[Football] 20 out of 20 managers fail to coach their strikers how to score

[BNthree]

And there has never ever ever been anything, a shred, iota or diddly squat that's negative that has ever been anything to do with Potter.

However everything positive he is completely responsible for.

OK Graham's dad.

This does amuse me. Love how whenever anything positive happens it is thanks to Potter but whenever anything negative happens it is nothing to do with Potter. Can't have it both ways.

 

[schmunk]

I'm not sure Connolly has. Considering he is at the age you'd expect him to be improving - I.e gaining more experience at senior level, developing physically etc.

Connolly had his 21st birthday yesterday and to date has scored 5 PL goals in 1,841 minutes played.

How many other 20 year olds have been consistently scoring in the PL? Other successful young players one might compare him with include:

* DCL - about to turn 24 - scored 5 PL goals in 2,077 minutes before turning 21

* Tammy Abraham - 23 1/2 - scored 5 PL goals in 1,769 minutes before turning 21

* Richarlison - 23 3/4 - scored 5 PL goals in 2,737 minutes before turning 21


Spot a pattern...?

 

[The Fits]

Connolly had his 21st birthday yesterday and to date has scored 5 PL goals in 1,841 minutes played.

How many other 20 year olds have been consistently scoring in the PL? Other successful young players one might compare him with include:

DCL - about to turn 24 - scored 5 PL goals in 2,077 minutes before turning 21

Tammy Abraham - 23 1/2 - scored 5 PL goals in 1,769 minutes before turning 21

Richarlison - 23 3/4 - scored 5 PL goals in 2,737 minutes before turning 21


Spot a pattern...?

Any more in recent times?

Yeah I'm not really talking about his goal scoring. I just don't see a big improvement in his game. If we had another striker you'd imagine he might be off out on loan.

 

[Justice]

A good point well made Swanny.

Now you know I’m behind GP but it’s not just the strikers though. There’s a lack of goals throughout the team given the chances we make every game.

When is the wedding

 

[MJsGhost]

I absolutely love this thread. Various people 'agree' with [MENTION=38333]Swansman[/MENTION] then say 'but what about that lad with loads of goals? Doesn't that prove that you can coach a scorer to score?'

There are quite a few that say they agree 'to a certain extent' or similar, then go on to point out the (wholly obvious) exceptions to a deliberately extreme point in the opening post. Those that concentrated harder in English lessons than I did will be able to say if the OP is laced with irony or sarcasm, to provoke the debate.

I would say that being able to accept or recognise the validity of points on opposite sides of a debate/argument (even when your thoughts mostly align with one side) shows common sense and, dare I say it, intellect rather than being worthy of a facepalm.

As always, the correct answer lies somewhere in the middle, but that doesn't give people an opportunity to vent their spleens so on we go with the polarized arguments.....

 

[schmunk]

Yeah I'm not really talking about his goal scoring. I just don't see a big improvement in his game. If we had another striker you'd imagine he might be off out on loan.

Given his place in the team is "goal scorer", what else do you want him to improve?

 

[One Love]

It happened in May 2019.

 

[Perkino]

My concern is how folk think that £30m gets a striker to solve all the issues.

A look at historical figures shows that the success of strikers is very often not linked to their contract costs.

Son v Joelinton is a favourite one of mine to prove the point.

This is a very good point, I cannot see us signing a striker who will suddenly transform our fortunes for the remainder of the season. We have enough strikers who have each, in spells, scored goals but are currently out of form. The tide will turn and we will win games we never expected to

 

[vagabond]

When is the wedding

Oh dear. And when were you married to tom hark then, or any of your super smart “Potter out” gang.

“These blokes both think Porter is gud manager. Lolz you are both gay”.

This is quite pathetic tbh. Are you 12 years old mentally?

 

[Badger Boy]

Who has a whole 3 goals more than Maupay?

Correct, he has scored 10 and Maupay has scored 7. Bamford has scored more goals, do you follow?

Personally, I think Maupay's tally is very good all things considered and I like him. He's missed some cracking sitters which is the difference between us and Leeds, to keep the comparison going. He'll get into double figures for the season, maybe get himself to 14 or 15 and that'll be a fantastic return for the season. Those of us who watch the games will remember the many misses, but personally I would tell him to be selfish. Play the width of the penalty area and be in there at all opportunities. The team needs him to score, not to try and link play. We've got plenty of linkers, not enough doers and finishers.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

There are quite a few that say they agree 'to a certain extent' or similar, then go on to point out the (wholly obvious) exceptions to a deliberately extreme point in the opening post. Those that concentrated harder in English lessons than I did will be able to say if the OP is laced with irony or sarcasm, to provoke the debate.

I would say that being able to accept or recognise the validity of points on opposite sides of a debate/argument (even when your thoughts mostly align with one side) shows common sense and, dare I say it, intellect rather than being worthy of a facepalm.

As always, the correct answer lies somewhere in the middle, but that doesn't give people an opportunity to vent their spleens so on we go with the polarized arguments.....

I am not sure there is a happy middle ground here because what this boilds down to is Potter in or out, fuelled by an arument by some outers that our lack of goals is entirely down to Potter (as mocked by the OP). My point is that people are agreeing with the OP then saying "but what about Calvert-Lewin? That proves a manager can transform a player into a striker, therefore PotterOUT!!!" (I may have finished that sentence a little more unequivocally than the post I am semi-quoting ).

 

[MJsGhost]

Oh dear. And when were you married to tom hark then, or any of your super smart “Potter out” gang.

“These blokes both think Porter is gud manager. Lolz you are both gay”.

This is quite pathetic tbh. Are you 12 years old mentally?

