[Finance] Advise with recruitment

[LockStock]

The one thing that really hacked me off about recruitment agents when I used them over 10 years ago was that when they wanted me to go for an interview they were my best pal, but then if I didn't get the job they couldn't be more silent. A 10 second message from them was too much trouble. I had to assume that the application had been unsuccessful. No news was bad news. Shoddy behaviour.

And then there was the one that found me a job but played too hard ball with the salary I was after and caused it to fall through.

I'd always now favour directly approaching companies - and I know people who have got employment this way.

Yeah agreed, kind of how we ended up in this situation.

Once the guy turned down the offer, they couldn't be any less interested. Then suddenly, get an invoice out of the blue.

 

[BrickTamland]

I work in recruitment.

If you haven’t signed any terms then they haven’t a leg to stand on. If you have, pay up.

Terms are an actual contract, you can’t agree to them simply by proxy of them sending over the candidate. No agency worth their salt would send a candidate (with name and details) without terms being agreed first.

 

[Easy 10]

I work in recruitment.

If you haven’t signed any terms then they haven’t a leg to stand on. If you have, pay up.

Terms are an actual contract, you can’t agree to them simply by proxy of them sending over the candidate. No agency worth their salt would send a candidate (with name and details) without terms being agreed first.

Thats not entirely correct in my experience.

As @Seagull99 mentioned, if there is evidence of email traffic between the parties which results in an interview / offer being made, particularly if the parties have done business in the past, then although its not exactly signed terms it can be an indication of a tacit agreement being in place even if nothing eventually comes of it. If, shortly after, the guy then re-interviews without the involvement of the recruitment company, and ends up taking the job, the the recruiters will have a case there of having made the initial introduction.

It sounds like this particular company has gone in two-footed though which has understandably got the OP's back up. Having seen these cases, the way forward is usually compromise - either negotiate a reduction of the fee, or pay it in full with an understanding of having a % discount on any future business (in writing of course). Then both parties can move on hopefully with a business relationship still intact.

Sounds like it may have gone beyond that already though if they've got the no win no fee-ers involved.

Best of luck to the OP.

 

[Blue3]

It very much depends if you intend using the same agency in the future, first Ask your employe if they signed anything to the effect and do they have a copy is it dated and when did they part company with the agency, call the agency in for a meeting everything is negotiable

 

[WATFORD zero]

Thats not entirely correct in my experience.

As @Seagull99 mentioned, if there is evidence of email traffic between the parties which results in an interview / offer being made, particularly if the parties have done business in the past, then although its not exactly signed terms it can be an indication of a tacit agreement being in place even if nothing eventually comes of it. If, shortly after, the guy then re-interviews without the involvement of the recruitment company, and ends up taking the job, the the recruiters will have a case there of having made the initial introduction.

It sounds like this particular company has gone in two-footed though which has understandably got the OP's back up. Having seen these cases, the way forward is usually compromise - either negotiate a reduction of the fee, or pay it in full with an understanding of having a % discount on any future business (in writing of course). Then both parties can move on hopefully with a business relationship still intact.

Sounds like it may have gone beyond that already though if they've got the no win no fee-ers involved.

Best of luck to the OP.

I agree with all you've said but I believe from very early on the OP was prepared to compromise and pay a fee but as you state, them diving in two footed is the cause of this problem.

I've worked with some great recruitment agencies and paid a fair (and often not cheap) fee for a good service. Whatever the business quality costs, but none of them would ever have done what this lot have done

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

Shirely the fact they’ve gone no win no fee suggests their not to at confident in getting a result and have probably tried this with others in the past

 

[raymondo]

Superb stuff. The legend that was BHAExpress.

He was once behind in a queue and I knew it was him because he was having a conversation in exactly the same way he posted.

Really need a "hall of fame" on here.

BHAExpress: "what's it like to be a leper?"
Oh my word!

 

[junior]

Just been talking to Mrs Junior about this. She is the director of a Recruitment Agency with a £30 million a year turnover and she just said much the same as what the others have said. If you haven't signed anything, don't pay anything. Full stop.

And she also asked me to find out if your line of business is IT? If so, can she send you some CV's?

 

[Easy 10]

Just been talking to Mrs Junior about this. She is the director of a Recruitment Agency with a £30 million a year turnover and she just said much the same as what the others have said. If you haven't signed anything, don't pay anything. Full stop.

