[Other Sport] A racist remark

[Bold Seagull]

Watching the cricket recently and saw a piece about the Great Shane Warne talking about beating the `Poms` is that racist ? . And i am an Irishman and don`t consider `Paddy` as racist , and i would be surprised if `Taffy` or `Jock` was considered racist by the Welsh and Scottish . We are getting oh so precious these days .

Pom is thought to have 2 possible origins; from 'Prisoner of His Majesty' with 'POM' supposedly stitched onto newly arriving convict uniforms, or short for pomegranate - the sun burnt colour of new arrivals from Britain (being there was no factor 50). It's never really been thought of as an insult, just like Kiwi or Yank isn't. However, Paki, Kaffir do contain a racist nastiness to them that Pom simply doesn't.

 

[Dave the OAP]

Bernard Manning wasn't on mainstream TV in the seventies either, I don;t think.

But I agree that without context we don't know how racist this was. If we look at seventies TV, we have at one end Alf Garnett, at the other end Private walker calling Private Fraser "Taffy". It's easier to be offended by the former than the latter, but people do apparently get offended by the latter.

If my memory is correct yes he was. Wheeltappers and Shunters and the Comedians were both on mainstream ITV during the 70’s.

 

[TugWilson]

Depends to whom you are presenting yourself as Irish. Given you have sufficient credentials, should you wish to lay claim to that heritage, detractors, even those dressed as leprechauns and proclaiming begorrah, to be sure, can sod off, I would suggest.

I don`t go around waving a flag but if the subject comes up i will take pride in my heritage . Thanks for that made me laugh out loud

 

[Common as Mook]

Pom is thought to have 2 possible origins; from 'Prisoner of His Majesty' with 'POM' supposedly stitched onto newly arriving convict uniforms, or short for pomegranate - the sun burnt colour of new arrivals from Britain (being there was no factor 50). It's never really been thought of as an insult, just like Kiwi or Yank isn't. However, Paki, Kaffir do contain a racist nastiness to them that Pom simply doesn't.

I cannot believe that context and connotations still have be explained time and time again to people. It's wilful ignorance to slide their nasty little views in...

 

[Live by the sea]

I have to disagree with you here. I think the world is a better place for not having a comedian punching down and making shit jokes based on people's gender, nationality or race. To be fair though I thought the same 30 years ago. I much prefer the comedy that is around these days.

The issue is most of the comedy nowadays isn’t funny . Comedy is funny when you are able to tell a story and highlight the differences between people even if it is a sterotype . Stereotypes done in a non nasty way are very funny . Little Britain and come fly with me are good examples of clever stereotypes done in a gentle way that are very funny because we all recognise them .

Cancel culture is our society going backwards . We should have different opinions and be able to debate them as long as they are within acceptable boundaries. For example JK Rowling stance on trans issues is broadly in line I expect with what 99% of the public think and agree with but she has been shouted down by an aggressive minority on social media . Completely unacceptable.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

Couldn't agree more.
The world is a sadder place compared to 30 years ago.
The likes of Frank Carson and Bernard Manning and Charlie Williams would be comedians who would never have made the grade on mainstream TV sadly.

Sent from my CPH2195 using Tapatalk

I love seeing live comedy, it's a great night out. I will dip my toe in the debate. I don't want to hear openly racist, sexist or homophobic acts but it has gone too far.

It's actually gone the opposite way. Nearly every young comedian appears to a lesbian, gay or black person. The majority of their acts are purely about them with very little comedy about broader life. Though I have no issue with any of them I believe it's down to the fact they are able to be far more risque than white hetrosexual people, who's material is considered limited for fear of being accused of being racist, sexist or homophobic.

I don't know if it's that ,TV producers find it easier to put say, a gay comedian on TV. I've seen many now on TV, in pubs and clubs, most have good acts but many I wonder how the hell they got their break.

 

[BadFish]

The issue is most of the comedy nowadays isn’t funny . Comedy is funny when you are able to tell a story and highlight the differences between people even if it is a sterotype . Stereotypes done in a non nasty way are very funny . Little Britain and come fly with me are good examples of clever stereotypes done in a gentle way that are very funny because we all recognise them .

