Main Coronavirus / Covid-19 Discussion Thread

[WilburySeagull]

"Return to 2m distancing?" As far as I know wenever left it. If you have left it please get bak to it now.

 

[dsr-burnley]

Other than that, I can only see shutting down non-essential businesses as an option left on the table. And by non-essential, I mean it. Amazon, other than its grocery arm, isn’t essential. Nor are takeaways, or many trades etc.

Basically, you stay at home unless your job involves food / sanitary products, medicine, essential infrastructure or fixing an essential item in an emergency. That’s going to be economically painful and a pretty grim way to live our lives for a period, however we would at least go into it would some idea as to what the exit plan is and when it is coming.

I presume you would allow 1 TV news channel to stay open?

Unless you're talking very short term, the number of non-essential workers is longer than you think. Packaging manufacturers, for example. No point producing the food if you can't pack it up for sale. Ball bearing and other machinery manufacturers. Can parts manufacturers. All manufacturers, basically, because their products service the food etc industry.

 

[crodonilson]

I presume you would allow 1 TV news channel to stay open?

Unless you're talking very short term, the number of non-essential workers is longer than you think. Packaging manufacturers, for example. No point producing the food if you can't pack it up for sale. Ball bearing and other machinery manufacturers. Can parts manufacturers. All manufacturers, basically, because their products service the food etc industry.

These if they need to stay open should run at an abdulte skeleton staff. Personally I think other than the emergency services everyone else should be allowed outside of their home only with a permit and we need to start getting serious with offenders.

 

[atomised]

"Return to 2m distancing?" As far as I know wenever left it. If you have left it please get bak to it now.

That puzzled me too. I was convinced the rule was still in place

 

[worthingseagull123]

We probably need to return to 2m distancing, with the subsequent effect that has on capacity in supermarkets etc. It was a huge inconvenience having to queue for 20 minutes just to get into Sainsbury’s earlier in the year, but it’s noticeable what a free for all they’ve become. We already know they are the most common public setting for transmission, so given the new variant’s propensity to spread the current environment could be disastrous.

Other than that, I can only see shutting down non-essential businesses as an option left on the table. And by non-essential, I mean it. Amazon, other than its grocery arm, isn’t essential. Nor are takeaways, or many trades etc.

Basically, you stay at home unless your job involves food / sanitary products, medicine, essential infrastructure or fixing an essential item in an emergency. That’s going to be economically painful and a pretty grim way to live our lives for a period, however we would at least go into it would some idea as to what the exit plan is and when it is coming.

I don’t even know what incremental benefit those measures would deliver versus March, but given what we now know about the new variant, the fact the NHS is seemingly close to breaking point and that we probably still haven’t seen the fallout and residual impact from Christmas it seems we’re going to end up with something resembling this model in relatively short order.

Shit times, but there is light at the end of the tunnel.

So shut down the civil service?

No immigration or customs officers, no DWP staff to process benefit claims etc?

 

[Nobby]

https://twitter.com/mbklee_/status/1344795588039208961?s=21

FFS

Anybody have a Gatling Gun?

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Disagree. Once the elderly, vulnerable and key workers have been vaccinated and it’s had time to take effect, the number of people getting seriously ill, numbers going in to hospitals and ICU and dying will plummet, so restrictions will be able to be gradually relaxed as the NHS will be able to cope. End Feb seems realistic if the logistics are being put in place.

Biggest concern for me now is the fvckwits who can’t wait.

The vaccination programme is being messed up by lengthening the gap between the two jabs, and even mixing and matching the differed vaccines!

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/01/...es-britain.html#click=https://t.co/bQv9rC3eTO

 

[beorhthelm]

The vaccination programme is being messed up by lengthening the gap between the two jabs, and even mixing and matching the differed vaccines!

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/01/...es-britain.html#click=https://t.co/bQv9rC3eTO

covered this in another thread - its not policy to mix, its a contingency. our health service doesnt have such ad hoc approach to rolling out vaccinations.

 

[Poojah]

"Return to 2m distancing?" As far as I know wenever left it. If you have left it please get bak to it now.

It was revised to the width-washy ‘1m plus’ in the summer, hence why you typically no longer have to queue to get into supermarkets. This was apparently based on new evidence that showed that 2m was not entirely necessary and the fact that cases had dropped to relatively low levels. The latter at the very least is no longer true and needs reviewing again.

Link: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-rule-in-england-for-1-metre-plus-coronavirus

 

[Poojah]

I presume you would allow 1 TV news channel to stay open?

Unless you're talking very short term, the number of non-essential workers is longer than you think. Packaging manufacturers, for example. No point producing the food if you can't pack it up for sale. Ball bearing and other machinery manufacturers. Can parts manufacturers. All manufacturers, basically, because their products service the food etc industry.

I would classify major national news channels under the banner of ‘key infrastructure’. Likewise, I realised that food manufacture, importation and transportation has a lengthy supply chain, so of course these need to remain open (and I did attempt to cover this in my original post).

As I say, what percentage of the population could be sent home that were allowed to work in April, I don’t know. However, it does feel like we’re about to reach a point whereby the strictest conceivable measures need to be introduced, or we’re going to find ourselves in an absolutely heartbreaking situation.

