Seaford school sold in secret deal

[Brovion]

If the parents wish to be "Educational Snobs" and pay for their little brats to be educated in the Private Sector, then so be it .
But as this case shows there are inherent selfish risks involved, and no sympathy should be wasted on these snobs.

Just let them pay up and enrol in another elitist institution, if this turns them on.

Ulimately you cannot buy BRAINS.

Like Gwylan I totally agree. I haven't bothered to find out the facts but if a private school has closed down that's good enough reason for me to crack open the champagne. I've got no sympathy for the teachers or the parents and the children will be ok, their parents will see to that. Not an option for most kids.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

I read in the Times yesterday that a deal was done with a Development/Building company about three years ago. They bought a stake in the school.

Some of the pupils interviewed are absoultely gutted. They have been there for over 10 years and now have to move on.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Like Gwylan I totally agree. I haven't bothered to find out the facts but if a private school has closed down that's good enough reason for me to crack open the champagne. I've got no sympathy for the teachers or the parents and the children will be ok, their parents will see to that. Not an option for most kids.

Why are you so anti Private schools? I can't gauge why someone dislikes them so much....

Newlands, the one in question had over 150 pupils with learning difficulties or dyslexia. They were providing a valuable service.

I have great sympathy for all those involved. Teachers, pupils and parents alike. It can't be easy losing your job and losing your school, respectively.

 

[clarkey]

Why are you so anti Private schools? I can't gauge why someone dislikes them so much....

Newlands, the one in question had over 150 pupils with learning difficulties or dyslexia. They were providing a valuable service.

I have great sympathy for all those involved. Teachers, pupils and parents alike. It can't be easy losing your job and losing your school, respectively.

Totally agree, I know children and staff who were there and they had no idea it was going to happen and there was nothing the school could have done. The landowners charged the school 400% more for the land over the last year, the school were ultimately 'asked to leave' the area, the site became untenable and they had to shut down. I feel sorry for everyone that worked, or was educated there, who are now out of work. Just because it is a private school does not mean they deserve it or make the situation acceptable.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Schools in the area wont like the idea of absorbing 150 + pupils with learning difficulties or dyslexia as it will affect their positions in academic league tables.

 

[34064 Fighter Command]

If the parents wish to be "Educational Snobs" and pay for their little brats to be educated in the Private Sector, then so be it .
But as this case shows there are inherent selfish risks involved, and no sympathy should be wasted on these snobs.

Just let them pay up and enrol in another elitist institution, if this turns them on.

Ulimately you cannot buy BRAINS.

But these parents, on top of paying fees, are still paying income tax to subsidize the state sector schools, through whatever mechanism the government of the day has devised.

The argument is the same regarding healthcare, just because people choose private treatment doesn't mean their not entitled to NHS services.

If anything they are freeing up spaces in other schools for child 'B' who might not have the choice of that school had that place been allocated to this parent's child.

Children deserve an education, end of story.

It is a leagal responsibility of the LEA to ensure these kids are found places to continue their studies with minimal disruption ASAP.

 

[Brovion]

Totally agree, I know children and staff who were there and they had no idea it was going to happen and there was nothing the school could have done. The landowners charged the school 400% more for the land over the last year, the school were ultimately 'asked to leave' the area, the site became untenable and they had to shut down. I feel sorry for everyone that worked, or was educated there, who are now out of work. Just because it is a private school does not mean they deserve it or make the situation acceptable.

Don't you see? That is what's wrong with the whole system. Something as important as education cannot be left to the whim of businesses who suddenly decide they can use the land more profitably.

As an extension of that I hope none of you bewailing the closure of this school are Conservatives. You've banged on for years about 'market forces', 'free enterprise' and 'choice' and at least two of those factors are directly connected with the closure. You've got the country and system you wanted so don't complain. In other words, it's all your fault, I hope you've learnt your lesson.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Don't you see? That is what's wrong with the whole system. Something as important as education cannot be left to the whim of businesses who suddenly decide they can use the land more profitably.

As an extension of that I hope none of you bewailing the closure of this school are Conservatives. You've banged on for years about 'market forces', 'free enterprise' and 'choice' and at least two of those factors are directly connected with the closure. You've got the country and system you wanted so don't complain. In other words, it's all your fault, I hope you've learnt your lesson.

What about private schools who are protected. The Woodard corporation, for example.

Lancing, Hurst, Ardingly and 46 other members. This is one example of a school, which was unprotected. Should all private schools be abolished because of this risk?

State schools are over crowded as it is. Where are we going to find the money for more schools, and more teachers

 

[bigc]

Totally agree. As Lord B pointed out, an LEA would not close at such short notice; the parents of these kids knew there was a risk of the school closing but didn't think that was important.

I feel really sorry for those kids, it must be terrible to have such disruption just before their GCSEs but their parents really should have thought that stability in education is important.

thats the scary thing.

When LEA's have their roles removed, who says disruption to education will rank higher in the mind than profit?

 

[Brovion]

What about private schools who are protected. The Woodard corporation, for example.

Lancing, Hurst, Ardingly and 46 other members. This is one example of a school, which was unprotected. Should all private schools be abolished because of this risk?

