advice please NSC regarding my sons school

[hitony]

I have the receipt Hitony.

And a photograph of him wearing that actual watch at the school on that particular day? or even a photo or signed proof of it being that actual watch that went into the box? My point is, there is no proof (or highly unlikely there is) that he was wearing that actual £80 watch on the day / time in question, now in this stupid world we live in where people are scamming and conning everyone, the school have no proof that all the details are as you say they are, probably why the good will gesture offer of £25. If there is 100% proof then yes I guess an insurance claim would be the way forward, I will join the "sending a kid to school with an £80 watch on is pretty dull", club though. Please call me Tony (though, after reading my reply I expect I am being called many things apart from Tony or even hitony! ) (hmmm my enter key is not working)

 

[Westdene Seagull]

thanks goldstone, just spoke to the better half as she took the call from the school. the offer was £25 without prejudice (sp?). is that basically saying that here's 25 quid and shut the ffff up as we are not admitting any guilt?

Yes, that's exactly what that's saying, unfortunately. Just because that's what they're offering doesn't mean you have to accept it, ofc...

Just to be a little more specific. Because the offer is "without prejudice" you won't be able to mention it if you go to court ( and nor will they ).

 

[Hampden Park]

And a photograph of him wearing that actual watch at the school on that particular day? or even a photo or signed proof of it being that actual watch that went into the box? My point is, there is no proof (or highly unlikely there is) that he was wearing that actual £80 watch on the day / time in question, now in this stupid world we live in where people are scamming and conning everyone, the school have no proof that all the details are as you say they are, probably why the good will gesture offer of £25. If there is 100% proof then yes I guess an insurance claim would be the way forward, I will join the "sending a kid to school with an £80 watch on is pretty dull", club though. Please call me Tony (though, after reading my reply I expect I am being called many things apart from Tony or even hitony! ) (hmmm my enter key is not working)

hitony? more like Judge Judy M'lud

he only had one watch. he wore it to school. he took it off and put it in the safe box whilst going to a P.E. lesson. returned from the lesson to retrieve his watch from the box. no watch there. please read the other posts M'lud, your Honour, blah blah blah Tony.

 

[Hampden Park]

Just to be a little more specific. Because the offer is "without prejudice" you won't be able to mention it if you go to court ( and nor will they ).

noted

 

[hitony]

hitony? more like Judge Judy M'lud

he only had one watch. he wore it to school. he took it off and put it in the safe box whilst going to a P.E. lesson. returned from the lesson to retrieve his watch from the box. no watch there. please read the other posts M'lud, your Honour, blah blah blah Tony.

It is only my opinion to be fair, I have read all the posts, hadn't last night when I did my first post on this as had just got in from a 15 hour day in work.

But your reply above still does not offer any 100% definite proof to either me or the school that the watch in question was the one that went missing does it? I am not being pedant about this, in all honesty I believe you and I don't know you but why should someone else, I am not doubting the issue, as in "went to a PE lesson a watch went in a box etc etc" but why should the school or anyone else come to that, just take your word (or your son's) that the watch was worth that much money?

Insurance fraud is massive nowadays, and having a receipt is just not definite proof that the watch in question was that one! and why should the school / insurers just pay out how much you say? receipt or no receipt. They are bound to defend their side of the situation.

I went to a very good Private School in North London, yes I don't doubt I was privileged, but I remember well my parents not letting me take anything of value to school, I appreciate times have changed with IT and technology coming into schools these days, but I still maintain letting your son wear, what I consider a quite expensive watch is a tad irresponsible, especially when you can buy a good timekeeping and stylish watch for literally a few quid, save the expensive watch for times away from school when it will stay on his wrist and not have to be taken off for PE lessons etc.

As for me being Judge Judy, if you post something like this on an open forum, you will get MANY varied opinions, mine included, if you or anyone else does not agree with my opinion, that's fine.

Maybe a good lesson learnt by all?

 

[nwgull]

It is only my opinion to be fair, I have read all the posts, hadn't last night when I did my first post on this as had just got in from a 15 hour day in work.

