[Travel] Tourism Backlash

[Half Time Pies]

According to UBS’s latest Global Wealth Report, some 500,000 millionaires will leave the U.K. by 2028, equivalent to a 17% fall, due to the scrapping of non dom status. Spain and Italy are expected to be the main destinations which is where the bulk of the anti tourist protests are. I wonder whether they will be welcome for their spending power or will attract protests as tourists?

Always important to clarify/ fact check statements like this:

Paul Donovan, Chief Economist of UBS Global Wealth Management, said the shift away from Britain partly reflected the fact that, with the third highest number of millionaires, its figure was currently "disproportionately high."
"You have obviously seen in the U.K. over the last few years, as you have seen in other countries, implications arising from sanctions against Russia," he told a press conference.

Donovan said Britain's decision to scrap its "non-dom" status - which lets wealthy, often foreign residents avoid tax on overseas income - had also had a "small effect."
"The non-indigenous millionaire population, the global population, which is constantly shifting, will be looking for low tax locations all of the time," he said, adding this was "not a function of UK policies per se" but reflected the "pull factors" of other countries, pointing to Dubai and Singapore.

https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/britain-likely-lose-nearly-one-six-millionaires-by-2028-report-says-2024-07-10/

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Residential housing is essential. Holidays are not. Therefore prioritize residential.

I’d say get the infrastructure right first.
Holidays are nice but hardly essential.

 

[BrightonCottager]

I agree. No matter how wealthy I become, the idea of owning a holiday home (that stays empty most of the time) make me feel icky. That said, I'm staying in an airBNB in Sennen in a few weeks which is, presumably, a holiday home of sorts. Investing in an AirBNB is OK isn't it?

If you mean investing your capital into one, then no it isn't. This is a major part of the short term let problem - they have become an investment vehicle. I got a lot of the data for my research from a website (AirDNA) set up specifically to cater for investors. Since then, AirBnB have become a lot more restrictive with their data to the extent to which the mayor of Paris fined them €Ms for not handing it over for regulatory purposes.

Investing in property in general is a big problem with the housing shortage- a large part of the London market is driven by marketing to the Far East market so that rich Chinese and other nationalities can move money and leave the properties empty most of the year. The knock on effect ripples out around London. This is why simply building more homes isn't necessarily the answer to reducing prices and rentals. We need rent controls or disincentives as well.

If you mean staying in a AirBnB, then you are helping to perpetuate the issue (I've occasionally done it myself abroard). Soz. If they were properly regulated and taxed like in some foreign countries, then I would feel a lot happier.

Most Councils now charge double Council Tax for empty second homes which is progress. But the licencing system and half-hearted planning controls have yet to become operational, so there's a long wait for any meaningful regulation in England.

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

Investing in property in general is a big problem with the housing shortage- a large part of the London market is driven by marketing to the Far East market so that rich Chinese and other nationalities can move money and leave the properties empty most of the year. The knock on effect ripples out around London. This is why simply building more homes isn't necessarily the answer to reducing prices and rentals. We need rent controls or disincentives as well.

I am not sure if this is true now so please correct me, I work for a flooring firm and I look after a major house builder, tenders and seeing the projects through and we have seen a drop in orders because they simply are not selling houses, but I have been told that some investment firms or whatever are buying up rows of houses now at a slightly cheaper price, free flooring etc (we call them stock plots) and then renting them out, waiting for the housing market to boom again and then will sell them for a profit, and presumably turfing out the tenants who cannot get on the property ladder.
If true, that sticks in my throat a bit.

 

[BrightonCottager]

I am not sure if this is true now so please correct me, I work for a flooring firm and I look after a major house builder, tenders and seeing the projects through and we have seen a drop in orders because they simply are not selling houses, but I have been told that some investment firms or whatever are buying up rows of houses now at a slightly cheaper price, free flooring etc (we call them stock plots) and then renting them out, waiting for the housing market to boom again and then will sell them for a profit, and presumably turfing out the tenants who cannot get on the property ladder.
If true, that sticks in my throat a bit.

Apparently higher interest rates are slowing the sales of housing generally especially at the middle and top of the market. Certainly there's been a big drop in new homes being built which may be a response to housebuilders not being happy with their profit margins and thereby choking supply to boost demand and prices. Again, it's an example of housing being used as an investment vehicle rather than meeting a basic human need (a decent place to live at an affordable price).

If Labour actually end 'no fault' evictions, won't that stop the practice you refer to?

 

[dsr-burnley]

holidays are a luxury, if you cant afford them do something cheaper or not at all. it's not the place of governement to provide you with what you think is cheap enough holiday. policy should build more absolutely, also addressing market distortions that increase demand for houses from non-residental purposes.

The government doesn't provide holidays, cheap or otherwise. This thread is about whether the government should prevent other people from providing cheaper holidays for the less well-off, or whether (as appears to be the majority view on here) whether the less well-off should be told to stop at home while the rich continue as they arer.

If there are not enough houses for what people want, then build more. It really is that simple.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

If you mean investing your capital into one, then no it isn't. This is a major part of the short term let problem - they have become an investment vehicle. I got a lot of the data for my research from a website (AirDNA) set up specifically to cater for investors. Since then, AirBnB have become a lot more restrictive with their data to the extent to which the mayor of Paris fined them €Ms for not handing it over for regulatory purposes.

