Did this bloke deserve this ?

[tedebear]

if he hadn't started annoying the police in the first place he wouldn't have got sprayed. What do you think ?
[/URL]

agree entirely!! the police are too strong handed sometimes but if you've had a few and get mouthy with them you take what you get...

 

[mcshane in the 79th]

tough tittys on him im afraid,shoulnt of got involved.if he thinks he has problems remember simon weston from the falklands,he was a right mess,but got on with his life without whinging

I\'ve got so much respect for Simon Weston

 

[zefarelly]

tough sh!t on him, you can't win an argument with the police. he looks like a bit of a retard to me, which would explain why he thought he could win one !

 

[Billy the Fish]

Re: Re: Did this bloke deserve this ?

agree entirely!! the police are too strong handed sometimes but if you've had a few and get mouthy with them you take what you get...

Which sould be a night in the cells and a caution, not getting cs gas in your face, and in this case badly burned. Do you think he deserved to have his face burned was the question.

 

[jonny.rainbow]

Hideous.

Still could be worse.

 

[bhaexpress]

Hideous.

Still could be worse.

 

[Charles 'Charley' Charles]

Re: Re: Re: Did this bloke deserve this ?

Which sould be a night in the cells and a caution, not getting cs gas in your face, and in this case badly burned. Do you think he deserved to have his face burned was the question.

No perhaps he didn't deserve to have his face burned, but the police didn't cover him in petrol nd light a match, they sprayed him with cs for good reason or he wouldn't of been sprayed. Yes it's unfortunate he had an allergic reaction, but if he hadn't of interfered then he wouldn't of been sprayed. I hope he can't sue, as it's another thing in this culture at the mo which will stop the police doing their job properely.

 

[NMH]

I doubt he deserved that, but it was an accident. Still we entrust the bill with our security and there are many of them that have ill judgement and will go over the top at the slightest excuse.

 

[bhaexpress]

Re: Re: Re: Did this bloke deserve this ?

Which sould be a night in the cells and a caution, not getting cs gas in your face, and in this case badly burned. Do you think he deserved to have his face burned was the question.

Yes and if the bloke had come quietly and politely got in the van he would still have his face. No doubt he was kicking and screaming and violently resisting arrest. CS Gas is only used when the prisoner won't come quietly.

 

[tedebear]

Re: Re: Re: Did this bloke deserve this ?

Which sould be a night in the cells and a caution, not getting cs gas in your face, and in this case badly burned. Do you think he deserved to have his face burned was the question.

no but should the police have to stop and ask everyone if they are allergic to CS before they use it - its a very unlikey reaction....just imagine "excuse me mr drunk person abusing me and clobbering me over the head can I just ask you if you're allergic to this gas I'm going to spray on you to subdue you before I do it?" its bad enough police having to make sure they follow proper protocol before arresting criminals otherwise they'll get off scott free in court....police are being sued out of doing a proper and just job by people like you and your opinions....

 

[Springal]

dont know if this has been said, but theres 2 types of 'CS gas'

the one sussex police use, burns alot, but is harmless, PROPER CS gas, which is used by some police forces [cant confirm if this police force does] uses extract from CHILLIS etc.

My boss used to be a pig, said that a colleague SPRAYED someone in a police VAN with 'harmless' CS gas, close to them, and prisoner was FINE after about 15 minutes of burning, however 3 other offices got it in there eyes as it bounced off the victims head

 

[Marc]

no they should'nt of sprayed him.....they should've SHOT him!

 

[Collar Feeler]

Well no-one actually deserves that to happen to their face but it was an unfortunate and rare reaction to the CS spray.

It's all well and good saying the police should have put him in the cells and given him a caution or only sprayed him if they were about to be attacked but in reality it is much more difficult than those perfectly boxed scenarios.

There are so many factors in play before someone gets sprayed such as How many people are involved and to what extent, how many officers are present, what the people involved are doing. I mean it would have been a bit difficult for officers trying to arrest his mate and all that entails such as handcuffing or restraining him if he was getting a bit lively to simply tell matey boy here to f*** off, particularly if he was drunk and aggressive and displaying all the signs of someone about to kick off. Then there are impact factors such as size and relative strength of the persons involved including the police. (Its a fact that smaller female officers spray more people than larger male officers for instance), Then you have other factors such as drink, drugs and behaviour. Put all this together and you usually have just a few seconds or even a split second to make the decision to spray someone in order to incapacitate them and remove them from causing any more danger.

Of course being a copper I am biased in favour of the police since I see it from that side of the fence. What I will say is that I don't get paid enough to get my head kicked in, particularly by pissed up nobbers who think they can fight the world, and any time I ever feel in danger of getting a shoeing the person gets sprayed.

Technical Info: Sussex police use the much more effective Captor Synthetic Pepper spray which is less persistent than CS spray meaning it clears away quicker and does not affect so many people when used in close confined spaces. CS Spray which is a nasty chemical and still used by the majority of forces in the UK tends to affect more people surrounding the intended recipient including the officers that used it which is why those forces with CS Spray use it much less often than forces like Sussex.