But your reply above still does not offer any 100% definite proof to either me or the school that the watch in question was the one that went missing does it? I am not being pedant about this, in all honesty I believe you and I don't know you but why should someone else, I am not doubting the issue, as in "went to a PE lesson a watch went in a box etc etc" but why should the school or anyone else come to that, just take your word (or your son's) that the watch was worth that much money?

Insurance fraud is massive nowadays, and having a receipt is just not definite proof that the watch in question was that one! and why should the school / insurers just pay out how much you say? receipt or no receipt. They are bound to defend their side of the situation.I went to a very good Private School in North London, yes I don't doubt I was privileged, but I remember well my parents not letting me take anything of value to school, I appreciate times have changed with IT and technology coming into schools these days, but I still maintain letting your son wear, what I consider a quite expensive watch is a tad irresponsible, especially when you can buy a good timekeeping and stylish watch for literally a few quid, save the expensive watch for times away from school when it will stay on his wrist and not have to be taken off for PE lessons etc.

As for me being Judge Judy, if you post something like this on an open forum, you will get MANY varied opinions, mine included, if you or anyone else does not agree with my opinion, that's fine.

Maybe a good lesson learnt by all?

Don't the insurers have to have a bit of trust and accept the balance of probability that, if the lad had one watch, then there'd be a good chance that he'd wear it to school? If that wasn't the case, the extra premiums I pay to itemise my watch on my home contents insurance would be worthless, as I never think to establish proof that I'm wearing it when I go out.

For what it's worth, I don't think that £80 is OTT for a 15/16 year old's watch. It's a practical item that is strapped to his wrist nearly all the time and was a chrimbo present that should have lasted him years.

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

I wonder how much the other watches cost. Wouldn't be surprising if the rest were £25 or less.

 

[Nibble]

If he's lost it I'd say it's his own fault for wearing an 80 quid watch. However, it was in the teacher's care and they should have looked after it. If the teacher's were that concerned about him wearing an expensive watch they should have taken it off him at the start of the day and told him not to wear it again.

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

If he's lost it I'd say it's his own fault for wearing an 80 quid watch. However, it was in the teacher's care and they should have looked after it. If the teacher's were that concerned about him wearing an expensive watch they should have taken it off him at the start of the day and told him not to wear it again.

Teacher may not have known the value of the item. The boy almost certainly did.

 

[Don't get me started]

Sorry if I sounded harsh but I would look after your watch if I was a School as I wouldn't want it breaking in PE, I would expect you to comply and I would use best endeavors to look after it. I wouldn't offer a cast iron guarantee of its safety and if I did lose it I wouldn't accept your claim for £80 because if I did that young Herberts Dad in form FU would be coming after us saying that his sons Rolex has gone missing and can he have a few G but would settle for 1500 cash. I would politely suggest that the watch in future is more in the land of casio than swatch

 

[hitony]

Don't the insurers have to have a bit of trust and accept the balance of probability that, if the lad had one watch, then there'd be a good chance that he'd wear it to school? If that wasn't the case, the extra premiums I pay to itemise my watch on my home contents insurance would be worthless, as I never think to establish proof that I'm wearing it when I go out.

For what it's worth, I don't think that £80 is OTT for a 15/16 year old's watch. It's a practical item that is strapped to his wrist nearly all the time and was a chrimbo present that should have lasted him years.

Of course no one thinks of establishing proof of what is being worn prior to going out, but if you knew you were going to school and having a PE lesson that day maybe a bit of common sense would prevail and either wear no watch that day or have a cheap secondary watch for school, if not for just the days you KNOW you have to take it off and give it to a third party for supposed safe keeping. I am sure schools still operate a "lessons time table" these days and a PE lesson does not come as some surprise to the children (though in my day you would have thought it was a surprise, the amount of kids who "Forgot" their PE kit!

As for the second highlighted comment, you are lucky if you live in a world that thinks £80 is not OTT for a 16 year old kid to wear to school, "lucky you" I say.

As for the third highlighted word, it answers itself I think!

