[News] 12-year-old girl stabbed to death in Liverpool City centre

[GT49er]

Bobbi-Anne McLeod’s family hurl abuse at musician Cody Ackland, 24, as he appears in court accused of murdering teen,18

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16836778/bobbi-anne-mcleod-man-murder-court-cody-ackland/

Can't blame them.

 

[Swansman]

Barely any change. From the paper you linked:

View attachment 142384

And in any case I was referring specifically to a 12 year old stabbed to death by other children. It is easy for the elderly gentleman or lady (and I am one of the former) to imagine that every day in every way life is becoming more feral and degenrate, but that's simply old man syndrome.

That Keith Lyon case was disgusting - a 12 year old robbed of his pocket money and stabbed to death (eleven wounds) by inverse-snob bullies because he was in his grammar school uniform, followed by a closing of ranks and cover up by friends and families of the bullies, none of whom came to justice.

The was always scum behaviour and degeneracy, and always will be. The disgusting way so many kids used to be treated, with this regarded as normal, beggars belief. There is no need to invent an emergent calamity to explain the current cases, which are so rare they always make national news headlines, and invariably get a thread all of their own on NSC. Each case shocking enough on its own.

If society wants to mitigate against this it needs to be a bit smarter than it has been, since forever. Identifying imaginary trends, with the temptation to grab some correlate to explain the trend, is not the way. We tried blaming it all on West Indians in the 1970s. And football hooligans. Who next?

Not having a go at you, by the way. It is perfectly reasonable to look for clues.

Yup. Its the same thing in pretty much every country: people think violence is increasing. It isnt. The amount of Information is increasing, however.

Far more likely it is decreasing. Read older literature depiciting society and violence was a lot more normal and widespread than today.

 

[Fat Boy Fat]

Yup. Its the same thing in pretty much every country: people think violence is increasing. It isnt. The amount of Information is increasing, however.

Far more likely it is decreasing. Read older literature depiciting society and violence was a lot more normal and widespread than today.

I will pose the same question to you, do you think the streets, particularly at night, are safer to walk then 30 years ago?

Society has always had violence, just now it seems more randomised.

 

[Rinkmaster]

The question has to be asked why was a 12 year old girl out in a city centre at nearly 9 pm without an adult. Same question has to be asked about the boys as well.

 

[lawros left foot]

The question has to be asked why was a 12 year old girl out in a city centre at nearly 9 pm without an adult. Same question has to be asked about the boys as well.

It was the switching on of the City’s Christmas lights.

I imagine there’s a lot of 12 to 15 year old kids who go with friends to watch these events across the country.

 

[Rinkmaster]

It was the switching on of the City’s Christmas lights.

I imagine there’s a lot of 12 to 15 year old kids who go with friends to watch these events across the country.

I stand corrected. Didn't read that bit.

 

[Weststander]

I will pose the same question to you, do you think the streets, particularly at night, are safer to walk then 30 years ago?

Society has always had violence, just now it seems more randomised.

In the 80's, I was to close to a couple of young women who had been stranger street raped, separate incidents.

Out at night I always kept my wits about me, it was not uncommon to get your face kicked in or far worse at 3am. For no reason whatsoever, except Brighton's tache'd casualwear Russell Bishop lookalikes hadn't pulled .... yet again. Jealous of others.

Gays got beaten black and blue.

I just missed the era of Skinheads murdering, slashing and kicking heads in of Asians, Blacks, you name it.

There never, ever was a safe era in the middle of the night.

 

[Pavilionaire]

Last Saturday afternoon my 12 year old daughter and her friends went to the centre of Brighton unaccompanied by an adult for the very first time. This story really hits home.

 

[Razzoo]

It's the ages of the killers and killed that shocks as much as anything for me. I haven't checked the statistics but there seems to be a lot more kids murdering kids these days.

 

[gripper stebson]

Last Saturday afternoon my 12 year old daughter and her friends went to the centre of Brighton unaccompanied by an adult for the very first time. This story really hits home.

Yep - my 13 year old daughter is asking me if she can go on the train to Brighton with her friend to go shopping. It's terrifying. I wish it wasn't.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I'm not sure I can dismiss a 50% increase in offences, over a 40 year period, as little change...

However, I do agree that partly due to social media and news being national, rather than local, that these events appear all the more shocking, as they are immediately available to all via the various news outlets.

Also, like you, I may have a touch of grumpy old git syndrome, with rose tinted bi-focals, but do you really feel "the streets" are as safe as in years gone by?

Dude, where is the 50% increase? I'd say the numbers have gone up a bit but that could be due to the way it was reported. I was stabbed 30 years ago but the police weren't involved.

Re grumpy old git, yes, indeed. I try to actively fight it because it is a phenomenon of aging.

Do I feel safer? Yes. Would I feel safer 'out and about as a yoof' now? Definitely. When I was a little punk rocker we were forever on the lookout for being attacked. I'd been punched from behind by a cowardly skin head, chased by Teds at Portslade station, and on and on. [MENTION=37530]monty uk[/MENTION] was, I think, with me at a yoof club where we were attacked when we were even younger (14?).

Mind you I did get threatening three times in the space of an hour in a pub by three different groups of blokes only a few years ago when I was in my 50s. That said, this was in 'spoons in Faversham.

 

[Insel affe]

Last Saturday afternoon my 12 year old daughter and her friends went to the centre of Brighton unaccompanied by an adult for the very first time. This story really hits home.

