The Margaret Thatcher is Dead Thread

[alan partridge]

Thats a good thing you have said for a change TD.

er, how old were youwhen maggie was in power strike?

 

[Yorkie]

er, how old were youwhen maggie was in power strike?

Nothing to do with his age or Maggie for that matter.

He was pointing out that Terrace Dandy had said something positive instead of being negative about other people's views.

 

[clapham_gull]

clapham_gull

Really?? Not the impression I got living in Yorkshire.

Yes the miners were let down but a lot of that was due to Arthur Scargill and the way he handle the strike situation.
A lot of pit closures were inevitable because the Government couldn't subsidise the price of coal any longer. Scargill just called all the miners out and it didn't save the pits but caused untold misery for the families.
They were extremely well paid workers and what should have happened was that the fields where it was still viable to mine (eg Selby) should have been left and miners given the choice of redundancy (coming out of it with large sums of money like the steel workers) or relocating to workable mines.

I wasn't talking about the Miners strike.

I'm talking about the general state of the inner cities at the time.

Brighton played Barnsley during the time of the minors strike, and we talked to a few miners who were very anti the way in which Scargill was behaving at the time. We heard a few stories about him and his cronies moving out to a hotel during the strike whilst the families were suffering - as much due to his actions as the governments.

But, whoevers fault the minors strike was - I don't think that referring to them as "the enemy within" was particularly helpful at the time was it ?

My point is - whatever the rights or wrongs or her actions - I don't feel that she was particularly caring about the lives of those effected.

Individuals within the government such as Hesletine wanted to help these people and build bridges but his advice was ignored.

 

[Yorkie]

Re: clapham_gull

I wasn't talking about the Miners strike.

I'm talking about the general state of the inner cities at the time.

Brighton played Barnsley during the time of the minors strike, and we talked to a few miners who were very anti the way in which Scargill was behaving at the time. We heard a few stories about him and his cronies moving out to a hotel during the strike whilst the families were suffering - as much due to his actions as the governments.

But, whoevers fault the minors strike was - I don't think that referring to them as "the enemy within" was particularly helpful at the time was it ?

My point is - whatever the rights or wrongs or her actions - I don't feel that she was particularly caring about the lives of those effected.

Individuals within the government such as Hesletine wanted to help these people and build bridges but his advice was ignored.

Which inner citiies? They were in more of a mess during the Winter of discontent when funerals couldn't take place because the council workers hadn't dug the graves, dustbins weren't emptied for weeks and there weren't any clean sheets in the hospitals.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Re: clapham_gull

My point is - whatever the rights or wrongs or her actions - I don't feel that she was particularly caring about the lives of those effected.

Blimey - that's the understatement of the milleniium INNIT?

Margaret Thatcher = heartless bitch

Thatcher presided over the disgusting Greed Is Good decade that was the eighties where whole communities were left to be ravaged by market forces. 'There Is No Such Thing As Society' according to the evil cow. The only tear Thatcher ever shed was when her party of eunuchs kicked her out of No.10 to save their worthless skins.

 

[clapham_gull]

Liverpool for example had many, many problems - as did London.

I'm not blaming her government, they were already in a state
before before the conservatives came to power - in fact it was probably one of the major reasons why the electorate chose her.

You can even argue that that they were in a much better state when she left.

However, I honestly don't believe she gave a jot about those people.

She was more interested in protecting a rock in the South Atlantic. It is generally agreed that she wouldn't have won the second election if not for the Falklands factor. Maybe then the Falklands saved the country ?

In order for the country to be put back on the right track, I believe the poor of this country suffered a whole lot more than they needed to.

I don't think we're disagreeing here, but people forget how much she was hated (by a significant amount of people) at the time.

Great Leader of course, but not a particularly humane one.

 

[London Irish]

Scargill just called all the miners out and it didn't save the pits but caused untold misery for the families.

You've talked a lot of bollocks on this thread Yorkie, but this is the worst piece. At the time, Scargill was accused of scaremongering because of the figures of job losses he said Thatcher wanted to impose on the industry. History has shown that the job losses have been many times the number Scargill forecast back then, including those of the Notts miners who gutlessly chose to break the strike rather than support their colleagues in Yorkshire, Scotland, South Wales and Kent.

Are you going to rewrite history and blame Scargill for those job losses too?

The fact is, the British coal industry was destroyed by the Tories not for ecomomic reasons but out of political spite. The attack on the NUM was planned years in advance by ministers like Nicholas Ridley.

It was simple revenge for what the miners did to Heath's government in 1974. You should remember, Yorkie, that Heath went to the country in the general election that year and asked the British people the simple question, "who rules the country?"