 

[Nibble]

Teacher may not have known the value of the item. The boy almost certainly did.

Well, we've all learned a valuable lesson. Well £80 quids worth of a lesson anyway.

 

[hitony]

Sorry if I sounded harsh but I would look after your watch if I was a School as I wouldn't want it breaking in PE, I would expect you to comply and I would use best endeavors to look after it. I wouldn't offer a cast iron guarantee of its safety and if I did lose it I wouldn't accept your claim for £80 because if I did that young Herberts Dad in form FU would be coming after us saying that his sons Rolex has gone missing and can he have a few G but would settle for 1500 cash. I would politely suggest that the watch in future is more in the land of casio than swatch

Thank god for common sense.....THIS!!

 

[nwgull]

Of course no one thinks of establishing proof of what is being worn prior to going out, but if you knew you were going to school and having a PE lesson that day maybe a bit of common sense would prevail and either wear no watch that day or have a cheap secondary watch for school, if not for just the days you KNOW you have to take it off and give it to a third party for supposed safe keeping. I am sure schools still operate a "lessons time table" these days and a PE lesson does not come as some surprise to the children (though in my day you would have thought it was a surprise, the amount of kids who "Forgot" their PE kit!

I'm too old for school unfortunately, but I know that my insurers would pay out if my watch was nicked from the locker at the gym.

As for the second highlighted comment, you are lucky if you live in a world that thinks £80 is not OTT for a 16 year old kid to wear to school, "lucky you" I say.

Nothing to do with luck.

As for the third highlighted word, it answers itself I think!

Yes, nearly all the time, so a much reduced probability. Unlike say a smartphone or an iPod, which I'm sure loads of kids take to school but that are far more likely to fall out of a jacket pocket or be half-inched from a school bag when you're not looking.

 

[Hampden Park]

It is only my opinion to be fair, I have read all the posts, hadn't last night when I did my first post on this as had just got in from a 15 hour day in work.

But your reply above still does not offer any 100% definite proof to either me or the school that the watch in question was the one that went missing does it? I am not being pedant about this, in all honesty I believe you and I don't know you but why should someone else, I am not doubting the issue, as in "went to a PE lesson a watch went in a box etc etc" but why should the school or anyone else come to that, just take your word (or your son's) that the watch was worth that much money?

Insurance fraud is massive nowadays, and having a receipt is just not definite proof that the watch in question was that one! and why should the school / insurers just pay out how much you say? receipt or no receipt. They are bound to defend their side of the situation.

I went to a very good Private School in North London, yes I don't doubt I was privileged, but I remember well my parents not letting me take anything of value to school, I appreciate times have changed with IT and technology coming into schools these days, but I still maintain letting your son wear, what I consider a quite expensive watch is a tad irresponsible, especially when you can buy a good timekeeping and stylish watch for literally a few quid, save the expensive watch for times away from school when it will stay on his wrist and not have to be taken off for PE lessons etc.

As for me being Judge Judy, if you post something like this on an open forum, you will get MANY varied opinions, mine included, if you or anyone else does not agree with my opinion, that's fine.

Maybe a good lesson learnt by all?

thank you for your opinion Tony. I am not partial to making false insurance claims as I consider myself a law abiding citizen. the judge judy reference was because that is the type of answer she would come up with (twas tongue in cheek). my son wore his watch to school, placed it in what he thought was safe custody, (perhaps teacher should have said ' I wouldn't bring expensive items to school in future if I were you lad', did his lesson, came back to get his watch that wasn't there. etc etc. investigation carried out. 'a member of the public' gets box of watches/valuables from the staff room and proceeds to hand them back to pupils who (as it seems) help themselves to watches that are obviously not theirs. as someone mentioned earlier, if it was a £25 casio watch, what offer would I get from the school as it was a (IMO) mistake on their part? its the principle of the whole thing, not the value of the watch. 15/16 year olds have been brought up to trust their teachers but I guess some teachers, in certain schools, cannot be trusted. hey ho. have tried to speak to the deputy head, but, like me, he is probably working (my lunch break btw). I put it on this open forum as I expected and indeed enjoy the comments from fellow human beings.