Virtually snap, mine started going around four weeks ago, two weeks ago she walked out of her way home to be with her friends, one of them had a hissy fit and ran off, the other simply went home. Mine phoned me up saying pick me up and she did not know where she was exactly (Blakers park area) I whizzed up there, heart in mouth, I dare not tell the wife she would go mental. It was only 10 minutes and I found her, but they are so naive and don't seem to have that street smarts I did at that age, having said that lockdowns maybe have taken over a year out of their growing up in the world.

 

[drew]

Dude, where is the 50% increase? I'd say the numbers have gone up a bit but that could be due to the way it was reported. I was stabbed 30 years ago but the police weren't involved.

Re grumpy old git, yes, indeed. I try to actively fight it because it is a phenomenon of aging.

Do I feel safer? Yes. Would I feel safer 'out and about as a yoof' now? Definitely. When I was a little punk rocker we were forever on the lookout for being attacked. [MENTION=11679]Monty[/MENTION]_UK was, I think, with me at a yoof club where we were attacked. I'd been puched from behind by a cowardly skin head, chased by Teds at Portslade station, and on and on.

Mind you I did get threatening three times in the space of an hour in a pub by three different groups of blokes only a few years ago when I was in my 50s. That said, this was in 'spoons in Faversham.

I think he's just looked at the first and last bars. Need to take in the trend and also the peak!!

 

[KZNSeagull]

Have any of you tried the Hollie guard app or similar for your daughters? I saw something on facebook about it today from Durham police. Might give you a little peace of mind.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Yep - my 13 year old daughter is asking me if she can go on the train to Brighton with her friend to go shopping. It's terrifying. I wish it wasn't.

My daughter was 13 the first time I let her go into Leeds (approx 15 miles) with her friends, to go shopping.
As a parent, you have to let them find their wings. It's hard but at least they have mobile phones nowadays.

 

[Brovion]

In the 80's, I was to close to a couple of young women who had been stranger street raped, separate incidents.

Out at night I always kept my wits about me, it was not uncommon to get your face kicked in or far worse at 3am. For no reason whatsoever, except Brighton's tache'd casualwear Russell Bishop lookalikes hadn't pulled .... yet again. Jealous of others.

Gays got beaten black and blue.

I just missed the era of Skinheads murdering, slashing and kicking heads in of Asians, Blacks, you name it.

There never, ever was a safe era in the middle of the night.

Agreed. Personally I feel the Brighton streets are maybe a bit safer than 30 years ago, certainly they're no worse. Like you say there was always the chance of being randomly attacked on the way back to the station.

Maybe the victims and perpetrators have become younger? That's why it's so shocking.

 

[Weststander]

Agreed. Personally I feel the Brighton streets are maybe a bit safer than 30 years ago, certainly they're no worse. Like you say there was always the chance of being randomly attacked on the way back to the station.

Maybe the victims and perpetrators have become younger? That's why it's so shocking.

Acting in wolfpacks too. Sometimes innocent blokes 'at a good age' get set upon by a group of say 6 14 or 15-year-olds, sometimes a murder. The weasels wouldn't stand a chance one to one, but a feral kicking from all angles ensues. Cowards.

 

[Fat Boy Fat]

Dude, where is the 50% increase? I'd say the numbers have gone up a bit but that could be due to the way it was reported. I was stabbed 30 years ago but the police weren't involved.

Re grumpy old git, yes, indeed. I try to actively fight it because it is a phenomenon of aging.

Do I feel safer? Yes. Would I feel safer 'out and about as a yoof' now? Definitely. When I was a little punk rocker we were forever on the lookout for being attacked. I'd been punched from behind by a cowardly skin head, chased by Teds at Portslade station, and on and on. [MENTION=37530]monty uk[/MENTION] was, I think, with me at a yoof club where we were attacked when we were even younger (14?).

Mind you I did get threatening three times in the space of an hour in a pub by three different groups of blokes only a few years ago when I was in my 50s. That said, this was in 'spoons in Faversham.

The Leading Light, eh! Dodgy boozer...

I was being a bit naughty with the stats, like people tend to do when “trying” (and failing) to prove a point. In the graph you posted 1977 appeared to show 400 offences and 2017 600, hence 50% - conveniently ignoring, on my part, the large peak, then resulting drop. Wouldn’t make such a good argument, would it.

As for the other stuff, I guess I must have led a bit of a sheltered life, or don’t have a punch me face! In my years of dressing like a tit in my New Romantic phase I never once got punched, threatened, chased or anything similar, maybe everyone was too busy laughing!

I even used to use the Kings Head in Cuckfield, which at the time was a biker pub, in my full Adam and the Ants regalia and ner’ once got punched!

I suppose I am fortunate as a white, heterosexual male, apart from a crap dress sense, don’t have identifiers to put me in the spotlight...

 

[Fat Boy Fat]

I think he's just looked at the first and last bars. Need to take in the trend and also the peak!!

That’s exactly what I did, and to demonstrate how statistics can be used to prove a point (wrongly in this case).

 

[vegster]

As I said on the cruelty thread yesterday, we have an underclass of people who value nothing, property, possessions and even life.

We live in a broken world...

Is it because they feel they have no value themselves any more? poor education, lack of hope and poor parenting and poor job prospects all contribute to this feeling. It's a sad sad world for many.

How broken was that poor child recently that was effectively tortured to death by his mother? If he had lived what would his life has been like? We have societal problems which will take huge investment in people and services to turn around.

And it won't happen any time soon sadly.