The British people told Heath it wasn't him, and the Tories never forgave the miners for that.

The Tories went after the miners and the miners had two choices, surrender and allow their industry to be destroyed, or fight. Scargill gave them the option to fight, unlike many other union leaders of the time who would have simply done a deal to protect themselves and sold their members down the river.

The miners strike was one of the most heroic acts ever by a group of British workers, they were on a hiding to nothing, the odds totally stacked against them, yet they chose to stand up to the devastating effects of market forces on their community and the actions of a spiteful and vicious government.

The miners inspired a whole generation. It certainly was the thing that motivated me to learn about politics and it was also the thing that told me that I should never accept second best in anything despite my working class background. f*** the forelock-tugging. One day we will avenge what those bastards did to the miners.

 

[alan partridge]

Nothing to do with his age or Maggie for that matter.

He was pointing out that Terrace Dandy had said something positive instead of being negative about other people's views.

i wasn't really talking about his comment just wondered how old strike was when thatch was in power. quoting him was just a way of linking my question to him.

and anyway, what's positive about terrace dandy and strikes views on asylum?

btw, thatcher would have LOVED the tabloid hysteria about immigration. she would have come out with some classic lines and brought in some draconian measures to the applause of sun reading morons all over the land.

anyone see that clip of her on 'have i got news for you?' when she was doing some publicity stunt, shopping in sainsbury's or somewhere. the poor girl at the cash till asked to see some i.d for the old witch's credit card, you know, JUST DOING HER JOB, and she immediatley bit her head off in a FRIGHTENING way whilst some supermarket executive laughed nervously and said 'oh we won't worry about that...hahahaha'. I get the impression she despises normal people. can't stand her.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Phew, a bit of sanity creeping in at the end of this thread. Couldn't believe all this pro-Maggie crap.

She's scum and I would like her to know THAT while she's alive.

 

[dougdeep]

I've no doubt she did what she thought was right,but we all make mistakes.
[The miners were shafted!]
sorry!

 

[Yorkie]

London Irish. It is just my opinion. I make no apologies for it.

The steelworkers were in a similar position where cheaper steel was being obtained throughout the world. They took their redundancy and moved on.
The miners chose to strike led by Arthur Scargills leadership and lost out.

My father in law was a steel worker and did very nicely out of his redundancy.
When the miners finally took theirs, they also got good payouts. Quite a lot of them set up as self employed with that money and are doing ok.

I don't hold with all this bitterness and the workers will get their revenge stuff.

 

[Yorkie]

duplicated

 

[Beach Hut]

It wasn't just revenge but coal was basically yesterday's industry.

Things move sadly Scargill decided to make a point which was hopelessly wrong.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

The fact is, the British coal industry was destroyed by the Tories not for ecomomic reasons but out of political spite. The attack on the NUM was planned years in advance by ministers like Nicholas Ridley.

It was simple revenge for what the miners did to Heath's government in 1974. You should remember, Yorkie, that Heath went to the country in the general election that year and asked the British people the simple question, "who rules the country?"

The British people told Heath it wasn't him, and the Tories never forgave the miners for that.

Spot on.

 

[Beach Hut]

Disagree entirely, an industry that was passed it's sell by date due to expensive manufacturing techniqes.

 

[Yorkie]

LI & Tom

May I respectfully ask where you were living during the miner's strike?

Did you actually talk to any miners? Or did you get all your information from the press and tv?

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

LI & Tom

May I respectfully ask where you were living during the miner's strike?

Did you actually talk to any miners? Or did you get all your information from the press and tv?

Well, Yorkie, like most people I get 90-something percent of my information from the press and TV and then applying my finely-honed tree-hugging pinko intellect to it. I don't believe that you had to be living in Yorkshire at the time to be disgusted by, say, The Battle of Orgreave. I was living in BN1 at the time and all the police and specials around here had shiny new VCRs (expensive luxury items at the time) that they christened 'Arthur' due to the unlimited overtime they had thrust upon them by being bussed to Yorkshire to form part of Maggie's Army to give the miners a bloody good hiding. I don't think that is any reason for anybody in the North of England or the South of England or anywhere else where democracy is respected to Rejoice.

 

[Yorkie]

Orgreave is exactly a mile away from where my mother in law lives.

Ask Ned about Orgreave.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Orgreave is exactly a mile away from where my mother in law lives.

Ask Ned about Orgreave.

I shall do so this very afternoon

 

[NMH]

Worthless bitch, good riddance to bad rubbish, may she rot in hell.

Thanks for the opportunity to give my eulegy.
NMH