[Film] More of the Rings

[Kosh]

I find it odd and disappointing that in 2022, casting people of colour is even remarked upon, let alone considered a distraction. There's Orks, Elves who live for centuries, Dwarves, Dragons and magic rings. Yet a black man stands out as odd to some people?

Exactly, just enjoy the show ... the story ... it really doesn’t matter.

I also get sick of the legion of armchair critics the internet age has given a voice to... regrettably, this was bound to happen with this show. I’ll watch it and make my own mind up... good, bad, awful ?!? Either way I won’t be writing a sodding review about it, adding my voice to the chorus of no nothing ‘experts’ telling me what to think.

 

[Papa Lazarou]

Having seen both episodes and being someone who's read much of the published work and the movies, I thought it's looking pretty good.

 

[Mellotron]

havent seen this yet, but will watch once a few more episodes are available

There seem to be a few purists who will hate it just because, and that is a shame because if they were to just watch, rather than try and find fault in every single perceived or real discrepancy they may well like it. Similar to Game Of Thrones where the books and tv are very very far apart(dead characters, living characters, amalgamated characters, new characters, different story lines etc)

Its an adaptation of Tolkiens work, not a literal recreation. The fact is that Tolkien wrote on the whole very bad female characters, there are very few in the LOTR books, and the films altered them quite a lot, Arwen for example in the films was a much expanded role, taking the whole role of Glorfindle rescuing Frodo in Fellowship-0 there was much angst from the purists about that

The fact that this adaptation sees different ethnicity playing different races is simply a reflection of the times we live in, as is really nothing to get all worked up about.

No film adaptation of any book is complety faithful, and it doesnt really matter. Just watch it, enjoy it, and if you dont like it, dont watch anymore, but its certainly nothing to get all worked up about

I completely agree with you bar the latter seasons of Game of Thrones where it really did feel like the songwriting took a huge nosedive, irregardless of what was “book canon” and what wasn’t, given I’ve never read the books.

 

[jcdenton08]

I find it odd and disappointing that in 2022, casting people of colour is even remarked upon, let alone considered a distraction. There's Orks, Elves who live for centuries, Dwarves, Dragons and magic rings. Yet a black man stands out as odd to some people?

Where Tolkien’s writing is not specific, by all means take liberties and cast however you like.

When Tolkien has written specific descriptions, also do what you like. But expect Tolkien fans to treat it as “non-canon”.

It’s this middle ground (not Middle-Earth, that’s a different thing) that annoys people. If you want to make an “official” product, adhere to canon. If you don’t, don’t market it as such.

FWIW I’m not precious about Tolkien, but I can totally understand and respect people who are passionate about whatever their chosen hobby is. I’m not going to dismiss everyone as racist out of hand just because they don’t like decisions taken which undermine their chosen “thing”.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Because you need ‘strong independent’ women leads in everything these days! Anyway, temptation got the better of me and I watched last night. I thought the stand out performance was Clark. She was terrific. The cinematography was also astonishingly beautiful for television. The criticism is a bit unfair really, 2 episodes in.

I thought she was terrible as Galadriel, very wooden and nothing like the ethereal and regal nature of the real Galadriel.

I thought the lass playing Nori and the fella playing the Durin gave the best acting performances out of a fair bit of tv soap type acting.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

I find it odd and disappointing that in 2022, casting people of colour is even remarked upon, let alone considered a distraction. There's Orks, Elves who live for centuries, Dwarves, Dragons and magic rings. Yet a black man stands out as odd to some people?

It looks odd in Middle Earth.

The people of colour in Middle Earth were the people of the Haradrim and the Easterlings.

So when all of a sudden you just throw random actors that match those peoples in among the other groups where they did not exist it does indeed look way out of place and poor casting.

If you had a black King leading a black army of the Haradrim it would look far more authentic than a Haradrim Army of blonde haired pale people.

Tar-Miriel a Numenorean was literally described by Tolkien as being a very pale white woman yet this show cast someone who looks nothing like her because of her brown skin so the actor looks way out of place in that role.

That is why it looks odd.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Really enjoyed episode 1, haven't seen 2 yet.


Luckily, my favorite Tolkien is 1st Age - Fall of Gondolin, Turin Turambar, Beren and Luthien, the Silmarils etc. etc.

I don't remember much about the 2nd Age so I don't particularly mind if they "fill in too many details".

Anyway, it's great. But who is the man in the meteor ? Gandalf, Sauron, another wizard ?

Episode 2 tonight or on Monday for me.

The meteor man I think could be Alatar one of the blue wizards if it is one of them.

The blue wizards were mentioned to have arrived in the 2nd age. Would be terrible writing to have one of the main 3 wizards be playing meteor man as they didn't arrive until well into the 3rd age.

 

[The Clamp]

It looks odd in Middle Earth.

The people of colour in Middle Earth were the people of the Haradrim and the Easterlings.

So when all of a sudden you just throw random actors that match those peoples in among the other groups where they did not exist it does indeed look way out of place and poor casting.

If you had a black King leading a black army of the Haradrim it would look far more authentic than a Haradrim Army of blonde haired pale people.

Tar-Miriel a Numenorean was literally described by Tolkien as being a very pale white woman yet this show cast someone who looks nothing like her because of her brown skin so the actor looks way out of place in that role.

That is why it looks odd.

I think you’d have to be a bit of a wally to worry about such things.

 

[The Clamp]

There are many things about all the Tolkien adaptations that are different from the books / source material. It tells me a fair a bit about someone when the difference they pick up on in the colour of an actor’s skin.

I thought we’d be past that in 2022.

 

[BadFish]

Still not seen it but it sounds like it is not for those deep lovers of Tolkien's work and wish for faithful reproduction of his (and Christopher's) works.