This is a subjective opinion and one that obviously guide your taste in comedy. I am not going to say that you are wrong because it is what you like. Personally I don't find the whole stereotype thing that funny. Little Britain made me laugh at first but I soon tired of it. To be fair I never gave Come Fly with Me much of a go but I saw I didn't find funny.

For what it is worth though, I think there is a great deal of funny comedy around at the moment. Stand-up may be in a better state than it ever has been. I am not suggesting that everything is great but there is certainly enough around to keep me laughing.

Cancel culture is our society going backwards . We should have different opinions and be able to debate them as long as they are within acceptable boundaries. For example JK Rowling stance on trans issues is broadly in line I expect with what 99% of the public think and agree with but she has been shouted down by an aggressive minority on social media . Completely unacceptable.

I am not keen to take a left turn and discuss cancel culture but I disagree here too. . I am still yet to see more than a handful of decent examples of actual cancel culture and I don't really believe it is that much of an issue - your example of JK Rowling is a good one. a quick look on Twitter shows that she still tweets and has a book out next month. There also seems to be a fairly regular release of Harry Potter spins off around (To be honest, I have no idea how involved she is in those).

It is not society going backwards it is more like society moving forward in the cyclical way it always has. History shows a constant revolving change in society's attitudes from conservative and puritan to more free and Cavalier outlook. We are now in a transition between the cavalier freedom of the last few decades since the 60's and a more puritan outlook. This is compounded by our technology giving more people a voice to express their ideas. I don't spend much time on Twitter and don't really follow the disagreements between Rowling and her critics but a quick glance shows that she is giving as good as she gets and is quite happy to keep the discussion going. Cancelled she certainly is not.

Back to comedy though, If we were all the same the world would be a very boring place. Each to their own I believe.

 

[TugWilson]

Pom is thought to have 2 possible origins; from 'Prisoner of His Majesty' with 'POM' supposedly stitched onto newly arriving convict uniforms, or short for pomegranate - the sun burnt colour of new arrivals from Britain (being there was no factor 50). It's never really been thought of as an insult, just like Kiwi or Yank isn't. However, Paki, Kaffir do contain a racist nastiness to them that Pom simply doesn't.

Well `Yank` or `Yankee` is definitely a derisive term,as i`m sure you know the South called all the Northern states `Damn Yankee`s`during the civil war and even up to today. I once made the mistake of calling an American a `Yank` and he told me they consider it highly offensive .

 

[herecomesaregular]

Well `Yank` or `Yankee` is definitely a derisive term,as i`m sure you know the South called all the Northern states `Damn Yankee`s`during the civil war and even up to today. I once made the mistake of calling an American a `Yank` and he told me they consider it highly offensive .

Yet we still have the New York Yankees?

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I love seeing live comedy, it's a great night out. I will dip my toe in the debate. I don't want to hear openly racist, sexist or homophobic acts but it has gone too far.

It's actually gone the opposite way. Nearly every young comedian appears to a lesbian, gay or black person. The majority of their acts are purely about them with very little comedy about broader life. Though I have no issue with any of them I believe it's down to the fact they are able to be far more risque than white hetrosexual people, who's material is considered limited for fear of being accused of being racist, sexist or homophobic.

I don't know if it's that ,TV producers find it easier to put say, a gay comedian on TV. I've seen many now on TV, in pubs and clubs, most have good acts but many I wonder how the hell they got their break.

Just like they predicted in the 70s, it used to be illegal, and now it's compulsory.

All these people having long and successful careers, appearing in front of packed audiences, goes to show that we are losing the battle against woke cancel culture.

This thread seems to have vacuumed up all those it was meant to vacuum up.

 

[Bold Seagull]

I love seeing live comedy, it's a great night out. I will dip my toe in the debate. I don't want to hear openly racist, sexist or homophobic acts but it has gone too far.

It's actually gone the opposite way. Nearly every young comedian appears to a lesbian, gay or black person. The majority of their acts are purely about them with very little comedy about broader life. Though I have no issue with any of them I believe it's down to the fact they are able to be far more risque than white hetrosexual people, who's material is considered limited for fear of being accused of being racist, sexist or homophobic.

I don't know if it's that ,TV producers find it easier to put say, a gay comedian on TV. I've seen many now on TV, in pubs and clubs, most have good acts but many I wonder how the hell they got their break.