No of course not. The others should be abolished because they're elitist.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

No of course not. The others should be abolished because they're elitist.

Aren't all universities elitist with their entry grades?

Or did you mean the financial aspect?

 

[Lord Bracknell]

But these parents, on top of paying fees, are still paying income tax to subsidize the state sector schools, through whatever mechanism the government of the day has devised.

The argument is the same regarding healthcare, just because people choose private treatment doesn't mean their not entitled to NHS services.

Taxpayers aren't "subsidising" state sector schools or NHS hospitals.

They are paying their share of a service that EVERYONE benefits from - a better educated and healthy population.

The notion that this is a "subsidy" would only be true if state schools and NHS hospitals were set up primarily to be profit-making businesses. They aren't.

 

[34064 Fighter Command]

But it IS true, that if every Private School closed, the burden of taxation would increase because State schools would have to be funded to provide these extra places.

I wasn't saying ' taxpayers ', in general, are subsidizing, I was saying that parents who send their children to Private Schools, and who are also taxpayers, are subsidizing.

I.e. That subset of taxpayers who also pay fees.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Totally agree 34064 FC.

Parents spending money on private education are paying towards state schools as well. Whether you want to call that subsidising or dress it up however you wish, is upto you.

I know if I have the money and if I have children, I would rather send them to a private school as there tend to be so many more opportunities available to the pupil. ie in most cases - better educational standards, extracurricular etc. etc.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

But it IS true, that if every Private School closed, the burden of taxation would increase because State schools would have to be funded to provide these extra places.

It's arguable - taking the longer term view - that the overall quality of education would improve if EVERYONE participated fully in the state system. And that the extra costs would be worth it.

At the moment, parents who opt for private schooling are opting out of their responsibility to demand higher standards in schools.

When only a small proportion of families opted out of the state education system, this wasn't a big problem. But it's become a MAJOR one over the past twenty five years.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

At the moment, parents who opt for private schooling are opting out of their responsibility to demand higher standards in schools.

Surely there are enough parents who use state schooling, to wield some form of power to improve the standards.

Afterall the money from taxation, from the private schooling parents is not being used for their children.

There is the same income with less demand on the state schools.

Opting out of their responsibility is harsh! Does the same go for private healthcare and dentistry?

 

[Gwylan]

How did this get on to private education per se?

The point I was making was that the parents of kids at this school clearly didn't think the fact that the disruption of their children's education was an important issue to them ..until the school closed and then started whingeing about it. It's just totally hypocritical.

Personally, even if I were a multi-millionaire, I wouldn't send my kids anywhere near a private school. I'd consider stability of education important. BoF and others don't think that's an issue and think that smaller classes would outweigh the risks of closure. That's fair enough, but it's not fair enough to take those risks and then starting crying about it.

It reminds me of all those people who raked in money from Lloyd's until they suddenly found themselves exposed with crippling losses and then called for the government to step in and help them.

Private enterprise is private enterprise: you accept the rewards and take the risks, that's what it means. I just can't abide these people who want to accept the rewards but don't want to take any of the risks.

 

[Lady Bracknell]

Speaking as someone who went to the Seaford branch of St. Trinians - we used to use the swimming pool at Newlands, as it happens - I'd caution anyone about assuming that a private education brings greater benefits.

I'm fearfully good with complicated knife and fork arrangements and know that a napkin is never a serviette (perish the thought!!!) but it took a deal of further state education after the 6th form in order to achieve what I'd easily have managed at the grammar school I should have attended!

So yes, there are smaller class numbers in private schools and for sure, there's a better class of hooligans to rub shoulders with and of course there's the over-complicated school uniform that's necessary to prove your child attends a private school rather than a bog-standard comprehensive. Whether the education is automatically "better" is questionable though and impressive exam results can be as much to do with not putting certain pupils in for them as it is down to those who pass them!

And when the chips are down, as at Newlands and indeed my old school which "merged" with another in order for the site to be developed - or, as the management claimed at the time, provide more "choice" - there are no safety nets and often little warning because profit is the prime motivation.

 

[Icy Gull]

QUOTE]Originally posted by Lord Bracknell
.

At the moment, parents who opt for private schooling are opting out of their responsibility to demand higher standards in schools.

. [/QUOTE]

How quickly could that happen if the local school was not of a reasonable standard? I suggest your child would probably have finished school by then, the parents strangled by red tape and denied the opportunity to get the best education if they can afford it.

It is by no means ideal to have to pay a large chunk of your salary for your child's education, but many do and whilst the disparity is there and it may be considered elitist, it's about doing the best you can for your children. Your choice if you are lucky enough to be able to finance it. There are also plenty of parents who consider it is worth getting into debt send their children to a private school, again their choice if they have the collateral

 

[Brovion]

Aren't all universities elitist with their entry grades?

Or did you mean the financial aspect?

Anybody with brains (or the relevant talent) can go to university, not anyone can afford private education. My daughter is doing a music degree (and getting into debt in the process). I doubt whether she could have gone if us, her parents, had to pay the fees.