[News] Amazon to Stop Accepting UK Issued Visa Credit Cards from January

[nicko31]

Stopped using Amazon on principle 3 years ago. Don't understand why anyone wouldn't buy what they need from elsewhere.

Closest I've got to buying anything in recent year was taking up a months free prime membership to watch Clarkson's farm. Can't stand them...

 

[ChickenBaltiPie]

tech changes? a line of code in accepted payment method. 5 minute job (plus a week regression testing)

Although a hugely naive exaggeration, the main issue will be the commercial and legal negotiations which can go on and on and on for months at the very very least (more accurately years) if this is where they’re at presently. Will likely be a year minimum before anything changes.

 

[beorhthelm]

Stopped using Amazon on principle 3 years ago. Don't understand why anyone wouldn't buy what they need from elsewhere.

often cheaper, or not available elsewhere, and i cant stress this advantage enough, delivered to my door usually within 24 hrs.

 

[Weststander]

This is my first thought. Amazon holding Visa to ransom. Conversations I guess have happened but Visa didn't give enough (or any) ground on their fees so let's up the ante.

Typical Bezos. There's never enough money for me.

Just covered by a city finance expert on LBC. Here's the difinitive information:

- Visa have increased their charges to Amazon from 0.3% to 1.5%. A price rise of 400%.
- Using the opportunity of our departure from the EU to do so, no longer governed by a regulation.
- Visa's annual profits were already $11b.
- It's a global spat between them, this was already brewing in other jurisdictions.

Visa are colossal too. Definitely not a case of David versus Goliath,

 

[Greavsey]

Although a hugely naive exaggeration, the main issue will be the commercial and legal negotiations which can go on and on and on for months at the very very least (more accurately years) if this is where they’re at presently. Will likely be a year minimum before anything changes.

Exactly. Having worked in the corporate world for my whole career, nothing happens in a hurry. There are layers and layers of the organisation to get through before it becomes a simple five minute code job!

 

[Shropshire Seagull]

Exactly. Having worked in the corporate world for my whole career, nothing happens in a hurry. There are layers and layers of the organisation to get through before it becomes a simple five minute code job!

Yeah but, no but, yeah but - we all work to AGILE now - "5 minute job" maybe an exaggeration but we've seen the likes of HMRC implement significant system changes & new systems when reacting to things live covid19.

It can be done [where there is a will] in a hurry ....

 

[hampshirebrightonboy]

Yeah but, no but, yeah but - we all work to AGILE now - "5 minute job" maybe an exaggeration but we've seen the likes of HMRC implement significant system changes & new systems when reacting to things live covid19.

It can be done [where there is a will] in a hurry ....

Should just be config/ database change and restart.
Should be quick if the top bosses want it done

 

[Denis]

As a relevant aside, NatWest Group is currently switching all 16m debit card customers from Visa to Mastercard at renewal. Visa seem to be losing a bit of traction in the UK.

First Direct has recently done this too.

 

[Postman Pat]

Yeah but, no but, yeah but - we all work to AGILE now - "5 minute job" maybe an exaggeration but we've seen the likes of HMRC implement significant system changes & new systems when reacting to things live covid19.

It can be done [where there is a will] in a hurry ....

Apparently Amazon deploy a code change every 11.7 seconds.

I would anticipate that the config of which card providers are supported in each territory will be a pretty simple flick of a switch. This isn't removing Visa Credit completely just for the UK market. I wouldn't be hardcoding that in if I was in charge, would want to be able to quickly manage that just in case.

 

[Shropshire Seagull]

Apparently Amazon deploy a code change every 11.7 seconds.

I would anticipate that the config of which card providers are supported in each territory will be a pretty simple flick of a switch. This isn't removing Visa Credit completely just for the UK market. I wouldn't be hardcoding that in if I was in charge, would want to be able to quickly manage that just in case.

Well, that's good and bad IMHO - good that Amazon clearly have grasped the DevOps approach and are able to deploy code as CI [continuous integration]. But maybe slightly worrying that the code needs to be changed so frequently. At that velocity, must be way more bug fixes than enhancements Shirley?

Or are the calling price change/updates code changes?

 

[Husty]

Just covered by a city finance expert on LBC. Here's the difinitive information:

- Visa have increased their charges to Amazon from 0.3% to 1.5%. A price rise of 400%.
- Using the opportunity of our departure from the EU to do so, no longer governed by a regulation.
- Visa's annual profits were already $11b.
- It's a global spat between them, this was already brewing in other jurisdictions.

Visa are colossal too. Definitely not a case of David versus Goliath,

This isn't quite right, it's 1.5% on transactions processed in the EU. Amazon COULD process their transactions in the UK and pay a lower rate still.

Why do Amazon want to process in the EU? To dodge UK tax of course. It's not all VISA's fault...

 

[Wardy's twin]

tech changes? a line of code in accepted payment method. 5 minute job (plus a week regression testing)

I would have thought it was Just an entry in a lookup table rather than code so would be very simple and quick to implement

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Totally irrelevant. AMEX made a deal acceptable to AMAZON. They don’t have the same Monopoly (arrogance) that VISA have and obv met in the middle. AMEX offer a HUGE amount of incentive above and beyond simply processing small value trans for the masses and nothing more. Not an exaggeration. AMEX offer endless additional services and benefits to card members and merchants.

