[TV] A Cow's Life: The True Cost of Milk? - Panorama

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Wrong-Direction

Well-known member
Mar 10, 2013
13,638
Most of us probably already know the suffering farm animals go through for us. Some of the footage in this is quite harrowing though. I gave up cows milk several years ago, it's mad we actually drink the milk meant for another animal in the first place!? Anyway I doubt this will get as many views as the cat thread..

Sent from my SM-A326B using Tapatalk
 




portlock seagull

Well-known member
Jul 28, 2003
17,777
I love these exposes. They’re like University research where for £2million they’ve prove beyond doubt that wheels are round.

Frankly most people couldn’t give a shit and that’s the truth. Hence why it happens.

Next week: Free range chicken which ain’t that free….
 


jimhigham

Je Suis Rhino
Apr 25, 2009
8,037
Woking
I love these exposes. They’re like University research where for £2million they’ve prove beyond doubt that wheels are round.

Frankly most people couldn’t give a shit and that’s the truth. Hence why it happens.

Next week: Free range chicken which ain’t that free….

You may be right but little by little the tide is turning on this stuff. I’m almost 50. Turned veggie a year back. Have massively cut down on dairy and am edging towards (gasp) going vegan. Just an increased awareness over time that all this stuff we like to think of as benign comes at a cost, whether it be environmental or to other sentient beings.

I know, I know. Bore off etc…
 


abc

Well-known member
Jan 6, 2007
1,389
My take away was that food is too cheap and everything from welfare to the environment suffers as a result. Hope the next panorama exposes the damage milk substitutes cause the environment and the amount of additives they contain
 








LamieRobertson

Not awoke
Feb 3, 2008
48,420
SHOREHAM BY SEA
Most of us probably already know the suffering farm animals go through for us. Some of the footage in this is quite harrowing though. I gave up cows milk several years ago, it's mad we actually drink the milk meant for another animal in the first place!? Anyway I doubt this will get as many views as the cat thread..

Sent from my SM-A326B using Tapatalk

Those coffees I made you when u did that last job had :moo:

:facepalm:
 


BN9 BHA

DOCKERS
NSC Patron
Jul 14, 2013
22,683
Newhaven
Most of us probably already know the suffering farm animals go through for us. Some of the footage in this is quite harrowing though. I gave up cows milk several years ago, it's mad we actually drink the milk meant for another animal in the first place!? Anyway I doubt this will get as many views as the cat thread..

Sent from my SM-A326B using Tapatalk

Have you given up meat now?
 




Acker79

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Nov 15, 2008
31,921
Brighton
As discussed on the Film 2022 thread, there's a film called 'Cow' that was recently showing at the cinema and is now on Mubi. From Andrea Arnold (director of Fish Tank and American Honey).

https://youtu.be/tA23-RzhkzY

Presented wthout comment or narration, it shows the early life of one cow and the late life of another.
 


albionalbino

Well-known member
Nov 1, 2009
1,357
West Sussex
I saw this on the news earlier. Shocking. I found the footage deeply upsetting.
I'm a meat eater and hypocritically an animal lover,but I do try to eat higher welfare meat and less of it these days.
The way farms operate makes me so angry, they've been getting away with this and worse for generations.
 


portlock seagull

Well-known member
Jul 28, 2003
17,777
You may be right but little by little the tide is turning on this stuff. I’m almost 50. Turned veggie a year back. Have massively cut down on dairy and am edging towards (gasp) going vegan. Just an increased awareness over time that all this stuff we like to think of as benign comes at a cost, whether it be environmental or to other sentient beings.

I know, I know. Bore off etc…

Nope, far from and I applaud your actions. My disparaging comment was more aimed at the billions who either don’t care or aren’t in a position to. Which means, as you say, change occurs at such a slow rate as to not make the required difference to eg Climate change. The other reason for my comment is that I’m in this industry and have sort of seen it all before. I’ve grown tired of exposes because they’re so cyclical. And the reason for that is generally the great British public doesn’t really care about food as long as it’s cheap. That’s the bottom line. Everything else is secondary. Especially by comparison to many European countries. Most people are ignorant and can’t even be arsed to look at whats printed on packaging, then gasp outrage at the latest ‘expose’ or ‘scandal’ when really it’s been underneath their noses if only they weren’t “too busy” (on on smart phones, scrolling left and right all day) to read food labels and/or ask some basic questions about what we stick in our gobs 3 meals per day. And that’s because Cheap food trumps everything else. People don’t even care that much about fraud even, as long as it looks like food and tastes like food and is cheap. The sheer scientific engineering that goes into food production to replace basic nutritional values would astonish you. It’s incredible and very clever stuff. It’s not illegal, to some extent it’s necessary to feed everyone but mainly it’s because of that old chestnut: money. Profit and margins dominate to such an extent our food literally doesn’t taste like “mama used to make” for a very good reason - because it’s been entirely re-engineered in a generation. We are all eating Frankenstein today, it’s unavoidable really.

