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[News] Mike Amesbury MP - Rocky VIII: Backbench Brawler



Hugo Rune

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Feb 23, 2012
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You'd more for saying mean words online. But theres no 2 tier justice system in the UK
From what I’m hearing, this sentence would normally be a community order but the judge wanted to make an example out of the awful thug.

Much like the c***s you are implicitly defending who were responsible for starting the Islamophobic riots and rightly got put away.
 




WATFORD zero

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Jul 10, 2003
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I know several probation officers and a community sentence would probably be more beneficial for many offenders rather than just banging them up in some drug ridden hell-hole, although I believe there can be issues with having to do unpaid work as there isn't always any suitable unpaid work available (I haven't noticed a chain gang locally recently). The trouble is that many people regard probation as a softer option, even though it isn't - although to receive the benefits, an offender has to want to reform.

Since when has NSC been the place for sensible views from people who actually have experience in what they're talking about and discussion based on that knowledge :wink:
 


Javeaseagull

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Feb 22, 2014
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I know several probation officers and a community sentence would probably be more beneficial for many offenders rather than just banging them up in some drug ridden hell-hole, although I believe there can be issues with having to do unpaid work as there isn't always any suitable unpaid work available (I haven't noticed a chain gang locally recently). The trouble is that many people regard probation as a softer option, even though it isn't - although to receive the benefits, an offender has to want to reform.
Yes which makes it quite pointless imo. I repeat that a few days behind bars and not many would come back, believes me. Humans will adapt to anything. After a few weeks inside people become used to their surroundings and prison has no fear Prison is a microcosm of life outside but in a pressure cooker atmosphere. I maintain that short sentences are a waste of time and money. He will probably do 5 weeks. Waste of time? Well his career and life is destroyed but what does that do to improve public life? Prison is not about vengeance, it is supposed to rehabilitate so to that extent it may work. I don’t know.
 


Wallace

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Nov 9, 2016
190
So his 10 week sentence will be reduced to 4 if he keeps his nose clean? I was under the impression that the early release scheme didn't apply to violent offenders? I wonder how many of the summer riots detainees will also get the benefit of an early release from 2 tier Kier?
 


WATFORD zero

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Jul 10, 2003
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So his 10 week sentence will be reduced to 4 if he keeps his nose clean? I was under the impression that the early release scheme didn't apply to violent offenders? I wonder how many of the summer riots detainees will also get the benefit of an early release from 2 tier Kier?
Since when has NSC been the place for sensible views from people who actually have experience in what they're talking about and discussion based on that knowledge :wink:

Case rests m'lud :wink:
 




Wardy's twin

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Oct 21, 2014
9,110
Because he carried on when the chap was on the floor and unable to defend himself. The sentence is appropriate.
I am not condoning what he did , in fact I would prefer more heavy sentences were passed in a lot more cases. A new growth industry should be building prisons potentially with some of the convicted doing labouring work on them.
 


happypig

Staring at the rude boys
May 23, 2009
8,411
Eastbourne
Prison is not about vengeance, it is supposed to rehabilitate so to that extent it may work. I don’t know.

The purposes of a sentence are punishment, deterrence, rehabilitation, protection of public and reparation. It should not try to achieve more than one or two of these. In Amesbury's case it's going to be punishment and deterrence. He's not a habitual offender so rehabilitation isn't appropriate.
 


Javeaseagull

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Feb 22, 2014
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The purposes of a sentence are punishment, deterrence, rehabilitation, protection of public and reparation. It should not try to achieve more than one or two of these. In Amesbury's case it's going to be punishment and deterrence. He's not a habitual offender so rehabilitation isn't appropriate.
No prison is not about punishment. First it is about keeping the public safe from violent people. Appropriate here I think. Prison is all about rehabilitation and how are you supposed to do that with a 10 week sentence? It is ludicrous to expect someone to be rehabilitated in a few f=weeks and very expensive, I might add. Perhaps we should be looking at who makes money out of this? Follow the money was always good advice as far a I am concerned.
 




