Really? I thought the education system was underfunded with a shortage of teachers, crumbing buildings and excessive class sizes. Have I got this wrong?
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[Politics] The Labour Government
- Thread starter Super Steve Earle
- Start date
Really? I thought the education system was underfunded with a shortage of teachers, crumbing buildings and excessive class sizes. Have I got this wrong?
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
What are you talking about? Tony Blair’s first main educational policy was the 1998 School Standards and Framework Act which laid down plans for specialist academies and taking failing schools out of LA control - much to the chargrin of Labour traditionalists who felt this was just a continuation of Thatcher’s 1988 Education Act. Tony Blair was in favour of parental choice and creating more specialist schools. This went even further in 2002 Education Act allowing private companies or religion to get more involved in certain schools.
So your wide sweeping generalisation about Labour and education is completely wide of the mark given Blair had a Tory mindset when it came to education largely under the influence of Andrew Adonis and US models of charter schools.
At the moment, Labour haven’t announced what they are doing with the current academy white paper, or any radical education policy generally, they’ve not even announced the rate of VAT they might apply to private education. Like I say, huge amount of hand wringing going on as you’ve just proved.
What they are actually doing is making sure that the businesses that run private schools pay VAT like most other businesses in the country. That's the equality they are trying to achieve.
They will then use that increased tax to help the majority of children.
- Jul 10, 2003
- 27,721
The one thing I would point out about BHASVIC is although it is very high achieving, it's not the most supportive of the 6th form colleges around. The experiences of people I know who have been there (and it's a lot) is that if you are very good academically and need very little support it is excellent.
I've also had experience with people who have gone to various other colleges and Blatchington Mill, Cardinal Newman and Varndean seem to be the most supportive of pupils who struggle with anything academically.
dsr-burnley
Well-known member
- Aug 15, 2014
- 2,620
Most private schools are charities, not businesses.
It's generally stated that VAT is a tax on the individual, not the company. Changing the VAT rate is like changing the income tax rate for PAYE - it doesn't affect the company's profits in itself, it affects the amount the individual pays.
Just on this one, you could say this about any profession. I know plenty of doctors, nurses and social workers who terrify me, but I know others that were genuinely amazing.
I think public sector jobs like teaching and the NHS generally have people who start on that career as a vocation, but get ground down by the nature of trying to be a good, passionate caring doctor/nurse/teacher/social worker in an environment that's both financially and/or creatively straight-jacketed. They're also generally the first to be blamed when things go wrong.
In my experience. public sector teachers and social workers rarely go into it for the money, they go into it because it's what they want to do.
worthingweird
Well-known member
- Mar 8, 2023
- 356
Children will be forced out by higher fees and put more pressure on local schools...
keaton
Big heart, hot blood and balls. Big balls
- Nov 18, 2004
- 9,971
Or fill the available spaces?
In some schools and some areas where there are issues with overcrowding. But numbers coming through are getting smaller and smaller which puts far more pressure on schools and local authorities
Is it PotG?
Thrifty non-licker
Indeed, even higher class sizes.
Schools are closing or reducing class numbers because of falling intake numbers. Reduced numbers means lower income (per pupil) from the state/local councils.
Children moving from private schools will fill classes but increase the payments made by local authorities. Not sure if it’s a false economy.
Is it PotG?
Thrifty non-licker
The more popular schools are constantly oversubscribed, the less desirable not so.
Private schools choose to register for charitable status for the various benefits that brings. Do not mistake this for a real charity.
I mentioned earlier that the change in VAT shouldn't affect the business - but be passed on to the parents. It's up to them to then choose whether they can afford it or not. Like the majority of us when making any purchase-based decision.
Most private schools claim to be charities for tax purposes. They are not, themselves, charities.
keaton
Big heart, hot blood and balls. Big balls
- Nov 18, 2004
- 9,971
Pupil funding is something like £8k pa. From the numbers quoted that's the VAT on 1-2 pupils at a private school
keaton
Big heart, hot blood and balls. Big balls
- Nov 18, 2004
- 9,971
Yes, because that's the definition of popular and less desirable school?
Is it PotG?
Thrifty non-licker
dsr-burnley
Well-known member
- Aug 15, 2014
- 2,620
The distinction being that businesses are run for profit, charities aren't. There is argument that educating children should not be seen as a charitable purpose, but their legal status is that of non-profit making entities.
Changes in VAT do affect businesses. You said yourself that this change is to make "businesses" pay VAT; now you say that businesses do not pay VAT; but either way, a 20% increase in prices will affect the business or charity, even if yonly indirectly.
pocketseagull
Well-known member
- Dec 29, 2014
- 1,360
I believed Starmer and Reeves were too smart to repeat austerity. It appears I was wrong | David Blanchflower
New governments usually come into power offering hope and a break with the past. This one is squandering the opportunity for a fresh start, says David Blanchflower
www.theguardian.com
Nothing to do with declining birth rates in recent years then?