the field.
Yours sincerely,
Simon Bradshaw
Editor

Seems a fair response

 

[South Stand Zealot]

Suggestion - could someone with a bit of printing flair get some large stickers made up in Anus colours. These could be distributed all over Sussex.

To go on Anus sale points.

"Not for Sale Today. FREE !!!"

This is what I call industrial/economic sabotage.

Bradshaw is by stature a small man. But by nature a hugely arrogant **** !!!

Let's shaft the little bastard just as he's shafting us by running these ghastly Mandy pieces.

 

[London Irish]

It was bad but oh so predictable headline writing. The article itself was reasonable enough, coming from a failry innocent and relevant question - have there been any offers for division two's top scorer in the transfer window? But the answer was no, and the headline bore no relation to the content of the article. Not Naylor's fault probably as I don't think he writes the headlines, but for crying out loud the sports editor (or whoever wrote the headline) should be shot.

Well said, Deano's Right Foot, you are a small oasis of sensible comment in this desert of a thread.

I have to admit to sniggering when I saw this particular Argus back page.

I made a special point of showing it to a particular Albion fan I know, a guy who hasn't been a regular since Goldstone because of various reasons. He cringed when I showed it to him because one of his jobs used to be laying out and headlining the back page splashes of the Portsmouth News. Seeing the Argus headline about Leon Knight, he was brought out in a cold sweat about the many times he had to write back-page headlines for stories that were patently not worth being placed there. On one occasion he had to come up with a 96-point headline about there being 200 tickets left to sell in one of the more uninhabitable Fratton Park stands.........

This is an occupational hazard of evening regionals - you don't have a strong enough story to lead the back page, and so the pressure is on the headline writer to "sex it up" a bit. Not defensible of course, but it is fairly common thing throughout local journalism and I guess if the Argus Sports editor had chosen to lead on some Premiership club news, or the Bears, or Haywards Heath rugby, that would also have been taken by many on NSC as a sign of the Argus's lack of commitment to the Albion.

The sports editor does set Naylor a stiff target of coming up EVERY DAY with a story worthy to lead the Argus back page. My perception is that Naylor does a good job in meeting that requirement, nearly every day there is some interesting team news that it breaks first. I would say the Argus is required reading for anyone who follows the Albion, and I'm amazed those people who say they read it without paying for it cannot spot the mixed message they are giving out. Why read it at all if it's total crap?

It personally doesn't bother me that Naylor doesn't litter his copy with "C'mon the Albion" phrases. If you want that stuff, you can read the excellent reports from guys like Simon, it is pointless confusing the objectivity of a journalist with the partizanship of a fanzine writer.

What I want from Naylor is:
1) Good factual summary of games and the major analytical points arising from them;
2) News broken quickly about team changes or shifts in management thinking about selection and tactics;
3) Revealing interviews with players that give some insight into their personality and motivations (the one he did with Leon Knight a couple of months ago was a gem, also that one with Chippy living in a caravan was a great example of how he gets players to open up).

Naylor, for me, scores well in all these 3 areas.

Naylor represents the kind of journalism at the Argus we should be encouraging, not slagging off. Unlike most Argus journalists, he has demonstrated his commitment to his patch by staying in his current job for a long while now. This is rare in local journalism, where often people move on after a couple of years. That is the kind of "loyalty" we should be looking for, rather than a few cheap "C'mon the Albion" comments. That means, unlike most Argus journalists, his contacts book is full and he can address his subject matter with expertise and experience. If the Argus has had problems over the last 20 years, it is precisely because they haven't had enough of that kind of experienced writer.

I haven't met Andy Naylor (that's for people on here who might think I'm his mum), but I do know a few London-based sportswriters, who whenever I ask them about their views on Naylor, say he is well regarded among his peers.

 

[b.w.2.]

No, sorry... he constantly writes stories designed to undermine the Albion... especially bad when we were vying with Stoke (his team) to avoid relagation from div 1...

Zamora will leave (for about 2 year before he actually did)
Coppell, likewise...
Cullip will leave... wrong!...
and now... with the wit and imagination of a brick...

I know...
Knight will leave..

Makes John Vinicombe look like the Bard of Stratford...

I suspect his #loyalty# is driven by the fact that he can't get a job anywhere else..

 

[London Irish]

No, sorry... he constantly writes stories designed to undermine the Albion... especially bad when we were vying with Stoke (his team) to avoid relagation from div 1...

Zamora will leave (for about 2 year before he actually did)
Coppell, likewise...
Cullip will leave... wrong!...
and now... with the wit and imagination of a brick...

I know...
Knight will leave..

Makes John Vinicombe look like the Bard of Stratford...

I suspect his #loyalty# is driven by the fact that he can't get a job anywhere else..