Investing in property in general is a big problem with the housing shortage- a large part of the London market is driven by marketing to the Far East market so that rich Chinese and other nationalities can move money and leave the properties empty most of the year. The knock on effect ripples out around London. This is why simply building more homes isn't necessarily the answer to reducing prices and rentals. We need rent controls or disincentives as well.

If you mean staying in a AirBnB, then you are helping to perpetuate the issue (I've occasionally done it myself abroard). Soz. If they were properly regulated and taxed like in some foreign countries, then I would feel a lot happier.

Most Councils now charge double Council Tax for empty second homes which is progress. But the licencing system and half-hearted planning controls have yet to become operational, so there's a long wait for any meaningful regulation in England.

Thanks for that. Very helpful. I am a user not investor.

 

[Bakero]

The government doesn't provide holidays, cheap or otherwise. This thread is about whether the government should prevent other people from providing cheaper holidays for the less well-off, or whether (as appears to be the majority view on here) whether the less well-off should be told to stop at home while the rich continue as they arer.

If there are not enough houses for what people want, then build more. It really is that simple.

No, the thread is about whether governments should take action to help their citizens.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The government doesn't provide holidays, cheap or otherwise. This thread is about whether the government should prevent other people from providing cheaper holidays for the less well-off, or whether (as appears to be the majority view on here) whether the less well-off should be told to stop at home while the rich continue as they arer.

If there are not enough houses for what people want, then build more. It really is that simple.

Maybe consider camping? It’s a very cheap form of holiday.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Maybe consider camping? It’s a very cheap form of holiday.

Or youth hostelling

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Or youth hostelling

There you go. Plenty of options.

 

[BrightonCottager]

Looks like the Council is going to (again) look at tackling AirBnBs - agreed by all Councillors, but raised by a Green for a ward most affected. Link to story is here. There were a reported 4500 short term lets in B&H.

When I did my research (2020) there were 3353 lets, 2236 of them entire homes. These could have housed a third of the households on the Council's housing waiting list at the time and was equivalent to 1.6 years of the 5 years housing land supply that the Council had to allocate for housing or grant permission for.

 

[Bakero]

Poo-smeared lockboxes found at tourist apartments in Seville

Anti-tourism protesters in Spain are reportedly resorting to novel techniques to deter visitors.

www.euronews.com

 

[Publius Ovidius]

Looks like the Council is going to (again) look at tackling AirBnBs - agreed by all Councillors, but raised by a Green for a ward most affected. Link to story is here. There were a reported 4500 short term lets in B&H.

When I did my research (2020) there were 3353 lets, 2236 of them entire homes. These could have housed a third of the households on the Council's housing waiting list at the time and was equivalent to 1.6 years of the 5 years housing land supply that the Council had to allocate for housing or grant permission for.

Were they short term air bnb type let’s or long term lets. I don’t think you can count the two as the same piece of the pie

 

[BrightonCottager]

Were they short term air bnb type let’s or long term lets. I don’t think you can count the two as the same piece of the pie

They were short term lets (STLs). One of the biggest impacts of STLs has been the impact on the long term rental market - especially in smaller tourist towns in the SW - 'traditional' landlords switching to short term. In 2020, average daily rental rate in B&H of STLs was £121 & they were occupied 70% of the time.

 

[BLOCK F]

I don’t know how you would do this in practice but a solution could be for everyone to have an allowance of say two ‘climate change tax free’ flights p.a. and any more would attract a significant tax premium.

Could I sell my allowance please?

 

[BLOCK F]

I still go ‘down west’ …but out of season which ties in with my own ‘season’ of work and it fits my budget

So do we.
Living no more than 100 yards from the beach and retired, we stay at home during the summer and venture west from Mid September at the earliest. Better rates in the hotels too and no unbearably busy crowds.

 

[Publius Ovidius]

They were short term lets (STLs). One of the biggest impacts of STLs has been the impact on the long term rental market - especially in smaller tourist towns in the SW - 'traditional' landlords switching to short term. In 2020, average daily rental rate in B&H of STLs was £121 & they were occupied 70% of the time.

Gotcha. It’s such a difficult one to manage and legislate for. I suppose the only way to do it is to have local bylaws that prohibit short term let and set minimum tenancy. But again how do you police it

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Gotcha. It’s such a difficult one to manage and legislate for. I suppose the only way to do it is to have local bylaws that prohibit short term let and set minimum tenancy. But again how do you police it

Other cities have brought in workable AirBnB legislation. In Berlin for example you have to obtain a license, and display the license number when advertising your AirBnB (or whatever platform you use) property.

There’s also a dedicated team in Berlin which monitors lets…plus a snitch line. In Hamburg it’s been very successfully and they’ve clawed back a lot of tax from illegal let’s.

There was a noticeable drop in AirBnBs in Berlin when the laws changed. It can be done.

 

[dsr-burnley]

Gotcha. It’s such a difficult one to manage and legislate for. I suppose the only way to do it is to have local bylaws that prohibit short term let and set minimum tenancy. But again how do you police it

Ban tourists, perhaps. Hotels could be converted into apartments fairly easily, and provide a lot more homes than if we aim only at banning those tourists who like self-catering.