Safe Standing Bill launched in Parliament

[drew]

Two other points:

1"London Assembly

Friday 10 December 2010

Dear Murad Qureshi, Nicky Gavron, Darren Johnson, Richard Barnbrook, Jenny Jones, Andrew Boff, Dee Doocey, Gareth Bacon, Victoria Borwick, Mike Tuffrey and Caroline Pidgeon,

I understand that Don Foster MP, former Liberal Democrats sports spokesman (and current Bath MP), has launched a bid to allow safe standing to be introduced into football grounds in England and Wales etc etc

"....

You make some good arguments but then spoil it by suggesting there is an overwhelming majority in support of standing. Where is your evidence of that? And what on earth is a birth right to stand!!!!

 

[Lord Bracknell]

Ironically a certain David Bellotti (C@NT) is very friendly is Don Foster (DF gave him a job when he moved west)

Absolutely NOT TRUE.

Foster was scathing about Bellotti when he (and other senior LibDems) privately met the Falmer For All Team at the LibDem conference, after the march and rally.

I guess he realised what a liability Bellotti was, precisely because he'd had experience of working with the ****.

 

[Brighton till i die]

I think if the FA actually bothered to ask league clubs and league fans and MASSIVE majority would vote in favour of an area of safe terraces in every ground. I'd guess over 85%.

 

[Guy Fawkes]

Whats the FIFA rule regarding this? Was safe standing used in Germany in 2006? I only ask because at Lansdowne Rd and Croke Park, Ireland were never allowed to use terracing for qualifiers. Not that I spose it matters after last week, but wouldn't want to convert the top stadiums here and then not be allowed to host a major tournament as a result...

I think safe standing is used only for domestic games as current rules by FIFA etc mean that international games have to be all seater.

There are various systems of safe standing including a couple that mean that the seats are folded away during domestic games and when required the seats are unfolded and used for other matches requiring them

See here for how it works http://www.fsf.org.uk/media/uploaded/File/Safe%20Standing%20Areas%20in%20European%20Stadia.pdf

 

[Guy Fawkes]

He states that standing wasn't the cause of the disaster and he is right but had the leppings lane end been all seater, would the disaster have been as devastating? It's like saying that speeding doesn't cause accidents, just bad driving or that it's not guns that kill, it's the people that use them.

Seeing that Lord Taylor's Hillsborough report states the fact the crowd was standing was not one of the reasons for the disaster and also stated that standing is NOT inherently unsafe, However when it comes to speeding, only 5% crashes are directly as a result of speeding, so are you suggesting that the Government should have treated speeding in a similar way to their reaction to standing at football and by going over the top in their legislation and introducing say a blanket 10 MPH speed limit across the land to prevent speeding from killing anyone?

If we want to look at the effect of seating on safety, how many extra fans died as a result of the seats hindering their exit during Bradford's fire, admittedly the stands today are vastly superior in design and safety and standards - a key fact is that seating slowed the speed of exit from the stands and out onto the pitch as fans had to physically climb over seats to get out

5% speeding figure comes from this 3 year study NHTSA report reveals excessive speed responsible for only 5% of crashes - MotorAuthority

 

[Guy Fawkes]

You make some good arguments but then spoil it by suggesting there is an overwhelming majority in support of standing. Where is your evidence of that? And what on earth is a birth right to stand!!!!

A survey of 140,000 fans was carried out and 82% were in favour of safe standing to be introduced in this country

According to our survey - carried out online and e-mailed to 140,000 members of the Football Supporters' Federation - 82% Are in favour of safe standing at matches

PEOPLE SURVEY: YOU CAN STICK YER ENGLAND! - Football News - Football - Sport - People.co.uk

You may also be interested in reading these
The Football Supporters' Federation - Safe Standing campaign

•Read the aims and objectives of the FSF's Safe Standing campaign here.
http://www.fsf.org.uk/media/uploaded/FSF-Safe-Standing-campaign-aims.pdf

•Click here to read the FSF's Legalities of Standing.
http://www.fsf.org.uk/media/uploaded/Legalities-of-standing.pdf

•See some of the Key Designs used in European Safe Standing areas here.
http://www.fsf.org.uk/media/uploaded/File/Safe%20Standing%20Areas%20in%20European%20Stadia.pdf

 

[Guy Fawkes]

No chance.