And she also asked me to find out if your line of business is IT? If so, can she send you some CV's?

Shirely the fact they’ve gone no win no fee suggests their not to at confident in getting a result and have probably tried this with others in the past

The fact they've gone down this route seemingly early doors sounds rather strange to me. Usually, as a recruitment company, you always want to maintain mutually beneficial business relationships with clients, not piss them off. In my experience, negotiation and compromise is always the way, not just hitting the "nuclear option" as this lot seem to have done. The business I work for has NEVER appointed no win no fee ambulance-chasers.

If after discussion between the two parties there is still total deadlock on the fee, with no compromise on either side, then the small claims court is where it ends up. Pretty rare though. It sounds like the company the OP is dealing with is just trying to bully their way to getting it paid asap, but they DO have a case - having originally introduced the guy to the OP's business, who then initially turned them down, but then took the job a couple of months later whilst cutting out the agencies initial introduction....if the agency have email trails showing their initial involvement in the process, then a case can be made.

My advice would be to ignore the no win no fee monkeys, pick up the phone to the agency, and come to a compromise deal.

 

[albionant]

The agency introdced the candidate to you after you engaged their services?
If the candidate had initally accepted your offer, you would have been happy to pay the fee?
He has now accepted your offer and the fee is a lot less than it was?
Isn't this a win win here?

 

[BrickTamland]

Thats not entirely correct in my experience.

As @Seagull99 mentioned, if there is evidence of email traffic between the parties which results in an interview / offer being made, particularly if the parties have done business in the past, then although its not exactly signed terms it can be an indication of a tacit agreement being in place even if nothing eventually comes of it. If, shortly after, the guy then re-interviews without the involvement of the recruitment company, and ends up taking the job, the the recruiters will have a case there of having made the initial introduction.

It sounds like this particular company has gone in two-footed though which has understandably got the OP's back up. Having seen these cases, the way forward is usually compromise - either negotiate a reduction of the fee, or pay it in full with an understanding of having a % discount on any future business (in writing of course). Then both parties can move on hopefully with a business relationship still intact.

Sounds like it may have gone beyond that already though if they've got the no win no fee-ers involved.

Best of luck to the OP.

If they have done business in the past, then pay up.

But if this was a first into and no terms had been agreed then is simply bad practice on the agencies part.

I would never let anyone on my team share details / set up interviews until that side of things is watertight

 

[Easy 10]

If they have done business in the past, then pay up.

But if this was a first into and no terms had been agreed then is simply bad practice on the agencies part.

I would never let anyone on my team share details / set up interviews until that side of things is watertight

I agree, it is bad practice not to nail things down with signed Terms. Relying on email exchanges to provide potential candidates to a business, especially if its the first engagement between the parties, can easily lead to problematic cases and disputes like this.

 

[LockStock]

No business done in the past, defiantly will not be any in the future.

If anyone can recommend someone for the legal side of this, I would be very grateful. With the stress they have caused me, I'd rather spend the cost of their fee making sure they do not get a penny.

 

[Weststander]

No business done in the past, defiantly will not be any in the future.

If anyone can recommend someone for the legal side of this, I would be very grateful. With the stress they have caused me, I'd rather spend the cost of their fee making sure they do not get a penny.

Dean Wilson of Seven Dials are excellent. But obviously solicitors fees at £250 - £400 per hour will soon eat in this. Fixed quotes for each specific stage eg for a letter, if you can, is the way to manage that.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Dean Wilson of Seven Dials are excellent. But obviously solicitors fees at £250 - £400 per hour will soon eat in this. Fixed quotes for each specific stage eg for a letter, if you can, is the way to manage that.

Seconded.

 

[Happy Exile]

If you've got anyone in HR in your company who is a member of CIPD they have a free legal advice line for employment law as one of the benefits. 20 free calls I think from memory. I got the benefit of someone with this when I was a volunteer director of a charity and we needed help on a complex employment law question around an employee. Still paid a local company to have a letter written in the end, but we saved an absolute fortune on consulting and understanding what we were asking for first.

 

[Papak]

@LockStock any update on this?

I was following out of curiosity mainly but do like to know the outcome when I've been hooked so to speak...