Do 20- and 30-somethings have it hard?

[Garry Nelson's Left Foot]

Why would they? Hardly Bono is it?

I don't really want to disagree with you, partly because this would be the most rubbish binfest of all time, but mostly because you live in Tokyo which makes me insanely jealous of you.

Oh, I wasn't trying to cause an argument. It's just that when whoever it was said Tim Wheeler I instantly knew who he meant and assumed that most people around my age(29) would. '1977' soundtracked a great teenage summer for me when I was 15 or 16 and I assumed it did for a lot of other people too.

Oh Yeah it was the start of the summer
It felt just like it was the start of forever...

Don't be jealous of Tokyo. There's no greenery, no central heating and the football's shit...

 

[sir albion]

It seems the 20's have a much easier life these days.To many stay on at uni for far to long and as mentioned above ponce off mummy and daddy.Lazy is not a big enough word for these cretins.

Probably why we have so many foreigners as the youngsters here spend 10 years dossing before working.

 

[folkestonesgull]

Golden generation were born in the 1950s - grants for education, great public sector pensions, retirement at 60 and wealth creation via the housing boom.

I was born in 1981, Maggie took away my free milk, I had to pay tuition fees and will be working to 70plus to fund the baby boomers retirement. Such is life- I could move abroad if I wanted out...

 

[User removed 4]

It seems the 20's have a much easier life these days.To many stay on at uni for far to long and as mentioned above ponce off mummy and daddy.Lazy is not a big enough word for these cretins.

Probably why we have so many foreigners as the youngsters here spend 10 years dossing before working.

leave off mate, you make yourself sound like some retired colonel harrumphing into his gin and tonic with statements like that, there are loads of decent kids around, i think that there are pros and cons to growing up in many different eras, why WOULDNT we want subsequent generations to have it better than us ? they're our kids for goodness sake.

 

[sten_super]

I think the raised level of expectations are a major issue. I've never understood why Labour have pushed for 50% of people to go to university, all that was ever going to do was raise job requirements while increasing debt levels. The labour market fundamentally isn't supply-side driven, it is driven by demand. The guy that has written this article is a case in point; he expects (nay, demands) a job in the industry of his choice, in an industry that is dying on its arse.

 

[strings]

leave off mate, you make yourself sound like some retired colonel harrumphing into his gin and tonic with statements like that, there are loads of decent kids around, i think that there are pros and cons to growing up in many different eras, why WOULDNT we want subsequent generations to have it better than us ? they're our kids for goodness sake.

I don't normally agree with Bushy, but this is spot on.

It is not the fault of current graduates that they have come out of University into a recession. Young people were told that if they go to University they would be rewarded with decent employment prospects. The fact is the recession has been caused by an over reliance on credit caused by previous generations buying things on credit and possibly exacerbated by the current government's huge level of public borrowing.

Having said that. You need experience to get a decent job and not enough graduates are willing to get their hands dirty for a year or two to gain the experience needed to supplement their degree. I worked on a salary for 2 years that, once broken down into an hourly rate, was well below the minimum wage if I included all the evenings I was in work until late at night for no extra money. But, it was worth it.

Blaming the 'lazy' younger generation is not entirely fair, given that the reason there are so few jobs is not their fault. However, young people need to be willing to work hard to suceed.

Everyone has collective responsiblity for this situation.

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

leave off mate, you make yourself sound like some retired colonel harrumphing into his gin and tonic with statements like that, there are loads of decent kids around, i think that there are pros and cons to growing up in many different eras, why WOULDNT we want subsequent generations to have it better than us ? they're our kids for goodness sake.

Steady that man ... sounds a bit too sensible.

Problem is that 20 years ago, a degree would almost guarantee a good job no matter the subject matter. I believe it was something like 2% of the population had degrees and the gap between graduates and the rest of the population was massive, It's not the case now and many employers will take someone with good A-levels over a graduate. They are cheaper, less bolshy and tend to understand the need to push themselves. A good number of graduates I've seen have believe that now they have a degree they've made it.
My advice to anyone going to Uni is to 'do' a degree that directly relates to the job you want to do or take a maths/science subject, rather than learning for learning sakes as the debt isn't worth it!

 

[Bluejuice]

In answer to the original thread question, yes, yes we do.