What's changed is the number of channels we have and the ability to give alternative comedy more air time. We have more comedy panel shows, comedy streaming services etc. etc. It's not just 4 channels anymore where you needed broad appeal. I just don't think you'd have seen anything but mainstream comedians in times past. Now good and bad various acts get air time that would never have been broadcast before. Your Michael McKintyre, Jimmy Carr, Stephen Fry, John Bishop, Lee Mack etc. still dominate the mainstream though, not a lot has changed in that regard.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

What's changed is the number of channels we have and the ability to give alternative comedy more air time. We have more comedy panel shows, comedy streaming services etc. etc. It's not just 4 channels anymore where you needed broad appeal. I just don't think you'd have seen anything but mainstream comedians in times past. Now good and bad various acts get air time that would never have been broadcast before. Your Michael McKintyre, Jimmy Carr, Stephen Fry, John Bishop, Lee Mack etc. still dominate the mainstream though, not a lot has changed in that regard.

I enjoy going to pre-tour shows, usually in a small theatre or function room in a pub. You get to see the raw material, with the comedian asking if it works or if it's too risque, you see the comedian trying to hone their show. I've seen a number of the current TV comedians this way. Some are still using the same material a decade later but many you appreciate how hard it is to get a running theme through their show.

In the past I've seen Chubby Brown and Frankie Boyle. I wouldn't go now as their acts are just shock material and after about 10 minutes of their show the rest is just a regurgitation of the beginning.

I got to see Billy Connolly twice and he was superb.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

What's changed is the number of channels we have and the ability to give alternative comedy more air time. We have more comedy panel shows, comedy streaming services etc. etc. It's not just 4 channels anymore where you needed broad appeal. I just don't think you'd have seen anything but mainstream comedians in times past. Now good and bad various acts get air time that would never have been broadcast before. Your Michael McKintyre, Jimmy Carr, Stephen Fry, John Bishop, Lee Mack etc. still dominate the mainstream though, not a lot has changed in that regard.

Exactly the same as 'contemporary' music.

As part of the woke thread-derailing agenda, I'll add that it's possible to generate a live audience, then make and sell your own music via your own web site these days. You'll never 'chart' by why worry? VNVNation have been doing this for years.

Back in the 60s I recall a young David Bowie being intereviewed about how he saw his career in 5 years. 'Hopefully cabaret' he replied. The ultimate, then would have been a Las Vagas residency. But I would imagine he had little more than the occasional Sunday Night at The Palladium, and a line of lucrative businessman's dinners in mind. All arranged by his manager. Everyone needed a good manager.

Don't let on but.....I have a sneaking suspicion that.....things may have changed since the 1960s. Even more disconcerting.....I have a feeling that things continue to change, and that generally we don't realize, till it's too late, and we are all forced to dress up in our mother's clothes, and talk like transgender rastafarians.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I enjoy going to pre-tour shows, usually in a small theatre or function room in a pub. You get to see the raw material, with the comedian asking if it works or if it's too risque, you see the comedian trying to hone their show. I've seen a number of the current TV comedians this way. Some are still using the same material a decade later but many you appreciate how hard it is to get a running theme through their show.

In the past I've seen Chubby Brown and Frankie Boyle. I wouldn't go now as their acts are just shock material and after about 10 minutes of their show the rest is just a regurgitation of the beginning.

I got to see Billy Connolly twice and he was superb.

I saw Henning Wehn do his pre tour at the Betsy Trotwood in front of an audience of around 30 on at least three occasions. Absolute mint. Three world cups and one world pope. Doo dah.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

What's changed is the number of channels we have and the ability to give alternative comedy more air time. We have more comedy panel shows, comedy streaming services etc. etc. It's not just 4 channels anymore where you needed broad appeal. I just don't think you'd have seen anything but mainstream comedians in times past. Now good and bad various acts get air time that would never have been broadcast before. Your Michael McKintyre, Jimmy Carr, Stephen Fry, John Bishop, Lee Mack etc. still dominate the mainstream though, not a lot has changed in that regard.

You're right. Suppose that's why I don't watch mainstream TV these days. Some of them you mention make my blood run cold, Ricky Gervais freezes it.

 

[TugWilson]

Yet we still have the New York Yankees?

In short according to Wiki they were from Maryland first known as the Oriole`s then moved to Manhattan called The New York Highlanders only to be dubbed `Yankee`s and/orYank`s` by the press