Weststander

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Aug 25, 2011
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No prison is not about punishment. First it is about keeping the public safe from violent people. Appropriate here I think. Prison is all about rehabilitation and how are you supposed to do that with a 10 week sentence? It is ludicrous to expect someone to be rehabilitated in a few f=weeks and very expensive, I might add. Perhaps we should be looking at who makes money out of this? Follow the money was always good advice as far a I am concerned.

Punishment can be part of the reasoning behind a sentence, including a custodial sentence.

IMG_0422.png
 




Weststander

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That’s Scotland! What do you expect? Different in so many ways and in my opinion superior. There are so many things in Scottish law that I wish we had in England but there you go.

I found exactly the same on English law websites, that was the neatest summary for a screenshot.
 




Javeaseagull

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Feb 22, 2014
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I found exactly the same on English law websites, that was the neatest summary for a screenshot.
I was told right at the start of my career that it was not about punishment, it was about rehabilitation. What is the point of banging up people for so many months or years and then sending them back out into society? Apart from a handful of people everyone comes out to resume their lives at some point.That seems to have got lost somewhere and our prisons are bursting at the seems. I thank my lucky stars that I am out of there.
Having said that I was also told that the deprivation of freedom was punishment. That I believe to be true.
 
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Weststander

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I was told right at the start of my career that it was not about punishment, it was about rehabilitation. What is the point of banging up people for so many months or years and then sending them back out into society? Apart from a handful of people everyone comes out to resume their lives at some point.That seems to have got lost somewhere and our prisons are bursting at the seems. I thank my lucky stars that I am out of there.
Having said that I was also told that the deprivation of freedom was punishment. That I believe to be true.

With Amesbury, I just feel how I would in watching the Brighton police progs or outside a football stadium. If I saw someone coward’s punch another to the hard ground, then deliver 5 more coward’s punches to the back of the head, I’d like to see a loss of liberty. If anything, Amesbury will get the message never do that again. A £2,500 fine, clearing litter and a suspended sentence wouldn’t do it for me. It’s the sustained violence.
 


Javeaseagull

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Feb 22, 2014
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With Amesbury, I just feel how I would in watching the Brighton police progs or outside a football stadium. If I saw someone coward’s punch another to the hard ground, then deliver 5 more coward’s punches to the back of the head, I’d like to see a loss of liberty. If anything, Amesbury will get the message never do that again. A £2,500 fine, clearing litter and a suspended sentence wouldn’t do it for me. It’s the sustained violence.

Yes I can see what you mean. I really don’t have the answer but what I do know is that it is horrendously expensive to send people to prison which we all pay for. Are we getting value for money? .People banged up only to be released to carry on their previous behaviour. Will Amesbury change his way of life? I do know people that have got their act together after prison but they are not very many, unfortunately.
 




Weststander

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Aug 25, 2011
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Yes I can see what you mean. I really don’t have the answer but what I do know is that it is horrendously expensive to send people to prison which we all pay for. Are we getting value for money? .People banged up only to be released to carry on their previous behaviour. Will Amesbury change his way of life? I do know people that have got their act together after prison but they are not very many, unfortunately.

In this case he won’t be short of a bob or two. Perhaps cut the getting paralytic and work for a charity?
 


ATFC Seagull

Aberystwyth Town FC
Jul 27, 2004
5,388
(North) Portslade
I was punched in the back of the head at Leeds station in 2008. He took a massive run up (according to the police who had CCTV) and caught me completely unawares. Totally unprovoked (apart from me having been wearing an Albion top), no conversation or arguments with him whatsoever. Having seen horror stories since, I am very lucky I didn't land head first on the hard station floor.

He got a £150 fine and a 3 year football banning order.

Maybe Mr Amesbury should have said it was about football, apparently that makes it a misdemeanor.
 


happypig

Staring at the rude boys
May 23, 2009
8,411
Eastbourne
No prison is not about punishment. First it is about keeping the public safe from violent people. Appropriate here I think. Prison is all about rehabilitation and how are you supposed to do that with a 10 week sentence? It is ludicrous to expect someone to be rehabilitated in a few f=weeks and very expensive, I might add. Perhaps we should be looking at who makes money out of this? Follow the money was always good advice as far a I am concerned.