My folks are both just hitting their 60s and openly admit they feel sorry for myself and my sister who are neither of us leechers or ponces as we simply don't have anywhere near as much help and assistance in making the jump from graduate to young adult that they enjoyed in years gone by - we can't realistically make any inroads on the property ladder, we can't jump into a "solid" career path with prospects despite out education and we are expected to contribute an awful lot more to the country that isn't looking after us. Young people today have to PAY to do voluntary service for f***'s sake.

The situation is so f***ed that my sister has jumped ship to make a new life in Sweden and my own economic prospects are so poor that I'm seriously considering bankruptcy FOR THE SECOND TIME and I'm not even 30.

I've been on the dole since the beginning of December now, during which time I have been expected to attend the Jobcentre on just ONE solitary occasion (in over EIGHT weeks) and when I did turn up with my list of the few jobs I'd managed to apply for since losing my last job the young lady in charge of "signing" gave me a surprised look and told me that they didn't really expect me to update the supposedly mandatory job applications list as they knew there weren't really any jobs and didn't expect us to just go through the motions.

Some help that was.

I then got a not unsubstantial sum of money deposited into my bank account and received a letter from the council informing me that I was no longer liable for Council Tax and they would be paying for my rent. The really shocking part was that the money they were awarding me for my rent actually exceeded the amount I am liable to pay and thus I am MAKING A PROFIT on my housing benefit which means that I am genuinely better off (financially) sitting at home and doing nothing than I would be with a minimum wage job in McDonald's or Asda.

I do actually want a job and at one time even harboured hopes of embarking upon a career at some stage but instead I am told there is little point in trying as the jobs just don't exist and what's more is that I would be worse off if I ever did find work at the moment.

What sort of motivation is that?

And did anyone go through the jobs "section" of last week's Argus? Two and a half pages it was, with most of that given over to adverts promising "needed" qualifications in sought after industries (IT, plumbing, carpentry etc.) in exchange for money. So the jobs section was in fact competing with its readers to make money as opposed to offering it in exchange for actual work.

It's an absolute f***ing joke.

This country has no backbone anymore. We have NO visible industry left and our economy is made up almost entirely of invisible and largely questionable financial services institutions who can't even regulate themselves but won't accept proposals to do so holding the nation to ransom with the net result being hushed over government bailouts to plug enormous great defecits and an ever increasing national debt which is spiralling massively out of control.

And exactly HOW is this going to change? Because I don't see a way out or a solution. We're just being shafted down shit creek until the next bunch of suits come along and take over Whitehall paying lip service to the idea that the puppet on the right will be ENTIRELY different to the incumbent puppets on the left who have presided over such a big fat crock of shit.

Where's the light? What future do the youth of today have to look forward to?

No clean air, no money, no home, no chance of ever achieving financial and social independence but HEY at least I get porn on tap and my word aren't I grateful that I don't have to pay embarrassing visits to the newsagent or the dirty shop like my father would have done back in the day just to get his kicks.

Yes that's right, that's actually ALL it boils down to in the end. Kids today don't know how lucky they are. Limitless on demand pornography catering for EVERY possible deviance or fetish. Never mind that you will never own anything tangible, real or of ANY value whatsoever because that's where we are now, this is the 21st Century and where once we had a class system this country now boasts only divisions based on age.

Oh capitalism, how we tried, sorry it just didn't work out...

 

[sir albion]

leave off mate, you make yourself sound like some retired colonel harrumphing into his gin and tonic with statements like that, there are loads of decent kids around, i think that there are pros and cons to growing up in many different eras, why WOULDNT we want subsequent generations to have it better than us ? they're our kids for goodness sake.

Yeah so you parents should buck you're idea's up
Fact that many parents charge no rent money gives the shitheads no motivation to work

 

[BLOCK F]

As a retired old git of 61,I have to agree that in many respects the younger generation of 20 somethings have got it quite hard in some ways.....not so sure about those in their mid to late 30's.
Yes,far too many young people have been bamboozled into going to uni,when they really shouldn't have, and of course, if degrees daft and otherwise are two a penny,the whole point of gaining a degree is devalued.I have never understood why this awful Government of ours wanted 50% of young people to go to university.However,that does leave 50% of youngsters who have not been to uni and I don't think the article really mentions them(though I must admit to skimming through the second half as it was rapidly becoming a boring 'poor me lucky you binfest'.).
I think it is appalling that young graduates leave uni with huge debts and little prospects of finding a decent job,let alone buying a property at a reasonable price a bit further on,but to be honest it comes as little surprise.
I don't necessarily think this generation are lazier than older generations,but they do expect everything to fall into place rather quicker than we did.Unlike us,they have all the gizmos and gadgets,but not the jobs and houses,that we did have....I know which I prefer, so I do sympathise.
My middle offspring is hoping to go to uni this year to study radiography and as there is shortage of radiographers in the country his chances of getting a job should be high.He can also use this skill abroad,so if things get even shittier here at least he can buzz off!
Hopefully,lessons will be learned and we can get some kind of balance back in the country where degrees are no longer peddled willy-nilly and a lot of disillusioned young people achieve nothing more than a large debt and a paper qualification worth little or nothing in the real world.
My advice to young people ....think about how you might want to earn a living and find out as much as you can before signing up for that degree course;university may not be the best thing for you!