BW2, and his back-page story today about Benjamin being happy here and wanting to extend his loan stay, that fits in where to Naylor's evil masterplan??

 

[Gwylan]

This is an occupational hazard of evening regionals - you don't have a strong enough story to lead the back page, and so the pressure is on the headline writer to "sex it up" a bit. Not defensible of course, but it is fairly common thing throughout local journalism and I guess if the Argus Sports editor had chosen to lead on some Premiership club news, or the Bears, or Haywards Heath rugby, that would also have been taken by many on NSC as a sign of the Argus's lack of commitment to the Albion.

The sports editor does set Naylor a stiff target of coming up EVERY DAY with a story worthy to lead the Argus back page. My perception is that Naylor does a good job in meeting that requirement, nearly every day there is some interesting team news that it breaks first. I would say the Argus is required reading for anyone who follows the Albion, and I'm amazed those people who say they read it without paying for it cannot spot the mixed message they are giving out. Why read it at all if it's total crap?

It personally doesn't bother me that Naylor doesn't litter his copy with "C'mon the Albion" phrases. If you want that stuff, you can read the excellent reports from guys like Simon, it is pointless confusing the objectivity of a journalist with the partizanship of a fanzine writer.

What I want from Naylor is:
1) Good factual summary of games and the major analytical points arising from them;
2) News broken quickly about team changes or shifts in management thinking about selection and tactics;
3) Revealing interviews with players that give some insight into their personality and motivations (the one he did with Leon Knight a couple of months ago was a gem, also that one with Chippy living in a caravan was a great example of how he gets players to open up).

Naylor, for me, scores well in all these 3 areas.

Naylor represents the kind of journalism at the Argus we should be encouraging, not slagging off. Unlike most Argus journalists, he has demonstrated his commitment to his patch by staying in his current job for a long while now. This is rare in local journalism, where often people move on after a couple of years. That is the kind of "loyalty" we should be looking for, rather than a few cheap "C'mon the Albion" comments. That means, unlike most Argus journalists, his contacts book is full and he can address his subject matter with expertise and experience. If the Argus has had problems over the last 20 years, it is precisely because they haven't had enough of that kind of experienced writer.

I haven't met Andy Naylor (that's for people on here who might think I'm his mum), but I do know a few London-based sportswriters, who whenever I ask them about their views on Naylor, say he is well regarded among his peers.

Well said LI. I see nothing particularly wrong with Naylor who seems a very competent journalist. I'd agree that some of the headlines have been sensationalist but as others have pointed out, Naylor doesn't write the headlines.

And as LI says, he will be put under pressure from his sports editor to come up with a different Albion story every day - not always easy. It then becomes necessary to try to make a story out of nothing, not the easiest of tasks (believe me, I've done it).

If the Argus stopped trying to chase these type of Albion stories and only reported big news then you lot would be moaning that the Albion coverage was inadequate.

I've never met Naylor either and I hold no brief for the Argus, which I think has been crap for years (and the redesigned one I saw wasn't much better) but I think that the sports coverage is OK, not brilliant perhaps, but I've seen worse.

 

[Falmer Dream]

pressure is on the headline writer to "sex it up"

We blame it on intelligence and the BBC. Love Tony and Alastair xxx

 

[Lady Bracknell]

We need many more pages of Man United and Chelsea. Sorry, I forgot - NSC doesn't do sarcasm

Sorry, DO, although sarcasm might be the lowest form of wit it's usually my stock in trade so wish to plead not guilty to the "NSC doesn't "do" it assertion! It's just that your glowing testimonial made me wonder whether you'd rejoined the Newsquest ranks!

Journalists have to be impartial (not that this means dispassionate) and it's difficult filling the sports pages on a provincial daily paper. As people have said, there is a tremendous difference between the subjectivity of fanzine-type writing and the necessary objectivity of sports reporting. Given all these challenges I'd love to hail Andy Naylor as a committed provincial sports reporter who has no agenda other than writing saleable, relevant and interesting copy. And, of course, hail the Argus as the fearless campaigning organ that knows the difference between impartiality, objectivity and winding up the Albion.

However, an interesting conversation with Steve Coppell, last summer left me with the impression that too much wholehearted adulation might be somewhat misplaced.

 

[Storer68]

Why do they think they need to reflect what the Premiership is doing. The Premiership gets a shed load of coverage every day and i can't think that anyone will buy the Argus to find out how Middesbrough are doing, any more than anyone would buy the Journal in Newcastle to find out how the Albion are getting on

It should remember who its readers are it is the Brighton Evening Argus and as such should reflect what is happening in Brighton and NOT try and ape the Evening Standard.

This smacks more of a "group edit" where all the group's paper's will take standard and centrally produced copy from PA which will appear in all the group's papers.