4 yr old season ticket holder charged as adult, club won't fully refund....advice please.

[fosters headband]

I doubt the original poster would want to pursue this much further - being in dispute with the club we all support would sit uncomfortably on the shoulders of most of us. But is this sense of comradeship reciprocated? Do the newly hired fonctionaires scattered across the Albion's offices regard us as much more than two-bit customers to be dealt with at arm's length? Only last week I heard another example of idle and dismissive service given to a long-standing supporter, who is now on the brink of walking.

We can all make mistakes, and examples of wonderful service do crop up from time to time, but the concern remains that the Albion is in the grip of some sort of dull bureaucratic spirit that makes it feel more like an corporate bank than a community football club. There seems to be a cultural problem and that is the responsibility of those at the top.

Sums it up for me at present.

 

[SAC]

No way should you accept the offer of £73 on the season ticket. It is the club's error and down to sort it to your satisfaction.

Don't accept it and put in writing that you are not accepting it and mention that your husband will be thing twice about renewing his season ticket if this is how fans are treated.

Don't back down.

 

[Bold Seagull]

They've sent a cheque for £103, the entire loss was £176, they've now offered to put £73 on your smart card which can be used (with discount) on any merchandise, food, drinks, extra tickets, cup tickets, away tickets, and will stay on there for as long as you have a season ticket….seems reasonably fair to me?

 

[dazzer6666]

They've sent a cheque for £103, the entire loss was £176, they've now offered to put £73 on your smart card which can be used (with discount) on any merchandise, food, drinks, extra tickets, cup tickets, away tickets, and will stay on there for as long as you have a season ticket….seems reasonably fair to me?

Does to me too.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

They've sent a cheque for £103, the entire loss was £176, they've now offered to put £73 on your smart card which can be used (with discount) on any merchandise, food, drinks, extra tickets, cup tickets, away tickets, and will stay on there for as long as you have a season ticket….seems reasonably fair to me?

Entirely fair.

 

[drew]

They've sent a cheque for £103, the entire loss was £176, they've now offered to put £73 on your smart card which can be used (with discount) on any merchandise, food, drinks, extra tickets, cup tickets, away tickets, and will stay on there for as long as you have a season ticket….seems reasonably fair to me?

This. With the 10% discount, provided you get there early enough and spend at the concessions then they are very slightly ahead. Shouldn't have happened in the first place but equally should have been picked up earlier by the OP (well, her husband).

 

[Albion_Dave]

They've sent a cheque for £103, the entire loss was £176, they've now offered to put £73 on your smart card which can be used (with discount) on any merchandise, food, drinks, extra tickets, cup tickets, away tickets, and will stay on there for as long as you have a season ticket….seems reasonably fair to me?

I also think this is fair but it would of been nice if the OP was given the choice of smart card or a cash refund.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

They've sent a cheque for £103, the entire loss was £176, they've now offered to put £73 on your smart card which can be used (with discount) on any merchandise, food, drinks, extra tickets, cup tickets, away tickets, and will stay on there for as long as you have a season ticket….seems reasonably fair to me?

I suppose the question is, if you bought a nice woolly jumper in Marks & Spencer and subsequently discovered that they had made a mistake and removed too much money from your bank account would you expect to get the money back or would you be happy with a store voucher so you could go back to M&S and buy socks and underpants and stuff?

 

[drew]

I suppose the question is, if you bought a nice woolly jumper in Marks & Spencer and subsequently discovered that they had made a mistake and removed too much money from your bank account would you expect to get the money back or would you be happy with a store voucher so you could go back to M&S and buy socks and underpants and stuff?

Taking that analogy further, if you picked up the jumper that was twice the price of the one you actually wanted and then wore it for about six months before realising would you expect a full refund or more likely credit notes from the store in question?

 

[Creaky]

Taking that analogy further, if you picked up the jumper that was twice the price of the one you actually wanted and then wore it for about six months before realising would you expect a full refund or more likely credit notes from the store in question?

Not a fair analogy at all!

More akin to buying a jumper from M&S and as well as the jumper they'd put a shirt in the bag which wasn't noticed but was charged for. A refusal to refund for unsolicited goods on the grounds that they may have been used just doesn't stand up.

A season ticket for a 4 year old was what was ordered and what was used - the fact that the club issued a card that 'could' have been used by an adult is irrelevant, that wasn't what was ordered nor used.

The OP has been overcharged for what they ordered and is entitled to a refund for the amount the club has taken from them in error.

In their place I would stand firm and insist on a cash refund.