 

[Gully]

As far as I understand it the police only use CS spray to subdue someone who they percieve to be a danger to either themselves or the public, I am sure that they don't do it just for the fun of it, anyone who has been subjected to CS gas will know that it is less than pleasant.

If the police want to catch and spray the scrotes who have been vandalising cars, including mine, in my street then that is fine by me, but only if they think that they might get away and do it again.

 

[Dropkick Turnip]

tough tittys on him im afraid,shoulnt of got involved.if he thinks he has problems remember simon weston from the falklands,he was a right mess,but got on with his life without whinging

QUOTE]Originally posted by mcshane in the 79th
I\'ve got so much respect for Simon Weston [/QUOTE]

There's no comparison. Simon Weston went to The Falklands as an obligation (that of going to war, should your country happen to declare one) and faced horrors that I hope the rest of us will never have to. But it was part of the job and war is horrible, probably always has been and probably always will be.

But the gratuitous use of CS gas or pepper spray by police is a serious matter. Someone very close to me had pepper spray used on him whilst he was under arrest (for an extremely minor public order offence) and handcuffed and posing no threat to anyone apart from those who didn't like the sound of his voice.

It's dangerous to assume that the police are always right. I'm not saying that they are always wrong (far from it) but it's wise to exercise caution before assuming that the "suspect" is the bad guy.

 

[perseus]

As far as I understand it the police only use CS spray to subdue someone who they percieve to be a danger to either themselves or the public, I am sure that they don't do it just for the fun of it, anyone who has been subjected to CS gas will know that it is less than pleasant.

If the police want to catch and spray the scrotes who have been vandalising cars, including mine, in my street then that is fine by me, but only if they think that they might get away and do it again.

Do you think they should use it in a football stadium? I don't

The panic caused by it would be more dangerous than not using it. Or on railway stations where the railway police have had it longer than the Sussex Police

Some of them curries in somebody's face could have you up for GBH.

 

[Collar Feeler]

There's no comparison. Simon Weston went to The Falklands as an obligation (that of going to war, should your country happen to declare one) and faced horrors that I hope the rest of us will never have to. But it was part of the job and war is horrible, probably always has been and probably always will be.

But the gratuitous use of CS gas or pepper spray by police is a serious matter. Someone very close to me had pepper spray used on him whilst he was under arrest (for an extremely minor public order offence) and handcuffed and posing no threat to anyone apart from those who didn't like the sound of his voice.

It's dangerous to assume that the police are always right. I'm not saying that they are always wrong (far from it) but it's wise to exercise caution before assuming that the "suspect" is the bad guy. [/B]

That's a fair point, unfortunately as in any job there are bound to be some in the Police over zealous in the use of the spray, that cannot be excused and should be dealt with accordingly. I'd certainly like to see the officers report who sprayed a handcuffed and compliant prisoner!!! How s(he) explained that one would make interesting reading.

To put it into perspective, in the last 4 years as a front line PC in Brighton, I have used my Spray twice. Both times to subdue and control violent drunken blokes who were resisting arrest and trying to fight me or my colleague. On reflection though I reckon I should have used it at least half a dozen more times instead of rolling around on the ground with some herbert and getting assaulted into the bargain!

 

[perseus]

That's a fair point, unfortunately as in any job there are bound to be some in the Police over zealous in the use of the spray, that cannot be excused and should be dealt with accordingly. I'd certainly like to see the officers report who sprayed a handcuffed and compliant prisoner!!! How s(he) explained that one would make interesting reading.

To put it into perspective, in the last 4 years as a front line PC in Brighton, I have used my Spray twice. Both times to subdue and control violent drunken blokes who were resisting arrest and trying to fight me or my colleague. On reflection though I reckon I should have used it at least half a dozen more times instead of rolling around on the ground with some herbert and getting assaulted into the bargain!

Anybody with an offensive weapon should not be allowed on railways stations or in crowded places like night clubs, pubs or football stadia. I would not let them in my house. Would you?

Or would you

Or cosh them on the shoulder, that's personal

I dunno. I just get out of way. Depends how big they are really. I expect outside of pubs is OK.

 

[Roger Mellie]

Of course he didn't deserve it on what we know about the incident. Those of you who think the police are always right and you should never question them should f*** off to china, or wales. I used to specialise is actions against the police and they are the most unaccountable bunch you could ever meet. The chances of you succeeding in a compliant against them was less than 2% and none have ever been successfully prosecuted for any death they have caused either by vehicle or in cells or any other means. No doubt the brazillian guy will not break this record.

 

[hitony]

Mr Ford had been drinking with his sister Rachel and his cousin Donna Lewis when he saw a friend being questioned by police.



Says it all in my opinion, im positive the police would not have used the spray unlethey felt it was totally necessary