Nor is it for those who don't like this new idea of having women and black people in prominent non supportin roles.

I think I was give it a whirl but probably after House of the dragon.

Sent from my M2010J19CG using Tapatalk

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

havent seen this yet, but will watch once a few more episodes are available

There seem to be a few purists who will hate it just because, and that is a shame because if they were to just watch, rather than try and find fault in every single perceived or real discrepancy they may well like it. Similar to Game Of Thrones where the books and tv are very very far apart(dead characters, living characters, amalgamated characters, new characters, different story lines etc)

Its an adaptation of Tolkiens work, not a literal recreation. The fact is that Tolkien wrote on the whole very bad female characters, there are very few in the LOTR books, and the films altered them quite a lot, Arwen for example in the films was a much expanded role, taking the whole role of Glorfindle rescuing Frodo in Fellowship-0 there was much angst from the purists about that

The fact that this adaptation sees different ethnicity playing different races is simply a reflection of the times we live in, as is really nothing to get all worked up about.

No film adaptation of any book is complety faithful, and it doesnt really matter. Just watch it, enjoy it, and if you dont like it, dont watch anymore, but its certainly nothing to get all worked up about

The early Game of Thrones had a lot of fine acting performances. In comparison the acting in this show feels very average soapies tv level type acting.

The Harfoots for example...

The Rings of Power, Prime Video’s much-anticipated Lord of the Rings spin-off, works hard at recapturing the magic of the Peter Jackson movies. But for Irish viewers the $1 billion series evokes less welcome memories. It features a race of simpleton proto-hobbits, rosy of cheek, slathered in muck, wearing twigs in their hair and speaking in stage-Irish accents that make the cast of Wild Mountain Thyme sound like Daniel Day-Lewis. Twenty minutes in, I’m having flashbacks to that 1997 EastEnders episode with the fightin’ villagers and donkeys walking the streets.

https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/...ith-stage-irish-accents-thats-1bn-well-spent/

 

[The Clamp]

Any major series that cost as much as this one has is going to have people of colour in it in major roles. They are going to want as broad an audience to identify with the characters as

---

possible. Fair enough.

They shot themselves in the foot though by portraying the simpletons as Irish.

 

[jcdenton08]

Any major series that cost as much as this one has is going to have people of colour in it in major roles. They are going to want as broad an audience to identify with the characters as

---

possible. Fair enough.

They shot themselves in the foot though by portraying the simpletons as Irish.

Would you describe the creators as racist?

 

[The Clamp]

Would you describe the creators as racist?

No. A bit thoughtless maybe.

 

[The Clamp]

Surely if one can imagine that a human can play an Ork or an Elf, or a Harfoot or a Dwarve then one can imagine a black human can play such a creature? I mean, the leap of imagination has already been made, surely?

 

[The Clamp]

The early Game of Thrones had a lot of fine acting performances. In comparison the acting in this show feels very average soapies tv level type acting.

The Harfoots for example...



https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/...ith-stage-irish-accents-thats-1bn-well-spent/

I agree, I have seen better acting at The Barn, Southwick.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Surely if one can imagine that a human can play an Ork or an Elf, or a Harfoot or a Dwarve then one can imagine a black human can play such a creature? I mean, the leap of imagination has already been made, surely?

There are coloured people in that world. Nobody is denying there isn't.

They just aren't the Numenoreans, Elves or Dwarves of Middle Earth

They are found to the south and the east of Middle Earth. Their own separate peoples.

Khamul the second in rank of the Nazgul was an Easterling.

 

[The Clamp]

There are coloured people in that world. Nobody is denying there isn't.

They just aren't the Numenoreans, Elves or Dwarves of Middle Earth

They are found to the south and the east of Middle Earth. Their own separate peoples.

Khamul the second in rank of the Nazgul was an Easterling.

Yes. I get that. What I’m saying is these are actors playing fantasy creatures, it can’t be that much of a show ruiner if a fantasy creature is played by someone of colour.

Your last sentence for example;

“Khamul the second in rank of the Nazgul was an Easterling”.

Honest to goodness, if you can accept that load of old bollocks surely a black man playing an elf isn’t too much of a leap?

Very few characters’ skin colour is described by Tolkien. Seems an odd thing to fixate on. Especially in a world of made up fantasy creatures.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Yes. I get that. What I’m saying is these are actors playing fantasy creatures, it can’t be that much of a show ruiner if a fantasy creature is played by someone of colour.

Your last sentence for example;

“Khamul the second in rank of the Nazgul was an Easterling”.

Honest to goodness, if you can accept that load of old bollocks surely a black man playing an elf isn’t too much of a leap?

Very few characters’ skin colour is described by Tolkien. Seems an odd thing to fixate on. Especially in a world of made up fantasy creatures.

Yes we accept it because the author wrote it. It's his works, it's his world, that's what he was thinking.

Seems there's this kind of entitled arrogance that pays zero respect to the creators of works and seems to think they can make it better than the creator did.

If people don't like Tolkien's world they could go write their own world where they can put whoever they like in it.


Skin colour is quite clearly written about Tar-Miriel as an example, instead they cast an actress that is nothing like that description. Why?

 

[The Clamp]

Yes we accept it because the author wrote it. It's his works, it's his world, that's what he was thinking.

Seems there's this kind of entitled arrogance that pays zero respect to the creators of works and seems to think they can make it better than the creator did.

If people don't like Tolkien's world they could go write their own world where they can put whoever they like in it.


Skin colour is quite clearly written about Tar-Miriel as an example, instead they cast an actress that is nothing like that description. Why?

Don’t watch it if people of colour bother you so much.