 

[Lord Bracknell]

I'm waiting for the generation we are talking about to PRODUCE something revolutionary that changes British culture for ever.

Sadly, it seems that it is a generation of consumers, not producers. Organising stag nights in Prague, because Easylink flights are cheap, or texting votes to Big Brother, isn't shaking the world up, is it? Nor is handing popular music over to Simon Cowell.

 

[Techno]

and later rather than l8er.

L8r actually!! See they do teach us some stuff at Uni.

I'm in the second year of my course at the moment, and applying for industrial placements for next year as part of my course. Its not easy and ive had a quite a few rejections, but I didnt expect it to be easy. The main reason I want a year in industry is to try and differentiate myself from someone with just a degree when i leave and am looking for jobs, because as mentioned so many people have degrees now.

In some respects I dont think we have it easy, not hard, but not easy either, however some people really dont help themselves, for example the lack of common sense and real-life skills among a lot of university students is shocking!! A number of people think they can just walk out with a degree and walk straight into a job without any effort at all.

 

[Wozza]

L8r actually!! See they do teach us some stuff at Uni.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

Golden generation were born in the 1950s - grants for education, great public sector pensions, retirement at 60 and wealth creation via the housing boom.

You've forgotten FREE orange juice on the NHS.

 

[wellquickwoody]

why WOULDNT we want subsequent generations to have it better than us ?

Cos I get jealous very easily.

they're our kids for goodness sake.

No, they are your kids, and I am fed up paying for them. (Child benefit, family credit, uni education, unemployment benefit etc)



Touche perhaps?

 

[Gwylan]

Steady that man ... sounds a bit too sensible.

Problem is that 20 years ago, a degree would almost guarantee a good job no matter the subject matter. I believe it was something like 2% of the population had degrees and the gap between graduates and the rest of the population was massive

It wasn't quite that easy: I graduated in 1981 and had to take another course to get a job and then spent some years applying for jobs. As El Pres pointed out, it was in the middle of a recession - and one where the unemployment rate was higher than this one's/

It was a long process: I probably applied for 700/800 jobs in that time. I eventually did get a job, not at a very high salary, but quickly got promoted and eventually was earning a good whack - I was in my 30s by then.

BTW, I believe that it was 7% of the population went to university - that was far too low.

At least I got a grant, although everyone I know left uni with, what seemed at the time, a hefty debt. I can't say that we struggled but it wasn't a golden age either.

I do feel sorry for today's youngsters though: I thinik the jobs market will sort itself out soon but the housing market is going to be tough - and it's going to be no fun having student debt having over you.

 

[clapham_gull]

I'm waiting for the generation we are talking about to PRODUCE something revolutionary that changes British culture for ever.

Sadly, it seems that it is a generation of consumers, not producers. Organising stag nights in Prague, because Easylink flights are cheap, or texting votes to Big Brother, isn't shaking the world up, is it? Nor is handing popular music over to Simon Cowell.

Social movements in the future will probably be downloaded.

 

[looney]

Does the grauniad article mention how mass immigration will help all there futures?

 

[clapham_gull]

Odd article I read, since me and wife waited ages to get anything near a decent job and we graduated in the early 90s.

I seem to recall I was earning something 9 grand and living in London. I was carrying in boxes for a couple of years and it was such a long time before anyone bothered to ask if I had a degree I had forgotten all I had learnt.

I noticed that a lot of younger people these days are far more forward and shall we say aggressive in the work place. I simply kept my head down.

 

[Marty McFly]

Don't be jealous of Tokyo. There's no greenery, no central heating and the football's shit...

Unfortunately true

The mighty JEF UTD (Chiba) got relegated this year.