Government ALWAYS OPPOSES ten minute rule bills in debate unless its a manifesto issue (never is) and without Government support doen't stand a snowball's chance in hell of gettig firther.

Ironically a certain David Bellotti (C@NT) is very friendly is Don Foster (DF gave him a job when he moved west)

I really hope this has a chance
From the football supporters Federation

We also work on the campaign for Safe Standing. Historically, the campaign has had a number of successes, including encouraging 145 MP’s to back an Early Day Motion on Safe Standing and gaining the backing of the Liberal Democrats, following a debate and vote at their party conference

This was before the General election, so i don't know if many of the MP's who backed this are still there,

Surely fans should being writing to their MP's again to show there is widespread support of safe standing and put pressure on their MP's to back the proposal

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Whats the FIFA rule regarding this? Was safe standing used in Germany in 2006? I only ask because at Lansdowne Rd and Croke Park, Ireland were never allowed to use terracing for qualifiers. Not that I spose it matters after last week, but wouldn't want to convert the top stadiums here and then not be allowed to host a major tournament as a result...

I think I'm correct in saying that you can do what you want in your own league but UEFA and FIFA sanctioned games (e.g. Champions League and the World Cup) stipulate all seating. Numerous Bundesliga clubs have convertible terrace/seating, some have plain old terracing. I stood at Bayer with the 'Hauptstadt Mafia' last season. I know you can stand at Dortmand, Hamburg and St Pauli.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I dont think this will happen though. You just know a load of tearful scousers will turn up and start using emotions to put a stop to it.

 

[Fef]

I think if the FA actually bothered to ask league clubs and league fans and MASSIVE majority would vote in favour of an area of safe terraces in every ground. I'd guess over 85%.

But that would require the FA to get off their lazy arses and do something. A good idea, but clearly doomed!

 

[Gary Leeds]

I was at Wakefield Wildcats rugby ground today and I would say 80% of their capacity is terraces with no barriers between sections. Why wasnt it a blanket ruling across ALL sports stadia if it is so dangerous to stand? why were lower league clubs allowed to keep their terraces?? A small terrace with 1000 people is no more dangerous than a large terrace holding 10000 split into 10 sections

 

[murphy's law]

It's not gonna happen as the clubs don't want the 'hooligan' culture, they want well behaved families and more corporate deals, it's all about money. I've no doubt if you introduced safe standing then idiots would encourage violence. We don't have the same fan culture as Germany, where clubs actively keep prices low. The prem is all about making money from the fan.

 

[murphy's law]

Everyone knows it wouldn't be dangerous, that's not the reason it won't be introduced.

 

[Billy the Fish]

I dont think this will happen though. You just know a load of tearful scousers will turn up and start using emotions to put a stop to it.

It's started already. I just saw Kenny Dalgleish on SSN saying that it's insensitive to the families of the 96 at Hillborough, it's not possible for people to stand at football and be safe..etc. etc.

 

[steward 433]

It's started already. I just saw Kenny Dalgleish on SSN saying that it's insensitive to the families of the 96 at Hillborough, it's not possible for people to stand at football and be safe..etc. etc.

Didn't realise he was an IOSH qualified risk assessor

 

[Marc]

It's started already. I just saw Kenny Dalgleish on SSN saying that it's insensitive to the families of the 96 at Hillborough, it's not possible for people to stand at football and be safe..etc. etc.

as much of a pianful thing it was, people need to get over it. OK direct relations to those that died dont but in general disasters happen and generally people move on. What they gonna do next, not build another Tower Block in New York incase it gets hit by a plane?! course not. The main thing for me is whether Safe Standing Areas mean a reduced capacity, I'm pretty sure clubs will want as many bums on seats and therefore more money. Either that or they charge extra for standing to compensate...which wont happen!