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[Food] The Great British Dilemma



Bozza

Bozza

You can change this
Helpful Moderator
Jul 4, 2003
57,498
Back in Sussex
So, this was tonight...

Dinner out in Worthing at <REDACTED>.

The food was great. The drinks were great. Service was meh. But I love the restaurant and will return. In fact, I have another booking for a week tonight.

Between the bill arriving and the waitress coming to take payment, we were discussing the meal and the service. As above, we agreed the food was great, but the service was lacking. Well, maybe not lacking but just a bit perfunctory. It was going through the motions. No warmth at all at any point.

So, when the waitress asked "how was everything?", I had the great dilemma - did I say "Yes, everything was fantastic" or did I say "We really loved the food and drink, but the service felt a bit off tonight"?

I committed the great British crime by doing the latter. This led to an obviously awkward conversation. I explained the food and drink were great, but we felt like we were a bit of an inconvenience to the waiting staff. We sat down at 9 - I don't think anyone arrived after us - although there were other tables present whilst we were paying.

The waitress offered to take the service charge off the bill, but I said I was happy to pay it, which I did.

After we'd paid, the waitress retreated to her colleagues, and clearly immediately shared what I'd said. There was a lot of defensive body language going on, and I couldn't wait to stand up, face their way, and thank them.

I stood, I thanked, and people wanted me to die on the spot.

But, ya know, what do you do? Be British and say "everything was great!" when it wasn't, or try to be constructive.

Regardless, there's going to be flob in my food next week...
 




Easy 10

Easy 10

Brain dead MUG SHEEP
Jul 5, 2003
62,465
Location Location
I applaud your honesty, but by telling her the service was a bit off, I think you have to ask - "so, what did I achieve there ?"

You still paid the service charge, so no gain there. You likely upset some staff who had probably been there 9-10 hours (which may have been a factor in their perfunctory service, not that it should be an excuse). And yes, you could well end up with a grolly hocked up in your moussaka next week.

Like I say, I can respect your honesty and candidness, which was by the sounds of it very justified. But we British do tend to just "rub along" and be nice. Maybe play the long game. Don't get me wrong - if there's something duff with my scran then I'm no shrinking violet in raising it. But if the meal was decent then I'm not sure I would be so bold as to look a waitress in the eye afterwards and basically say "what gives ?"
 


studio150

studio150

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 30, 2011
30,320
On the Border
Given that the service charge is basically to cover service, which you received, but wasn't that poor that you would ask for it to be removed from the bill, I would have not said anything about it to the waitress, and just have settled the bill.

I would then probably for the next couple of months mention it to friends and say we aren't looking to return anytime soon.

Hopefully your food tastes just as good next week.
 




Chicken Run

Chicken Run

Member Since Jul 2003
NSC Patron
Jul 17, 2003
19,958
Valley of Hangleton
Bozza said:
So, this was tonight...

Dinner out in Worthing at <REDACTED>.

The food was great. The drinks were great. Service was meh. But I love the restaurant and will return. In fact, I have another booking for a week tonight.

Between the bill arriving and the waitress coming to take payment, we were discussing the meal and the service. As above, we agreed the food was great, but the service was lacking. Well, maybe not lacking but just a bit perfunctory. It was going through the motions. No warmth at all at any point.

So, when the waitress asked "how was everything?", I had the great dilemma - did I say "Yes, everything was fantastic" or did I say "We really loved the food and drink, but the service felt a bit off tonight"?

I committed the great British crime by doing the latter. This led to an obviously awkward conversation. I explained the food and drink were great, but we felt like we were a bit of an inconvenience to the waiting staff. We sat down at 9 - I don't think anyone arrived after us - although there were other tables present whilst we were paying.

The waitress offered to take the service charge off the bill, but I said I was happy to pay it, which I did.

After we'd paid, the waitress retreated to her colleagues, and clearly immediately shared what I'd said. There was a lot of defensive body language going on, and I couldn't wait to stand up, face their way, and thank them.

I stood, I thanked, and people wanted me to die on the spot.

But, ya know, what do you do? Be British and say "everything was great!" when it wasn't, or try to be constructive.

Regardless, there's going to be flob in my food next week...
Click to expand...
Whack a “constructive….” google review up and what was the name of the establishment?
 




