[News] Today is International Men's Day

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

As a middle aged white man in lycra, I think I feel our hardship more than any other group in society, so I'm relieved I can have a day where I'm appreciated and my oppression is lifted.

Fixed that for you

 

[Stat Brother]

Fixed that for you

Those were the days

 

[The Wizard]

White men are the worst, I just saw one eating hummous with carrot sticks.

 

[lost in london]

I do research on gender inequality. Why? Do you consider issues such as high suicide, homelessness and child custody insignificant and not worth discussing then?

The issues are relevant, of course. But the tone of this sort of argument often seems to be that as soon as women might raise some gripes about inequality (or stat brother makes a sarcastic post), certain types of mens rights group push back with whataboutery, arguing, as you seem to be, that men also face gender inequality. Both sets of arguments and problems can co-exist, and it may well be the case that white men face discrimination (I've never experienced it so can't say), but in my opinion and experience almost all women think they have a harder time of things than men, but only a reasonably small percentage of men would argue white males face discrimination.

Frankly being born a white male in a first world country in current times is about a good a position to be born in when compared to any other gender / race / time in history and we deserve things being made a bit more difficult for us if it gives other groups a leg up.

 

[Wilko]

The issues are relevant, of course. But the tone of this sort of argument often seems to be that as soon as women might raise some gripes about inequality (or stat brother makes a sarcastic post), certain types of mens rights group push back with whataboutery, arguing, as you seem to be, that men also face gender inequality. Both sets of arguments and problems can co-exist, and it may well be the case that white men face discrimination (I've never experienced it so can't say), but in my opinion and experience almost all women think they have a harder time of things than men, but only a reasonably small percentage of men would argue white males face discrimination.

Frankly being born a white male in a first world country in current times is about a good a position to be born in when compared to any other gender / race / time in history and we deserve things being made a bit more difficult for us if it gives other groups a leg up.

I do think that women face more discrimination and inequality. That does not make men’s issues redundant though.


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[Cheshire Cat]

and by jove we need it.

Have we ever been as put upon as we are right now, fellas?

It's good to finally get some recognition for all our pain and suffering.
As a middle aged white man, I think I feel our hardship more than any other group in society, so I'm relieved I can have a day where I'm appreciated and my oppression is lifted.


Am I right brothers?

Snowflake

 

[dingodan]

The issues are relevant, of course. But the tone of this sort of argument often seems to be that as soon as women might raise some gripes about inequality (or stat brother makes a sarcastic post), certain types of mens rights group push back with whataboutery, arguing, as you seem to be, that men also face gender inequality. Both sets of arguments and problems can co-exist, and it may well be the case that white men face discrimination (I've never experienced it so can't say), but in my opinion and experience almost all women think they have a harder time of things than men, but only a reasonably small percentage of men would argue white males face discrimination.

Frankly being born a white male in a first world country in current times is about a good a position to be born in when compared to any other gender / race / time in history and we deserve things being made a bit more difficult for us if it gives other groups a leg up.

You should give this a watch.

 

[Pavilionaire]

It does feel as though after decades - even centuries - of neglect the sexual equality issue is now being delivered in turbo-charged fashion, be it more women in top jobs in politics, industry, civil service etc, more female presenters on TV and radio, more female sport on telly.

Generally speaking, things that are rushed through are seldom done well. Are we making things better, or simply ticking some boxes?

 

[The_Viper]

This thread is a total dumpster fire as predicted. Shocking for a lot of you, but women facing issues and men facing issues isn't an either/or problem. Both can and do face issues, both can and should be addressed. Only one side is right now, and it's terrifying to think of all the young men being constantly told they're worth nothing online these days, killing themselves and then being shrugged off as "its payback for the past". Yikes.

 

[Wilko]

This thread is a total dumpster fire as predicted. Shocking for a lot of you, but women facing issues and men facing issues isn't an either/or problem. Both can and do face issues, both can and should be addressed. Only one side is right now, and it's terrifying to think of all the young men being constantly told they're worth nothing online these days, killing themselves and then being shrugged off as "its payback for the past". Yikes.

Exactly. Looking at and considering issues that men face is not about putting down women’s issues, it’s also not about making a comparison about who has it worse either. It is simply noting some issues that many males may face in the world today.

The fact that many mock and eye roll highlights the very issue- that we expect men to shut up, stiff upper lip, hold your emotions in and use humour to deflect concerns. If we want men to speak up more then we also need to listen when they do.


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[Southpaw]

It does feel as though after decades - even centuries - of neglect the sexual equality issue is now being delivered in turbo-charged fashion, be it more women in top jobs in politics, industry, civil service etc, more female presenters on TV and radio, more female sport on telly.

Generally speaking, things that are rushed through are seldom done well. Are we making things better, or simply ticking some boxes?

For sure we are ticking boxes.It's no longer about giving a job to the right person.

 

[Southpaw]

Feminism is about bringing women up to the level where they might be behind men,ie equal pay,but leaving them above men in any area where they might be above,ie,custody of children.

 

[BBassic]

Personally believe that some of these problems shouldn't be divided along gender lines.

Suicide, mental health, violence, sexual assault should all be treated as a human problem rather than a male / female one.

 

[Wilko]

Personally believe that some of these problems shouldn't be divided along gender lines.

Suicide, mental health, violence, sexual assault should all be treated as a human problem rather than a male / female one.

I kind of agree which is why the more reading I do, the more I start to think that Feminism and MRAs are often dangerous and divisive as they fall into the problem of looking at gender issues with one eye shut. I have long advocated the need for a gender equality movement which considers inequalities from both sides because feminism and mens rights groups have become tarnished through misandry and misogyny.

Men's international day should be an opportunity to raise issues and concerns, all it seems to do is start the mud sligning between men and women. It should not be a competition.

 

[Wilko]

Frankly being born a white male in a first world country in current times is about a good a position to be born in when compared to any other gender / race / time in history and we deserve things being made a bit more difficult for us if it gives other groups a leg up.

Surely it should be giving people a leg up not about pulling one down? I do not understand how this new woke fashion of slagging off white men helps the racial or gender equality movement in anyway whatsoever. No one should be judged, discriminated against or stereotyped based on their gender or skin colour.



From 1 minute in. Perfect indictment of where we seem to be going wrong.

 

[GT49er]

The issues are relevant, of course. But the tone of this sort of argument often seems to be that as soon as women might raise some gripes about inequality (or stat brother makes a sarcastic post), certain types of mens rights group push back with whataboutery.

But that is exactly what happens, only the other way round, as soon as men 'raise some gripes', to use your rather derogatory phrase.

Fortunately, this thread has generally included a lot of common sense and well-informed comment (thank you [MENTION=1022]Wilko[/MENTION]!) To those who bristle with indignation at the idea of a Men's Day to highlight issues which do affect men - come on, get a grip, it's one day out of 365! Is that too much to ask?

 

[piersa]

Jesus wept, what fathers-for-justice-incel-when's-international-mens-day-straight-pride website did you pinch that from?

Irony just died.

 

[piersa]

You should give this a watch.

He certainly should. It's bang on the money.

 

[surlyseagull]

To be fair though, we get shorter queues for the bogs so it doesn't go all one way

Not at the bloody Amex we dont.

 

[lost in london]

You should give this a watch.

That's interesting, thanks for the link