A slightly strange rant given I was talking about Mastercard. I can only assume you are either a very loyal employee of AMEX or an equally loyal customer. Mastercard run both Amazon's credit card and rewards scheme .... not AMEX.

 

[Superphil]

Interesting move, considering Amex is always the one perceived to have the highest fees!

When in my experience it is in fact the lowest of all of them.

 

[dazzer6666]

Exactly. Having worked in the corporate world for my whole career, nothing happens in a hurry. There are layers and layers of the organisation to get through before it becomes a simple five minute code job!

Yep - this is nothing to do with 'code', and if an agreement on fees was reached Amazon would switch Visa back on (or vice versa) in an absolute instant. The announcement is bound to be the culmination of months of (failed) negotiation and it's now 'who blinks first' - but both are big enough not to blink at all - they'll survive without each other but Visa have more to lose I suspect as the vast majority of Amazon users will simply switch cards.

 

[Weststander]

This isn't quite right, it's 1.5% on transactions processed in the EU. Amazon COULD process their transactions in the UK and pay a lower rate still.

Why do Amazon want to process in the EU? To dodge UK tax of course. It's not all VISA's fault...

Here’s the full timeline:

1. VISA and Mastercard exploited their incredible duopoly by charging up to 1.5% in the EU in interchange charges. Here’s the EU draft at that time https://ec.europa.eu/competition/publications/factsheet_interchange_fees_en.pdf.
2. The EU tackled this is anti-trust legislation, capping it at 0.3%.
3. VISA took the opportunity of the our departure from the EU to raise charges here to 1.5%.https://news.sky.com/story/visa-to-hike-interchange-fees-for-uk-customers-in-post-brexit-move-12247818

Amazon wasn’t mentioned in any of the above at the time, they’re just one of 10,000’s businesses affected by that rollercoaster.

But they are now, as they’re ditching the use of VISA credit cards in several jurisdictions in the world.

Agreed about Amazon but that’s a separate point, they’re tax avoiders, full stop.



https://news.sky.com/story/visa-to-...for-uk-customers-in-post-brexit-move-12247818

 

[Deleted member 37369]

Here’s the full timeline:

1. VISA and Mastercard exploited their incredible duopoly by charging up to 1.5% in the EU in interchange charges. Here’s the EU draft at that time https://ec.europa.eu/competition/publications/factsheet_interchange_fees_en.pdf.
2. The EU tackled this is anti-trust legislation, capping it at 0.3%.
3. VISA took the opportunity of the our departure from the EU to raise charges here to 1.5%.https://news.sky.com/story/visa-to-hike-interchange-fees-for-uk-customers-in-post-brexit-move-12247818

Amazon wasn’t mentioned in any of the above at the time, they’re just one of 10,000’s businesses affected by that rollercoaster.

But they are now, as they’re ditching the use of VISA credit cards in several jurisdictions in the world.

Agreed about Amazon but that’s a separate point, they’re tax avoiders, full stop.



https://news.sky.com/story/visa-to-...for-uk-customers-in-post-brexit-move-12247818

Just read the Sky News piece ... 'Visa to hike interchange fees for UK customers ...'

It says at the bottom ... "The move to increase interchange fees will bring it into line with MasterCard, its rival payments group, which announced a similar move in January".

If this is the case then I'm confused why Amazon are just targeting Visa ... unless I've read this wrong?!

 

[ChickenBaltiPie]

Just covered by a city finance expert on LBC. Here's the difinitive information:

- Visa have increased their charges to Amazon from 0.3% to 1.5%. A price rise of 400%.
- Using the opportunity of our departure from the EU to do so, no longer governed by a regulation.
- Visa's annual profits were already $11b.
- It's a global spat between them, this was already brewing in other jurisdictions.

Visa are colossal too. Definitely not a case of David versus Goliath,

FYI 1.5% isn’t high for the industry. 0.3% is Infact INSANELY LOW!! Which puts a whole different perspective on it. 1.5% is approx what all merchants pay for VISA too BTW.

 

[ChickenBaltiPie]

Yeah but, no but, yeah but - we all work to AGILE now - "5 minute job" maybe an exaggeration but we've seen the likes of HMRC implement significant system changes & new systems when reacting to things live covid19.

It can be done [where there is a will] in a hurry ....

‘Agile’ is the aspiration of ALL companies but supertankers like Amazon & VISA?! haha Forget it! Agile is true of minnow start ups exclusively.

 

[ChickenBaltiPie]

Apparently Amazon deploy a code change every 11.7 seconds.

I would anticipate that the config of which card providers are supported in each territory will be a pretty simple flick of a switch. This isn't removing Visa Credit completely just for the UK market. I wouldn't be hardcoding that in if I was in charge, would want to be able to quickly manage that just in case.

The ‘code change’ is a piece of p!ss, that is not the issue and is the smallest part of the challenge. The bureaucracy involved in a change like that however is never ending!