JFK - The Programme last night on BBC2

[Beach Hut]

It was interesting and also proved the dumbing down of Americans by believing the film JFK was the truth.

 

[Bare]

US Seagull you might not want to read this next part.

Bullets are subject to the same laws of physics as anything else. When the bullet entered the skull it pierced a small hole in the skull the same diameter as the bullet its self. Depending on the type of bullet used and the angle to the skull, sometimes fragments break off at this point. As the bullet passes into the brain matter, the energy has to go somewhere as it slows down. Often the bullet diameter increases as this happens and more distruction occurs. A kind of mushrooming effect. If one can imagine a plow pushing dirt, the matter in front increases the further forward the plow move. No different with a bullet. As the preasure of all this matter increases on the outside of the skull on the other side of the head, it explodes outward. All the brain, blood, skull, skin and hair flies in the direction of the bullet. The head will move, as a result of this tremendous preasure built up inside of the head, in the direction of the bullet till the skull finally gives way and allows the bullet and matter to exit. Gruesome.

The initial fingerprint tests revealed nothing, so the perpetrator had to have wiped it clean at some time and/or wore gloves. It was only after the gun was in police hands for several days that a print was found. Only one fingerprint of a Max Wallace was found on the boxes that made the sniper perch. Interesting.

 

[US Seagull]

US Seagull you might not want to read this next part.

Bullets are subject to the same laws of physics as anything else. When the bullet entered the skull it pierced a small hole in the skull the same diameter as the bullet its self. Depending on the type of bullet used and the angle to the skull, sometimes fragments break off at this point. As the bullet passes into the brain matter, the energy has to go somewhere as it slows down. Often the bullet diameter increases as this happens and more distruction occurs. A kind of mushrooming effect. If one can imagine a plow pushing dirt, the matter in front increases the further forward the plow move. No different with a bullet. As the preasure of all this matter increases on the outside of the skull on the other side of the head, it explodes outward. All the brain, blood, skull, skin and hair flies in the direction of the bullet. The head will move, as a result of this tremendous preasure built up inside of the head, in the direction of the bullet till the skull finally gives way and allows the bullet and matter to exit. Gruesome.

The initial fingerprint tests revealed nothing, so the perpetrator had to have wiped it clean at some time and/or wore gloves. It was only after the gun was in police hands for several days that a print was found. Only one fingerprint of a Max Wallace was found on the boxes that made the sniper perch. Interesting.

I wasn't arguing with you. I was suggesting that there might be another way to explain what appears to my untrained eye to be a shot to the front of the head. I was thinking out loud. What I was thinking was that if the bullet had slowed down too much to break the skull on the other side it might rebound and come back out the way it came in (which might be weakened or cracked by the inital impact). I know I'm clutching at straws here. I'm not a ballistics expert and I never claimed to be. All I know about the ballistics of gun shots comes from the movies and I know how they like to bend the laws of physics for dramatic effect (check this out ). Since the alternative to a shot to the back of the head is a shot to the front of the head followed by a vast conspiracy to cover it up, I think it's worthwhile exhausting all the shot to the back of the head possibilities first do you think? It's called Occam's razor. Try shaving with it sometime
Another problem is that I never heard any professional ballistics experts making a big deal out of it, so I suspect there is nothing in it.
I'm not denying that the whole thing looks suspect. But until I see compelling evidence I'm not going to buy into the massive conspiracy theory

 

[Bare]

I hope I didn't sound offensive and I didn't think you were argumentative.

Physics. A body in motion stays in motion till something changes that motion. A car traveling at 50mph hits something, it will not stop till enough force is exerted against it to make it stop. If the car is hit from the side, the car will move the direction of that hit. If you're walking along and a buddy comes up on your right and gives you a shove, you'll move the direction of the shove. Simple enough?

In order to make a bullet ricochet, there has to be enough resistance to make the bullet bounce back. Unfortunately, a human head isn't a steel plate an inch thick.

The Zapruder film recorded the events as they happened. It's companion from the other side did as well.

 

[US Seagull]

I hope I didn't sound offensive and I didn't think you were argumentative.

Physics. A body in motion stays in motion till something changes that motion. A car traveling at 50mph hits something, it will not stop till enough force is exerted against it to make it stop. If the car is hit from the side, the car will move the direction of that hit. If you're walking along and a buddy comes up on your right and gives you a shove, you'll move the direction of the shove. Simple enough?