I consider myself very fortunate in that I have not lost anyone I know closely to this pestilence to date (and I say that touching all the wood available to me). However, I realise now that the chances of that changing in the coming weeks is quite real with the new variant seemingly out of control. That’s something I think we all need to consider, particularly those of us who have grown tired of restrictions - of the 2,000 - 3,000 deaths per day we’ll soon be reporting (and I don’t believe that’s hyperbole) chances are they will include someone you my cry tears over at some point.

This is not a joke. This is an incredibly perilous situation.

 

[Poojah]

So shut down the civil service?

No immigration or customs officers, no DWP staff to process benefit claims etc?

Again, I’d cover these under the banner of ‘key infrastructure’. Critical components of society have to run, that said we shouldn’t be allowing many people through immigration at this time so we certainly shouldn’t have such resources running at full capacity.

 

[Poojah]

That puzzled me too. I was convinced the rule was still in place

See my post above - in June it changed to 1m provided that screens and other measures were in place, which has been the case in most major shops and pubs. This allowed such establishments to effectively double their capacity, which the government were of course keen to do for economic reasons.

It’s clearly led to a position though whereby nobody really seems to know the rules anymore, much less abide by them. We have a weary and confused public, and this is something which needs to be urgently addressed.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

covered this in another thread - its not policy to mix, its a contingency. our health service doesnt have such ad hoc approach to rolling out vaccinations.

Policy? What policy? People who have already had the Pfizer vaccine have had their second appointments cancelled.

I didn't realise there was another thread when I posted the link, so my apologies.

 

[Gazwag]

All elective ops at Spire next door to the Conquest are cancelled for two weeks due to lack of oxygen availability, becoming a major issue due to sheer number of covid patients needing 24 hour oxygen therapy.

 

[worthingseagull123]

Again, I’d cover these under the banner of ‘key infrastructure’. Critical components of society have to run, that said we shouldn’t be allowing many people through immigration at this time so we certainly shouldn’t have such resources running at full capacity.

That is all rather simplistic though.

Do garages have to close? I am a key worker and my car breaks down. What happens then?

There are 60,000 people awaiting interviews for outstanding asylum claims. Do they stay in limbo?

I live in a small flat any my lightbulls all go. Do I have to sit in the dark as B and Q has been forced to close?

I’ve done 12 hours in hospital. Come home. I am too tired to cook, but am not allowed to get food delivered.

 

[Poojah]

That is all rather simplistic though.

Do garages have to close? I am a key worker and my car breaks down. What happens then?

There are 60,000 people awaiting interviews for outstanding asylum claims. Do they stay in limbo?

I live in a small flat any my lightbulls all go. Do I have to sit in the dark as B and Q has been forced to close?

I’ve done 12 hours in hospital. Come home. I am too tired to cook, but am not allowed to get food delivered.

Of course it’s rather simplistic, because I’m posting high-level thoughts on an internet messageboard. Ultimately, someone is getting paid to make these decisions and to consider the nuances and implications of closing or not closing particular industries and institutions.

This time around, we’ve had more time to plan than in March and a better understanding of the behaviour of the virus. I would hope that this work has already been done, likewise a proper plan for online learning for children - what happened in he spring and summer simply wasn’t good enough, though I appreciate that the entire world had been caught short at that point.

My worry is that the new variant has created a situation that hadn’t been considered possible until very, very recently, and we may again suffer through a failure to prepare for the worst case scenario which rapidly appears to be coming true.

 

[Jimmy Grimble]

Teaching unions telling their members not to return to school on Monday under the current provisions. Needs to return to just key workers and vulnerable children. Quite rightly, IMO.

 

[Poojah]

Teaching unions telling their members not to return to school on Monday under the current provisions. Needs to return to just key workers and vulnerable children. Quite rightly, IMO.

Indeed. With two primary school age kids myself, I’m absolutely dreading having to work from home with the two of them running around me again and I’m also very sad for them that they are going to miss out on yet more education and social interaction with their peers.

However, the situation is too serious to ignore and I don’t see them going back to school come Monday morning. It’s a tragic situation on so many levels.

 

[atomised]

Indeed. With two primary school age kids myself, I’m absolutely dreading having to work from home with the two of them running around me again and I’m also very sad for them that they are going to miss out on yet more education and social interaction with their peers.

However, the situation is too serious to ignore and I don’t see them going back to school come Monday morning. It’s a tragic situation on so many levels.

I agree. I mentioned today's union meeting yesterday when I got wind of it. In east Sussex so still don't know what will happen yet but not massively keen on them going back in the current situation. Both primary aged. Had 3 weeks of the last 6 prior to Christmas off and isolating and not convinced at all that it is a safe environment. Teachers constantly switching between bubbles renders those bubbles meaningless. On top of that with the current speed of transmission It seems wrong to send groups of 30 in non socially distanced classes to then return to homes meeting with siblings and interacting

 

[Jolly Red Giant]

I agree. I mentioned today's union meeting yesterday when I got wind of it. In east Sussex so still don't know what will happen yet but not massively keen on them going back in the current situation. Both primary aged. Had 3 weeks of the last 6 prior to Christmas off and isolating and not convinced at all that it is a safe environment. Teachers constantly switching between bubbles renders those bubbles meaningless. On top of that with the current speed of transmission It seems wrong to send groups of 30 in non socially distanced classes to then return to homes meeting with siblings and interacting

As in Ireland - the Tories want to keep the schools open at all costs - because creches/ nursery care is a shambles and they are effectively using the schools as babysitters to keep profits flowing. If you seriously want to curb the pandemic then you need to shut schools..