[Albion] A £50 Million Sized Hole in Defence?

[DarrenFreemansPerm]

In the last game at the Amex, Potter was without Veltman , Dunk , Lamptey and March - and Welbeck for 70 minutes fwiw.
Seemed to cope.

He’s now played Mwepu in multiple positions in the friendlies. That’s part of what friendlies are for I guess. If it was 3 points yesterday then I suspect he would have picked a different starting line up, different subs, and different formations at different times.
Potter likes playing players like this - not sure White leaving makes a difference. He played him in multiple positions too (and of course he’ll be missed)

And Karbownik had some decent minutes at Luton and was on bench in last few games last season.

Also club clearly see need for a full back - hence Cucurella .

Of course it matters, obviously you can play anyone out of position, but it’s how they cope that matters, White played well in every position he was given, we have a centre back in Ostigard who could take over, but let’s not pretend we have a player who can cover CB, RB, RWB and CDM to the level that White could.

 

[b.w.2.]

I must admit that I didn't go, but the Argus write up seemed to suggest that the two goals came from set pieces. Did Arsenal spend £50 million on Ben White because of his dominance at set pieces?

Spot on. Their goals had zero to do with Ben White leaving. The problem, as ever, was we cannot score in a brothel


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[sydney]

BW would not have helped stop either of their goals , both very good , some would say top class strikes , our problems remain at the other end of the pitch ....

 

[AmexRuislip]

Can somebody please think of the children......

 

[Seasider78]

On the contrary, our ‘successs’ last season came from being defensively resilient, we all know we were pony in front of goal and seeing as we’ve done approximately nothing to address it then it would perhaps be unwise to expect much of an upturn in performance, defensively however we are now weaker having lost a defensive mainstay and also losing Dan Burn, who whilst not everyone’s cup of tea, played a lot of games and covered multiple positions. Defence was our strength, it’s now looking a wee bit thin.

We have lost white but Veltman is adequate cover in that position. The fear at the moment is the lack of RB options forcing him to play there. Burn is not a long term absence and we are in the hunt for Marc Cucurella so LB would then have options. Ostigard looks like decent CB cover and we have Shane Duffy if we are desperately unlucky with further injuries and suspensions. The one I don’t know what the deal with is Karbownik and if he could be a RB or LB option.

How light we are also depends how potter is going to set up. The 3 at the back last season accommodated white which was maybe a system designed with white in mind I am still unsure if we will move to a 4 given how much we are seen this in pre season or if this is just a symptom of current shortages.

I think we will cope defensively with maybe a few more goals conceded but even without white we have one of the best defensive units outside the top 6. As you say the main issue is the being pony in front of goal and this remains the worry area for me and last night looked horribly familiar which did not help with my pre season confidence.

 

[DarrenFreemansPerm]

Actually you’d think one of the things we’ve done to address our goal scoring issues is to sign a new midfielder who can score from open play - eg: Mwepu.

PS: will the defence look strengthened if Cucurella signed ?


Of course not having Burn or White available makes life tougher for Potter. But he had to cope without Webster, Lamptey , March and Veltman at various periods last season and he’s skilful at doing that.

Possibly investing a bit too much hope in Mwepu’s goal scoring record, he scored 9 goals in 72 games in the Austrian league, not exactly mouth watering figures.

PS. Your question about Cucurella, are you for real? Obviously signing a defender for a position where we currently have a glaring hole strengthens the defence, but until such times as we actually sign him/someone we’re playing players out of position.

 

[chaileyjem]

Of course it matters, obviously you can play anyone out of position, but it’s how they cope that matters, White played well in every position he was given, we have a centre back in Ostigard who could take over, but let’s not pretend we have a player who can cover CB, RB, RWB and CDM to the level that White could.

Agreed he’s going to be missed. Not denying that. Underrated on NSC I think. But Webster, Dunk, Burn, Lamptey, March, Veltman, Sanchez, Cucurella ? Ostigard ? - is a decent defence squad so understand why club haven’t immediately bought a new CB.