Now though we’re actually in a position to carry on drinking cows milk because we don’t need cows anymore to make it. Imagine all that farmland now not required, we can turn it into housing instead. I myself tasted cows milk that had never seen a cow nearly a decade ago because of my job, being allowed a thimble like measurement because it was so expensive to grow and had been flown to London from California where the Silicon Valley based Agritech company was based. It was an astonishing Window into the future then, but that future is now here and being rolled out. It tasted exactly like cows milk because genetically it was. Just never come from a cow. We can now skip that bit just as we don’t need chickens etc anymore to eat chicken etc. Which is bad news for any remaining milkmaids. And vegans wanting to tell everyone they are ;)
 




Albion in the north

Well-known member
Jul 13, 2012
1,556
Ooop North
My take away was that food is too cheap and everything from welfare to the environment suffers as a result. Hope the next panorama exposes the damage milk substitutes cause the environment and the amount of additives they contain

Thats what most people dont understand. Food is too cheap and to make it that cheap things have to be done a certain way. Do people in general want cheap food or are they happy to pay more for higher welfare food or even turn Vegan? Its easy to have morals when you can afford to but less so when you are struggling.
Ive not watched the programme, its there to make a point and are rarely balanced, but I have spent time on the farm that supplies our shop. The cows are in a field all day (Unless the weather and state of the fields are too bad). get milked in the shed and then back out again. Twice a day. Our milk is not as cheap as supermarket milk but it is a lot nicer and has travelled a lot less. There are always choices.
 


jimhigham

Je Suis Rhino
Apr 25, 2009
8,037
Woking
My take away was that food is too cheap and everything from welfare to the environment suffers as a result. Hope the next panorama exposes the damage milk substitutes cause the environment and the amount of additives they contain

That’s a varied issue. Oat milk is said to be very good in terms of carbon emissions, Hemp milk still better if you can find it. Almond milk is thought to be hugely damaging to the bee population. Nothing’s ever simple.
 


portlock seagull

Well-known member
Jul 28, 2003
17,777
Evolution of Agricultural systems for anyone interested goes something like this. 4 basic revolutions to date.

1st stage (50,000 BC) Hunter gathering
2nd (5,000 BC) Farming, arable and pastoral
3rd 1950+ mass manufacturing/technical advancements eg Chorley loaf
4th 2010+ Cell cultivation

Note the acceleration ie what’s happened in less than a century compared to thousands of years before. It will soon be ‘normal’ to eat a chicken drumstick etc that’s grown exactly as that, not requiring all the waste/inefficiency (and cost) that comes with having to rear, slaughter and process an actual chicken first to produce a drumstick as one by product of. Get used to Frankenstein food as I said, because it’s coming to a supermarket near you soon enough! :)
 






jimhigham

Je Suis Rhino
Apr 25, 2009
8,037
Woking
Nope, far from and I applaud your actions. My disparaging comment was more aimed at the billions who either don’t care or aren’t in a position to. Which means, as you say, change occurs at such a slow rate as to not make the required difference to eg Climate change. The other reason for my comment is that I’m in this industry and have sort of seen it all before. I’ve grown tired of exposes because they’re so cyclical. And the reason for that is generally the great British public doesn’t really care about food as long as it’s cheap. That’s the bottom line. Everything else is secondary. Especially by comparison to many European countries. Most people are ignorant and can’t even be arsed to look at whats printed on packaging, then gasp outrage at the latest ‘expose’ or ‘scandal’ when really it’s been underneath their noses if only they weren’t “too busy” (on on smart phones, scrolling left and right all day) to read food labels and/or ask some basic questions about what we stick in our gobs 3 meals per day. And that’s because Cheap food trumps everything else. People don’t even care that much about fraud even, as long as it looks like food and tastes like food and is cheap. The sheer scientific engineering that goes into food production to replace basic nutritional values would astonish you. It’s incredible and very clever stuff. It’s not illegal, to some extent it’s necessary to feed everyone but mainly it’s because of that old chestnut: money. Profit and margins dominate to such an extent our food literally doesn’t taste like “mama used to make” for a very good reason - because it’s been entirely re-engineered in a generation. We are all eating Frankenstein today, it’s unavoidable really.