In order to make a bullet ricochet, there has to be enough resistance to make the bullet bounce back. Unfortunately, a human head isn't a steel plate an inch thick.

The Zapruder film recorded the events as they happened. It's companion from the other side did as well.

I'd have to agree that the that skull probably wouldn't be thick enough to deflect a bullet, but it depends on the momentum of the bullet which will depend on the mass of the bullet and it's velocity. It will lose velocity as it flies through the air (so range is a factor) and it'll lose even more once it hits the back side of the skull and tries to push it's way through several inches of brain Bullets can become lodged in people because they don't have enough momentum to make it all the way through, but I'd have to agree that it's excedingly unlikely (probably impossible) that a bullet would not have enough moment to make an exit wound, but still have enough to come all the way back out(especially since, as you noted, it'll be bigger by them).
Like I said before, it is all extremely odd, he appears to fall forward at first (consistent with being hit from behind) then suddenly jerks back and the contents of his skull fly backwards (consistent with a hit from the front). Actually it kind of looks like the top of his head flips open
All very nasty....

 

[beorhthelm]

I missed the program on Sunday. What exactly did i miss.

More to the point, how was it so contrary to Stone's JFK? Ive always thought that film was great as it presented you with as many different theories as is sensible for a human to cope with. Unfortunatly, i think its too many for most, so they dont get it.

The only thing that JFK really says on the matter is the official story is false. It presents a lot of good albiet circumstantial evidence, but cruically points out the obsurdity of the 3 bullet theory and shows the footage of the head shot that really buries the offical line.

JFK isnt trying to say that a bunch of Generals with shares in Bell hired Cubans, which where then handled by Mob agents and financed by drug crazed queens from New Orleans, all the while sending some chap off to Russia to create a double agent who could take the blame. It mearly presented these possible scenarios in order to make an entertaining film. It seems too many people take the film too literally.

 

[Fridge Man]

It was totally different to oliver stones movie, it was a good programme but i thought it missed a lot out should have been a two hour programme and im still not convinced its the truth.

 

[Northstander]

I cannot lie, LH Oswald did not work alone. How do I know this? I was on the grassy knoll that fatefull with a 12 bore double barrel. Boy did that head explode when I let a few off.

PS don't let anyone know about this by the way!!

 

[marvin]

I missed the program on Sunday. What exactly did i miss.

More to the point, how was it so contrary to Stone's JFK? Ive always thought that film was great as it presented you with as many different theories as is sensible for a human to cope with. Unfortunately, i think its too many for most, so they dont get it.

The only thing that JFK really says on the matter is the official story is false. It presents a lot of good albiet circumstantial evidence, but cruically points out the obsurdity of the 3 bullet theory and shows the footage of the head shot that really buries the offical line.

JFK isnt trying to say that a bunch of Generals with shares in Bell hired Cubans, which where then handled by Mob agents and financed by drug crazed queens from New Orleans, all the while sending some chap off to Russia to create a double agent who could take the blame. It mearly presented these possible scenarios in order to make an entertaining film. It seems too many people take the film too literally.

The last bit is one of the main things it said. Many Americans think that the film is a work of fact not fiction.

It contested the "magic Bullet" theory.

In the film the president and the front seat passenger were at the same spacing in the car and it had the front seat passenger not seated correctly.

According to this programme, the front seat passenger was sat offset of where JFK was (slightly further into the car) at a lower seating position to JFK and turned slightly to the right, in the direction it said of where the sound of the shot came from. (you may ponder that in a mo). This was the sound of the first shot which apparently missed the car.

Using this as its computer model it showed that if you trace the bullet back through the front seat passenger, through JFK it exactly goes back to the 6th floor of the book depository. No right turns no left turns but straight, as a bullet you might say.

If this is so, then the shot came from behind the car, why was the sound to the right? Why did the front seat passenger turn to the right?

 

[Bare]

JFK isnt trying to say that a bunch of Generals with shares in Bell hired Cubans, which where then handled by Mob agents and financed by drug crazed queens from New Orleans, all the while sending some chap off to Russia to create a double agent who could take the blame. It mearly presented these possible scenarios in order to make an entertaining film. It seems too many people take the film too literally. [/B][/QUOTE]

There's a nutshell appraisal for you.