 

[DarrenFreemansPerm]

We have lost white but Veltman is adequate cover in that position. The fear at the moment is the lack of RB options forcing him to play there. Burn is not a long term absence and we are in the hunt for Marc Cucurella so LB would then have options. Ostigard looks like decent CB cover and we have Shane Duffy if we are desperately unlucky with further injuries and suspensions. The one I don’t know what the deal with is Karbownik and if he could be a RB or LB option.

How light we are also depends how potter is going to set up. The 3 at the back last season accommodated white which was maybe a system designed with white in mind I am still unsure if we will move to a 4 given how much we are seen this in pre season or if this is just a symptom of current shortages.

I think we will cope defensively with maybe a few more goals conceded but even without white we have one of the best defensive units outside the top 6. As you say the main issue is the being pony in front of goal and this remains the worry area for me and last night looked horribly familiar which did not help with my pre season confidence.

We’ve lost White, Veltman can play there, he’s not as good as White but a good player nonetheless. With that in mind we have nobody to play right back or we can use uncomfortable looking midfielders as wing backs. If we go with a flat back four I think we’re asking for trouble as we don’t have a single left back or right back in the squad. It’s all well and good pencilling March in as left back but his best position is LWB which is completely different to being an out and out defender in a back four. If Ostigard isn’t seen as the answer then quite simply there’s no way to dress it up, our defence is weaker.

 

[chaileyjem]

Possibly investing a bit too much hope in Mwepu’s goal scoring record, he scored 9 goals in 72 games in the Austrian league, not exactly mouth watering figures.

PS. Your question about Cucurella, are you for real? Obviously signing a defender for a position where we currently have a glaring hole strengthens the defence, but until such times as we actually sign him/someone we’re playing players out of position.

I think the point was - that it’s an overall squad/team issue in terms of converting chances. Club are clearly looking for a striker anyway - don’t think there’s any doubt. So they would agree this needs fixing ( but guess it will be close to the wire - these things sometimes are)

Cucurella- just acknowledging the points on here that that is a weakness and looks like it’s being addressed.

Out of position - I think that’s the whole point of Potter and one of his strengths - he wants a team who can play multiple positions in multiple formations. White summed that up but He’s also turned March into an effective wing back and Veltman and Burn play fine either in a 4 or a 5.

 

[The Fits]

How do we have no senior fullbacks at the club. How is that possible?

 

[um bongo molongo]

I think a bit of perspective is required here, Dunk and Webster were playing their first pre season match, and Potter was still trying things with the formation and playing personnel. We will look like a different side with Lamptey and Welbeck in the team, plus 1 or 2 more additions (hopefully). I think the squad will be looking much better after the 1st international break, it's almost unfortunate that we have 3 games that aren't against the big 6 in these matches as we'll be hoping to pick up some points - a lot of clubs are in the same boat as us though in the sense that some of their best players will not be available for the early matches - e.g Wood for Burnley next weekend.

I'd be tempted to go with last seasons tactics/formation in the game against Burnley, with Dunk, Webster, Duffy in a back three with Veltman RWB and March LWB, Mwepu and Bissouma in midfield - will bring some familiarity.

I don’t disagree with you, but I’m pessimistic how much Lamptey will play, so we need a decent back up there so that Veltman can play centrally (and worryingly Potter doesn’t seem to think that’s Karbo). If we’re playing Duffy to replace White, it’s hard not to say we’ve gone significantly backwards.

 

[DarrenFreemansPerm]

Agreed he’s going to be missed. Not denying that. Underrated on NSC I think. But Webster, Dunk, Burn, Lamptey, March, Veltman, Sanchez, Cucurella ? Ostigard ? - is a decent defence squad so understand why club haven’t immediately bought a new CB.