Rdodge30

Rdodge30

Well-known member
Dec 30, 2022
758
We’ve all been mugged off for decades with tipping, I see reels of fast food delivery drivers guilting out people for not tipping.

Automatic service charges are outrageous behaviour… your tip has automatically been added to your bill but you can remove it if you so choose ??…. How do we come to accept such rudeness as standard practice?

My own personal tipping tends to fluctuate more in line with my own financial situation than anything else- my most common tips are the change when I’m paying cash in a breakfast cafe

The last time I tipped someone was this year when the sewer drain behind one of my shops was blocked. It’s a shared drain with the flats upstairs who were unquestionably responsible for blocking it but rather than argue the case with them I simply got the drainage bloke out on a Sunday morning… thinking the situation was close to a disaster zone and he had the job done in 40minutes UNBELIEVABLE! He charged me £200 and I gave him £20 for coming out on a Sunday.


As for mentioning indifferenct service in a restaurant, highly unlikely unless the waiting staff had been rude, in which case I would call it there and then
 


Birdie Boy

Birdie Boy

Well-known member
Jun 17, 2011
4,447
I had a similar dilemma in a small French ski resort a few years ago. I had the monkfish for dinner and it was overcooked. I said to the wife about it and I kept muttering to myself, don't say anything. Waitress comes up with the bill and says how was everything... fish overcooked says me. I will get the chef says her... 5 minutes later we are getting kicked out of the restaurant!
This was the first evening, next evening we went to the restaurant/pub next door which was OK. Three next and last evening, we walked for 2 hours before finding another restaurant! Walks in and I ask for a table for 2, the English owner says he did have one but that's the last time anyone will speak English in here. Bloody great night!
 


G

Greg Bobkin

Silver Seagull
May 22, 2012
16,274
Honestly is the best policy - and people should be able to give feedback if someone asks a question like that.

Mediocre now seems to be the default setting for restaurant service, in my experience. And most people just accept it. Good for you, for doing what others wouldn't.
 






Westdene Seagull

Westdene Seagull

aka Cap'n Carl Firecrotch
NSC Patron
Oct 27, 2003
21,581
The arse end of Hangleton
Birdie Boy said:
I had a similar dilemma in a small French ski resort a few years ago. I had the monkfish for dinner and it was overcooked. I said to the wife about it and I kept muttering to myself, don't say anything. Waitress comes up with the bill and says how was everything... fish overcooked says me. I will get the chef says her... 5 minutes later we are getting kicked out of the restaurant!
This was the first evening, next evening we went to the restaurant/pub next door which was OK. Three next and last evening, we walked for 2 hours before finding another restaurant! Walks in and I ask for a table for 2, the English owner says he did have one but that's the last time anyone will speak English in here. Bloody great night!
Click to expand...
I never see the point of raising an issue with the food at the point of payng the bill - especially if the food has actually been eaten. It's much fairer on the restuarant to raise it at the timing of eating. That way they have the chance to recook the dish, replace with a different dish or to take it off the bill.

As for @Bozza 's service issue, unless the service was dire I wouldn't mention it if I've enjoyed the food.
 


Happy Exile

Happy Exile

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Apr 19, 2018
2,177
I think it’s great that you did it and imagine the response was because many people aren’t great at receiving feedback and conflate polite honesty with rudeness rather than kindness. Businesses can fail if everyone is too “nice” to share when something isn’t right but just stop going there instead and tells their friends etc. I’d probably be a coward in your situation though and not say anything in the moment but email the restaurant after and try to be constructively helpful to them.

I’d probably still do that now given how poorly the staff took it - specific examples and encouragement rather than criticism. Fear of flob might mean I’d never go back though because it doesn’t sound like they’ll be great at being helped with how to make it an even better place to go…and that’s the problem. Customer loyalty is essential and that comes from the whole experience, and they’re failing on one of the most important parts of that.
 
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bhafc99

bhafc99

Well-known member
Oct 14, 2003
7,478
Dubai
Rather than directly saying "the service was a bit off", you could have tried something like "the atmosphere was a bit flat compared to our previous visits – are you guys short-staffed tonight, or over-worked with the Christmas period...?"

Lets them know they didn't really deliver good service, but in a way that doesn't sound so critical – and in fact 'feigns understanding/sympathy' to make them (hopefully) feel a tad guilty.
 