 

[drew]

Not a fair analogy at all!

More akin to buying a jumper from M&S and as well as the jumper they'd put a shirt in the bag which wasn't noticed but was charged for. A refusal to refund for unsolicited goods on the grounds that they may have been used just doesn't stand up.

A season ticket for a 4 year old was what was ordered and what was used - the fact that the club issued a card that 'could' have been used by an adult is irrelevant, that wasn't what was ordered nor used.

The OP has been overcharged for what they ordered and is entitled to a refund for the amount the club has taken from them in error.

In their place I would stand firm and insist on a cash refund.

Have to take issue with this although a slight variation of my previous post. You approach the counter with a jumper but the assistant puts the wrong one in the bag and charges you the price for the wrong one. Six months later, having enjoyed the benefit of the jumper, you realise it is not the one you wanted, take it back!!!!


That said, they have been overcharged and the club have refunded the difference in the form of e-cash. If the husband had been a bit more vigilant then they might have got a cash settlement before the second instalment was taken. If he does normally use the concessions and/or buy thing from the store on match days then he is getting just over £80 back instead of £73! If he doesn't use the e-cash then I agree they should insist on a cash refund. However, a parent taking a kid to football, I would find it hard not believe that he ends up buying things!!!

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Fair play to Paul Barber, but something is not right if the only way to get things resolved is to go straight to the main man.

This.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Not a fair analogy at all!

More akin to buying a jumper from M&S and as well as the jumper they'd put a shirt in the bag which wasn't noticed but was charged for. A refusal to refund for unsolicited goods on the grounds that they may have been used just doesn't stand up.

A season ticket for a 4 year old was what was ordered and what was used - the fact that the club issued a card that 'could' have been used by an adult is irrelevant, that wasn't what was ordered nor used.

The OP has been overcharged for what they ordered and is entitled to a refund for the amount the club has taken from them in error.

In their place I would stand firm and insist on a cash refund.

You could stand firm all you want, but given the unreasonable time between the mistake being made and the notification of the error - the club would have a case that the purchaser has enjoyed the benefit of that mistake and in tort would have a case to prove the purchaser was therefore assumed to be happy with the transaction given the time period that has elapsed.

You can't just take an error, use it for however long, then suddenly decide to point out the error to the other person on the contract. It is incumbent on the receiving side of a contract to ensure they have been given what they've paid for, and to notify of any error within a reasonable time.

What would you say if this was suddenly noticed next Spring - has the club got to believe an adult has never gone on this card and just refund an entire seasons worth?

They've refunded 60% in cash, 40% in e-cash which is more than fair given the timescales.

 

[Creaky]

Have to take issue with this although a slight variation of my previous post. You approach the counter with a jumper but the assistant puts the wrong one in the bag and charges you the price for the wrong one. Six months later, having enjoyed the benefit of the jumper, you realise it is not the one you wanted, take it back!!!!


That said, they have been overcharged and the club have refunded the difference in the form of e-cash. If the husband had been a bit more vigilant then they might have got a cash settlement before the second instalment was taken. If he does normally use the concessions and/or buy thing from the store on match days then he is getting just over £80 back instead of £73! If he doesn't use the e-cash then I agree they should insist on a cash refund. However, a parent taking a kid to football, I would find it hard not believe that he ends up buying things!!!

That's not what happened though - the OP got what they ordered, entry to the football for a 4 year old. They didn't use the extra service the club sent them in error - you can't therefore compare it to buying something, being given the wrong item and using that item - they didn't.

It's not up to the customer to notice a mistake has been made by the club - it is the club's responsibility not to make that mistake and if they do to make sure that their 'customer' is not out of pocket.

You could stand firm all you want, but given the unreasonable time between the mistake being made and the notification of the error - the club would have a case that the purchaser has enjoyed the benefit of that mistake and in tort would have a case to prove the purchaser was therefore assumed to be happy with the transaction given the time period that has elapsed.

You can't just take an error, use it for however long, then suddenly decide to point out the error to the other person on the contract. It is incumbent on the receiving side of a contract to ensure they have been given what they've paid for, and to notify of any error within a reasonable time.

What would you say if this was suddenly noticed next Spring - has the club got to believe an adult has never gone on this card and just refund an entire seasons worth?

They've refunded 60% in cash, 40% in e-cash which is more than fair given the timescales.

The whole point is that the OP has not enjoyed any benefit due to the club's error - quite the reverse they have suffered. If the club wanted to dispute the claim, even if that claim were made at the end of the season, it would be up to them to show that the service charged for had been used - not for the customer to show it hadn't - to say it could have is simply not good enough.