Why are you including Cucurella, he isn’t a Brighton player. As I said before, my concerns stem from the fact that our squad is CURRENTLY weaker than it was last season, obviously if we buy upgrades we’ll be in a better position, but starting the season without a left back or right back seems an unnecessary risk, obviously the injury to Burn is unfortunate and untimely but we’re starting the season incredibly thin in defence but primarily we’re short in areas we’ve known about for a long time, no left back or right back? That’s not right.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Agreed he’s going to be missed. Not denying that. Underrated on NSC I think. But Webster, Dunk, Burn, Lamptey, March, Veltman, Sanchez, Cucurella ? Ostigard ? - is a decent defence squad so understand why club haven’t immediately bought a new CB.

Agreed.

Really hope that Ostigard gets an opportunity


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[Couldn't Be Hyypia]

Our issue will be if we get another injury/Covid case amongst our centre backs. Then we'll look thin on the ground. Still not sure it's a £50m hole though. A good CB back up sized hole? Yes.

 

[Frankworthington]

Good morning sunshine

 

[b.w.2.]

Our issue will be if we get another injury/Covid case amongst our centre backs. Then we'll look thin on the ground. Still not sure it's a £50m hole though. A good CB back up sized hole? Yes.

Well said. Unless Ostigard steps up.


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[dejavuatbtn]

Now there was me thinking pre season friendlies were an opportunity to try things out and look at options for the coming season.

 

[Seasider78]

We’ve lost White, Veltman can play there, he’s not as good as White but a good player nonetheless. With that in mind we have nobody to play right back or we can use uncomfortable looking midfielders as wing backs. If we go with a flat back four I think we’re asking for trouble as we don’t have a single left back or right back in the squad. It’s all well and good pencilling March in as left back but his best position is LWB which is completely different to being an out and out defender in a back four. If Ostigard isn’t seen as the answer then quite simply there’s no way to dress it up, our defence is weaker.

We will not be replacing white with a player of equal quality but that is hardly a surprise as £50m players are not in our price range so we were always going to be weakened if that was the expectation. The question is whatever we are weakened to degree that materially impacts our finishing position and we will only know that next may. Agree RB is a issue the club tried to sign Livremento to address that so expect to see us done something in that area before window is out.

I don’t agree with your view on LWB not being able to play in a four there are lots of examples of attack minded full backs playing in a 4 Liverpool’s title winning side had Robertson and TAA as one of the more successful examples of this

 

[DarrenFreemansPerm]

I think the point was - that it’s an overall squad/team issue in terms of converting chances. Club are clearly looking for a striker anyway - don’t think there’s any doubt. So they would agree this needs fixing ( but guess it will be close to the wire - these things sometimes are)

Cucurella- just acknowledging the points on here that that is a weakness and looks like it’s being addressed.

Out of position - I think that’s the whole point of Potter and one of his strengths - he wants a team who can play multiple positions in multiple formations. White summed that up but He’s also turned March into an effective wing back and Veltman and Burn play fine either in a 4 or a 5.

Let’s just focus on the defence, as whichever way you try to spin it 9 goals in 3 seasons in Austria simply isn’t going to rev my engine.

We currently have no full backs, none, no right back or left, even if/when Lamptey is fit he’s far more suited to RWB, as is March who is very much not a LB. It’s all well and good having a team of central midfielders who are happy to cover any position on the pitch, but there’s where things get disjointed, as soon as we line up with Alzate or Groß at RWB it’s open season for the opposition to have at us down our right, this leads to centre backs and midfielders being pulled out of position trying to cover.
I’m not worried about White being gone, so to speak, as I think Veltman or Ostigard will fill the role between them, the problem is that we don’t have players in the other positions we need Veltman to cover. If Veltman is CB we need Lamptey at RWB, alas there’s no depth behind him, if Veltman is at RB/RWB we need someone to cover his CB position which is either Ostigard or Duffy, the former hasn’t has much game time and and the latter is surely only still here by default.

 

[The Fits]

Ostigard looks great and I really hope he gets a chance but from what I’ve seen I’d say he is as far from White in skill set as you can get before you get to someone like Duffy. If we want to play three at the back, and play like we did last season, the only option atm is to play Veltman at RCB and find a fit or RWB (or a midfielder who can do a decent impression of one). I am surprised Alzate hasn’t been played there more lately.