Tom Hark Preston Park

Tom Hark Preston Park

Will Post For Cash
Jul 6, 2003
72,658
If you thought the service was lacking in warmth this Saturday @Bozza, just wait til you go back again next Saturday - assuming you can get any of your mortified companions to go with you :lolol:

NSC demands a full report!
 


Herr Tubthumper

Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
63,004
The Fatherland
It’s a situation I have been in a few times. Given how dire it is to hire waiting staff in the post-Brexit and Covid era, I cut restaurants, bars and cafes a fair bit of slack with their service. Unless it’s truly bad I wouldn’t say anything.
 




Birdie Boy

Birdie Boy

Well-known member
Jun 17, 2011
4,447
Westdene Seagull said:
I never see the point of raising an issue with the food at the point of payng the bill - especially if the food has actually been eaten. It's much fairer on the restuarant to raise it at the timing of eating. That way they have the chance to recook the dish, replace with a different dish or to take it off the bill.

As for @Bozza 's service issue, unless the service was dire I wouldn't mention it if I've enjoyed the food.
Click to expand...
I didn't eat all of the fish, only the parts not overcooked. But yes, I should have said earlier but didn't want a fuss! I did on another occasion bring it up and the owner ended up taking me into the kitchen to explain to the chef who actually did agree and cooked a fresh one.
 


S

sussex_guy2k2

Well-known member
Jun 6, 2014
4,308
I’ve had this conversation multiple times before. I hate service charges anywhere. I’m very much a believer that you should charge someone for the whole price of something and pay your staff properly.

I also don’t think I’ve ever experienced great service in restaurants, even when abroad in places like Italy and the US, where the service industry is either more respected, or where they expect much higher %s for service charges. I don’t think I can even tell you what great service looks like. Is it a particularly smiley service person? Someone who talks to us a lot? Someone that recommends food? Wine? Or someone that deals with problems with food well, without fuss? Sometimes, doing some of these things can detract from the meal. Although we can all tell what bad service looks like, of course.

But in terms of how I deal with that knowledge and those feelings, I tend to work on the basis that I will just pay it if the service charge is 10-12.5%, unless the service is really not good (and I’ve no problem telling someone if it isn’t - however, I’ll have told them if there’s a problem long before paying the bill). I work in America fairly frequently and avoid eating out there as I despise the 20-40% charges you’re expected to pay in some places and the attitudes you can get from some of their service staff, but the above rates in England are fine. If it goes beyond that, I’ll tell them what I’m comfortable paying. If they have a problem with that, I’m more than happy talking to management or leaving reviews - although the former has only happened twice in my lifetime where really bad service was followed by an expectation that I paid a service charge of 30% (got to love the US…).

I find in England, most service staff just stay out of the way, and I like that. So for 10%, it’s usually not worth arguing the toss over just because they may be a bit tired from a long shift on rubbish pay.
 


Y

Yes Chef

Well-known member
Apr 11, 2016
1,909
In the kitchen
I'm not making excuses for the front of house team, but they were probably worn out from one of the busiest days during a busy time of year, so when a late-ish table comes in it's difficult to be sparkling and effervescent.

They've probably had to deal with loads of once a year morons as well lately, so may well be particularly sensitive to criticism.

That's not your fault of course - perhaps what I would have done in your situation was see if it was the start of a trend. If the indifferent service continued, it would be more than reasonable to raise it - especially if you are a regular customer spending lots of money
 
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GingerBeerMan

GingerBeerMan

3-0
Dec 29, 2011
8,215
bhafc99 said:
Rather than directly saying "the service was a bit off", you could have tried something like "the atmosphere was a bit flat compared to our previous visits – are you guys short-staffed tonight, or over-worked with the Christmas period...?"

Lets them know they didn't really deliver good service, but in a way that doesn't sound so critical – and in fact 'feigns understanding/sympathy' to make them (hopefully) feel a tad guilty.
Click to expand...
What a great response. I'd love to know what field you work in?

Couldn't Be Hyypia said:
If the service ruined the atmosphere then I'd give some feedback. Not to the staff, but to the manager. I'd do the same if the service was great.
Click to expand...
This is the way to go. To justify your criticism of staff (or 'feedback') as constructive you need to think they've taken it on board. And I can tell you that min-wage staff won't have given a toss. But telling the manager will help the restaurant by allowing him to change a few things, and won't make the service staff feel personally bad after a long shift.

So, a quiet word with the manager would be my go-to.
 


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