Now though we’re actually in a position to carry on drinking cows milk because we don’t need cows anymore to make it. Imagine all that farmland now not required, we can turn it into housing instead. I myself tasted cows milk that had never seen a cow nearly a decade ago because of my job, being allowed a thimble like measurement because it was so expensive to grow and had been flown to London from California where the Silicon Valley based Agritech company was based. It was an astonishing Window into the future then, but that future is now here and being rolled out. It tasted exactly like cows milk because genetically it was. Just never come from a cow. We can now skip that bit just as we don’t need chickens etc anymore to eat chicken etc. Which is bad news for any remaining milkmaids. And vegans wanting to tell everyone they are ;)

This part is so true. I’m on the oat milk. Costs much more than cow juice. My supermarket shop has historically been at Waitrose, which recently came out joint top in a Which survey along with Lidl for sustainability ratings. I try and shop local for food where I can. But the sad postscript to all this is that the price crunch coming down the track is likely to force me to revisit this and cut costs. For all the good intentions, the bottom line will always win out. I’d love to save the planet one cup of coffee at at time but, sooner or later, cold hard home economics step in.

Depressing, huh?
 


portlock seagull

Well-known member
Jul 28, 2003
17,777
Thats what most people dont understand. Food is too cheap and to make it that cheap things have to be done a certain way. Do people in general want cheap food or are they happy to pay more for higher welfare food or even turn Vegan? Its easy to have morals when you can afford to but less so when you are struggling.
Ive not watched the programme, its there to make a point and are rarely balanced, but I have spent time on the farm that supplies our shop. The cows are in a field all day (Unless the weather and state of the fields are too bad). get milked in the shed and then back out again. Twice a day. Our milk is not as cheap as supermarket milk but it is a lot nicer and has travelled a lot less. There are always choices.

Precisely. I get sick and tired of telling people that cheap food shouts supply chain malpractices, whether that’s modern slavery, animal welfare, illegal plantations, adulteration etc. You are literally a bit stupid, ignorant or both if you think it’s possible to BOGOF 2 chickens for a fiver without someone in the supply chain effectively paying a cost you’re not as the end consumer (though I’d argue that too, got enough war stories to write a book once I can afford the lawyers as they say!)

Bottom line is most people don’t care or aren’t sufficiently bothered by, same in every industry. Food no different. We want our cake and eat it (pun intended). Long as cheap, we will look the other way and let someone else worry about ‘standards’
 






portlock seagull

Well-known member
Jul 28, 2003
17,777
This part is so true. I’m on the oat milk. Costs much more than cow juice. My supermarket shop has historically been at Waitrose, which recently came out joint top in a Which survey along with Lidl for sustainability ratings. I try and shop local for food where I can. But the sad postscript to all this is that the price crunch coming down the track is likely to force me to revisit this and cut costs. For all the good intentions, the bottom line will always win out. I’d love to save the planet one cup of coffee at at time but, sooner or later, cold hard home economics step in.

Depressing, huh?

Cold hard reality really. No one should really beat themselves up about, we all have a budget, all have choices to make. What does grate me is more people choosing to remain ignorant and then throwing their hands up in outrage when the latest programme comes out. Price is what you pay, value is what you get and all that. It’s a bit like these eat for less family of 4 programmes who never thought to try the own label products rather than the brand and are astonished to find out they can save hundreds. I mean, why haven’t you figured this out before and need Greg Wallace to come to your house to explain?! Sake…Anyway, what it’s worth I’m trying to eat less/more quality, that’s bang on trend as well!
 


portlock seagull

Well-known member
Jul 28, 2003
17,777
Thats what most people dont understand. Food is too cheap and to make it that cheap things have to be done a certain way. Do people in general want cheap food or are they happy to pay more for higher welfare food or even turn Vegan? Its easy to have morals when you can afford to but less so when you are struggling.
Ive not watched the programme, its there to make a point and are rarely balanced, but I have spent time on the farm that supplies our shop. The cows are in a field all day (Unless the weather and state of the fields are too bad). get milked in the shed and then back out again. Twice a day. Our milk is not as cheap as supermarket milk but it is a lot nicer and has travelled a lot less. There are always choices.

This. Lot of time for Dairy Farmers like close friends of mine who care more for their animals than anyone with a passing interest would care to know. Dairy Industry too vast anyhow to tar everyone with same brush. Don’t need to watch anything to know that. So hope people also realise many Farmers work incredibly long hours implementing the highest standards and producing great products for a pittance really.
 


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