Sorry, you are wrong.


Sentencing basics​

What is a sentence?​

A sentence is the punishment a judge or magistrate decides should be given to someone who has been convicted of a crime.

It comes at the end of a prosecution. After a crime occurs, and the police arrest and charge someone, the Crown Prosecution Service decides whether to take them to court.

If they are prosecuted and either plead guilty or are found guilty by magistrates, or for more serious offences, a jury of members of the public, they are then sentenced.

The judge or magistrates look at the facts of the case and decides what the most appropriate sentence would be, based on the harm done to the victim and how blameworthy the offender is. The sentence imposed on an offender should reflect the crime they have committed and be proportionate to the seriousness of the offence. It is up to the judge or magistrates to decide how much weight to give each factor in the case they are dealing with.

What are sentences for?​

There are five things sentencing sets out to do when dealing with the vast majority of adult offenders. While punishing the offender for the crime committed is one of the purposes, there are other important aims, like preventing crime happening in the future so more people don’t become victims of the same offender.

A sentence aims to:

  • Punish the offender this can include going to prison, doing unpaid work in the community, obeying a curfew or paying a fine.
  • Reduce crime – by preventing the offender from committing more crime and putting others off from committing similar offences.
  • Reform and rehabilitate offenders – changing an offender’s behaviour to prevent future crime for example by requiring an offender to have treatment for drug addiction or alcohol abuse.
  • Protect the public – from the offender and from the risk of more crimes being committed by them. This could be by putting them in prison, restricting their activities or supervision by probation.
  • Make the offender give something back – for example, by the payment of compensation or through restorative justice. Restorative justice gives victims the chance to tell offenders about the impact of their crime and get an apology.
 


Javeaseagull

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Feb 22, 2014
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Sorry, you are wrong.


Sentencing basics​

What is a sentence?​

A sentence is the punishment a judge or magistrate decides should be given to someone who has been convicted of a crime.

It comes at the end of a prosecution. After a crime occurs, and the police arrest and charge someone, the Crown Prosecution Service decides whether to take them to court.

If they are prosecuted and either plead guilty or are found guilty by magistrates, or for more serious offences, a jury of members of the public, they are then sentenced.

The judge or magistrates look at the facts of the case and decides what the most appropriate sentence would be, based on the harm done to the victim and how blameworthy the offender is. The sentence imposed on an offender should reflect the crime they have committed and be proportionate to the seriousness of the offence. It is up to the judge or magistrates to decide how much weight to give each factor in the case they are dealing with.

What are sentences for?​

There are five things sentencing sets out to do when dealing with the vast majority of adult offenders. While punishing the offender for the crime committed is one of the purposes, there are other important aims, like preventing crime happening in the future so more people don’t become victims of the same offender.

A sentence aims to:

  • Punish the offender this can include going to prison, doing unpaid work in the community, obeying a curfew or paying a fine.
  • Reduce crime – by preventing the offender from committing more crime and putting others off from committing similar offences.
  • Reform and rehabilitate offenders – changing an offender’s behaviour to prevent future crime for example by requiring an offender to have treatment for drug addiction or alcohol abuse.
  • Protect the public – from the offender and from the risk of more crimes being committed by them. This could be by putting them in prison, restricting their activities or supervision by probation.
  • Make the offender give something back – for example, by the payment of compensation or through restorative justice. Restorative justice gives victims the chance to tell offenders about the impact of their crime and get an apology.
Yes, I get that but sentences can be suspended and I maintain that short sentences are futile as well as expensive.
 






Hiheidi

Well-known member
Dec 27, 2022
2,380
The one punch campaign has done a lot of work to highlight the devastation that just a single punch can cause including death or brain damage. The sentence needs to reflect the danger of this to society (and deter others), so custodial preferable to community based. Notably he will receive full pay whilst in prison (his MP salary is £91,346).
 


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