The club has effectively admitted liability for their error by offering a credit into the OP's eCash account.

The Consumer Contracts Regulations 2013 now includes the following -

27A.

(1) This regulation applies where a trader engages in the unfair commercial

practice described in paragraph 29 of Schedule 1 (inertia selling).


(2) The consumer is exempted from any obligation to provide consideration for the
products supplied by the trader.


(3) The absence of a response from the consumer following the supply does not constitute

consent to the provision of consideration for, or the return or safekeeping of, the products.


(4) In the case of an unsolicited supply of goods, the consumer may, as between the
consumer and the trader, use, deal with or dispose of the goods as if they were an
unconditional gift to the consumer.”.

 

[SurprisedSeagull]

Hello there. In view of the errors on our behalf - we should have noticed earlier - we have decided to accept the ecash and use toward replica kit, the littlest will like that. The club has definitely made mistakes, not inputting the the youngest DOB and then when we did contact them, telling we had to write to them, when we didn't which delayed the refund but ultimately, they are a business and they didn't have to refund the difference. It's not John Lewis, but the club's not John Lewis, is it? But your thoughts and comments have been much appreciated and helped me think through what we should do.

Incidentally, given no-one had asked, I have emailed the youngest's DOB, I don't want to find myself back at square one! Thanks again, signing off SurprisedSeagull.

 

[Horses Arse]

Entirely fair.

My god please tell me you're joking.

Shocking behaviour by the club. Mr Barber needs to understand that a quick response is no good in itself.

 

[Horses Arse]

Very surprised at how much some fans swallow without question (not talking about the OP).

Really interested to see how far some of you could be pushed until you question the club's behaviour. Have you forgotten what happened to this club previously?

 

[Bold Seagull]

That's not what happened though - the OP got what they ordered, entry to the football for a 4 year old. They didn't use the extra service the club sent them in error - you can't therefore compare it to buying something, being given the wrong item and using that item - they didn't.

It's not up to the customer to notice a mistake has been made by the club - it is the club's responsibility not to make that mistake and if they do to make sure that their 'customer' is not out of pocket.



The whole point is that the OP has not enjoyed any benefit due to the club's error - quite the reverse they have suffered. If the club wanted to dispute the claim, even if that claim were made at the end of the season, it would be up to them to show that the service charged for had been used - not for the customer to show it hadn't - to say it could have is simply not good enough.

The club has effectively admitted liability for their error by offering a credit into the OP's eCash account.

The Consumer Contracts Regulations 2013 now includes the following -

27A.

(1) This regulation applies where a trader engages in the unfair commercial

practice described in paragraph 29 of Schedule 1 (inertia selling).


(2) The consumer is exempted from any obligation to provide consideration for the
products supplied by the trader.


(3) The absence of a response from the consumer following the supply does not constitute

consent to the provision of consideration for, or the return or safekeeping of, the products.


(4) In the case of an unsolicited supply of goods, the consumer may, as between the
consumer and the trader, use, deal with or dispose of the goods as if they were an
unconditional gift to the consumer.”.

Inertia selling or an unsolicited supply of goods is completely different to this situation. In this case the consumer has sort to purchase an item, and been incorrectly charged for an item they thought they were getting. So that above is simply not relevant.

Anyway, the OP appears to be happy, the youngster will be getting 10% off a nice new kit with plenty left over for some hot dogs and mars bars so all is good it seems.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Hello there. In view of the errors on our behalf - we should have noticed earlier - we have decided to accept the ecash and use toward replica kit, the littlest will like that. The club has definitely made mistakes, not inputting the the youngest DOB and then when we did contact them, telling we had to write to them, when we didn't which delayed the refund but ultimately, they are a business and they didn't have to refund the difference. It's not John Lewis, but the club's not John Lewis, is it? But your thoughts and comments have been much appreciated and helped me think through what we should do.

Incidentally, given no-one had asked, I have emailed the youngest's DOB, I don't want to find myself back at square one! Thanks again, signing off SurprisedSeagull.

Great that it's all sorted. These things happen, and I'm sure that a bit of kit, some Xmas presents etc. all with 10% off will actually be money well spent in the end.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Great that it's all sorted. These things happen, and I'm sure that a bit of kit, some Xmas presents etc. all with 10% off will actually be money well spent in the end.

It's not all sorted. It may be happy if the customer wishes to put that money towards something Albion related.

I'd rather have the cash.

I check my accounts, never, why should I assume that the club know what they are doing(