I think you're doing a great disservice to 12 year olds there Vagabond

 

[vagabond]

I think you're doing a great disservice to 12 year olds there Vagabond

[emoji106] you’re not wrong there.

 

[The Fits]

I am not sure there is a happy middle ground here because what this boilds down to is Potter in or out, fuelled by an arument by some outers that our lack of goals is entirely down to Potter (as mocked by the OP). My point is that people are agreeing with the OP then saying "but what about Calvert-Lewin? That proves a manager can transform a player into a striker, therefore PotterOUT!!!" (I may have finished that sentence a little more unequivocally than the post I am semi-quoting ).

Given it was me that mentioned DCL. I'm not saying "Potter Out".

 

[Change at Barnham]

Premier League clubs also pay tens of millions for world class defenders and goalkeepers.
That might have something to do with how hard it is to score goals.

n.b. We're currently the 14th highest scorers in the Premier League

This will be our best season ever in the Premier League.
Graham Potter is an amazing young manager and we're very lucky that Tony Bloom was able to recruit him to our club.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Given it was me that mentioned DCL. I'm not saying "Potter Out".

Good!

I agree that Ancelotti may well have done something to improve Super Dom, of course.

Edit: My view for what it is worth is that outcome (here the strike rate of an individual player) is the product of multiple factors that affect his liklihood to score. These include the player's innate ability, the way he's coached, his confidence, the way the team is set up, the way the opposiition are set up (and their ability, confidence, etc.) and luck. When Leo hit the 'woodwork' multiple times against ManU that was simply bad luck.

Anyway, I am a scientist distracted by NSC from problems that require binary decisions to be made based on complex inputs so I'd be better served effing off of NSC for a bit and getting on with my actual sodding job

 

[neilbard]

Of course it plays a part.

[MENTION=38333]Swansman[/MENTION] is calling out the narrative that our strikers' misses are entirely the fault of G-Pott. The 'Potterout' squad.

I actually don't mind potterouters as an entity. [MENTION=28481]neilbard[/MENTION] makes me laugh. He's made a decision and doesn't bother to justify it (much). We disagree. That's all.

What gets on my wick is the torturing of statistics to 'prove' that Potter is a tuppeny ha'penny wanker, and the relentless thread starting by some clowns calling for Potter to be sacked after every draw. I sense a little glee there. Nasty, in fact.

 

[Swansman]

Alex Iwobi has been playing as a wing back at times, when he's actually played. Keinan Davis is 22.

Continue the desperate defence of Potter, that's your thing. But at the very least use examples who are actually playing as strikers.

Funny how you don't use Patrick Bamford, who has a history of not scoring in the PL but has done so regularly this season under Bielsa who has a team set up to generate plenty of chances for him (thankfully, because he needs plenty to score).

And what about Callum Wilson playing in a rubbish Newcastle team? Any reason he hasn't been mentioned for his 8 goals? It's his joint second best season for PL goals but he's playing for Steve Bruce so that can't be right?

How come Bielsa only taught Bamford how to score goals? On the training session when he made Bamford a goal scorer, did he tell Rodrigo "no I will only teach Bamford how to score a goal." And how come Steve Bruce only taught Callum Wilson to score goals, but not the other Newcastle strikers? If we ignore the whole logical fallacy where you reject my claim that its not 100% about coaching yet mention both that Wilson also scored previously but still mention Bruce as an example of me being wrong. Why wouldnt he teach Joelinton or Carroll how to score goals?

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

I'm not sure Connolly has. Considering he is at the age you'd expect him to be improving - I.e gaining more experience at senior level, developing physically etc.

Anyway its problematic because you're saying Potter has improved players so you're accepting Potter or another coach could improve a players finishing. Unless finishing is the one skillset in football that can't be improved?

Of course Connolly had improved since GP has arrived. And of course improvement in all these players is in part down to the player themselves. But we want more more more!

Of course finishing can improve. Nothing happens overnight, neither Maupay nor Connolly had played a minute of Premier league football before Potter arrived. Its taken others many years to get to where they are. After 10 goals in two full seasons as a 20/21 year old, Calvert Lewin finally got 13 last season at age 22 after 114 games played in the top flight. Ings got 11 in his first Premier league season at 22 years old and because of injury didn't hit double figures again until last year at 27. Murray didn't hit the Premier league until he was 29 and was 32 by the time he scored his 10th premier league goal in total, only getting 10 in a season at age 34 and 35. Mo Salah was 23 when he first got to double figures in a top league, 14 in Serie A followed by 15 the next season. Chris Wood was 26 when he first got to double figures in the Premier league, 10 goals followed by 10 the next season and 14 last year. Callum Wilson didn't get double figures till his 4th premier league season at age 26, 14 goals and the only season he's done it. Vardy was 28 and in his second premier league season when he got to double figures for the first time. Deeney was 27 when he did it. Daniel Sturrudge was 22 and had played 89 premier league games when he got 11 in a season for Chelsea. Danny Welbeck has never got 10 in a season. Bobby Zamora did it just once at age 26 in his third premier league season. Sadio Mane was 22 when he got 10 for Saints, followed by 11, 13, 10 again before hitting 22 at age 26. Andy Johnson got 21 at age 23 but only got double figures once in five more full top fight seasons. Bamford has got to 10 at age 27.

Maupay got 10 at age 23 and is on track to do better this season, still just 55 Premier league games played, so his record is easily comparable with all the above. Connolly only turned 21 yesterday. Mustn't forget how early in their careers they are. Not everyone is Harry Kane or Marcus Rashford. Both have scored delightful first touch finishes this season. Maupay finds space and often connects beautifully first time, some will be saved or go just over, but keep doing it and goals will come and his skills will improve.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

View attachment 133157

****