 

[Theatre of Trees]

A teacher's point of view.

It looks like the PE department at the school had a system for looking after valuables, which means there was certain acceptance that valuables were brought onto the school premises - in this case a watch which is a perfectly acceptable item to possess. Somewhere that system has broken down and i think this is what you need to try and figure out. My conjectured view is that either the PE teacher was inexperienced or that the kids badgered somebody to go and get the watches - hence the member of public part which I find very strange, if they are on the school premises that person has to be attached to the school in some capacity - though within this scenario it may be that the kids badgered an outside contractor/visitor sitting in the staff room to get the box, perhaps innocently wanting to move on to their next lesson or equally with nefarious purposes on behalf of one or two. Of the two views I reckon it may well be the latter as kids generally don't understand the processes behind a number of rules and regulations, their logic being you're in the staff room why can't you get the box and give us our items.

HP - Does your son take PE as a GCSE subject or the non exam core lessons? If it is the latter then you may have one or two undesirables in the class who may have understood how the system worked and saw an opportunity.

All conjecture mind - but I'd keep pressing on who exactly this member of public was and what were they doing on the premises as there are strict rules for being on school property.

 

[Hampden Park]

A teacher's point of view.

It looks like the PE department at the school had a system for looking after valuables, which means there was certain acceptance that valuables were brought onto the school premises - in this case a watch which is a perfectly acceptable item to possess. Somewhere that system has broken down and i think this is what you need to try and figure out. My conjectured view is that either the PE teacher was inexperienced or that the kids badgered somebody to go and get the watches - hence the member of public part which I find very strange, if they are on the school premises that person has to be attached to the school in some capacity - though within this scenario it may be that the kids badgered an outside contractor/visitor sitting in the staff room to get the box, perhaps innocently wanting to move on to their next lesson or equally with nefarious purposes on behalf of one or two. Of the two views I reckon it may well be the latter as kids generally don't understand the processes behind a number of rules and regulations, their logic being you're in the staff room why can't you get the box and give us our items.

HP - Does your son take PE as a GCSE subject or the non exam core lessons? If it is the latter then you may have one or two undesirables in the class who may have understood how the system worked and saw an opportunity.

All conjecture mind - but I'd keep pressing on who exactly this member of public was and what were they doing on the premises as there are strict rules for being on school property.

hello ToT. I think the latter too. I will be asking the school to indeed go into who this 'member of the public' was. my son is taking gcse P.E. and in hindsight he maybe should not have worn his watch that day. I have a sneaky feeling that the school may well be being a little economical with the whole scenario (gut feeling). being ex military and a special needs tutor I would not have allowed this to happen on my watch (excuse the pun). for those that are interested, I will keep you posted.

 

[Nibble]

hello ToT. I think the latter too. I will be asking the school to indeed go into who this 'member of the public' was. my son is taking gcse P.E. and in hindsight he maybe should not have worn his watch that day. I have a sneaky feeling that the school may well be being a little economical with the whole scenario (gut feeling). being ex military and a special needs tutor I would not have allowed this to happen on my watch (excuse the pun). for those that are interested, I will keep you posted.

It kind of has happened on your watch though hasn't it. You sen't your son to school wearing an 80 quid watch. The watch has gone missing. I'd say you were at least 25% to blame.

 

[Theatre of Trees]

hello ToT. I think the latter too. I will be asking the school to indeed go into who this 'member of the public' was. my son is taking gcse P.E. and in hindsight he maybe should not have worn his watch that day. I have a sneaky feeling that the school may well be being a little economical with the whole scenario (gut feeling). being ex military and a special needs tutor I would not have allowed this to happen on my watch (excuse the pun). for those that are interested, I will keep you posted.

From what you've posted I 'd agree the school seem to be hiding something and the member of public part seems to have dug a bigger hole. Out of interest is the head the type who appears in local newspapers regularly?

 

[Hampden Park]

indeed, the dame (oops typo, the same).