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Day 7 - Fri 11th Feb - SHEEPCOTE LOOKING GOOD?



The Oldman

I like the Hat
NSC Patron
Jul 12, 2003
7,139
In the shadow of Seaford Head
Inquiry Report Day 7 friday

I managed to get to the Inquiry for the first time today. Took wrong turning and sat near the Nimbys! There from about 12 to the end at 1.40. Did not pick the most exciting day as it was all about the impact of the lights that a stadium and its associated infrastructure would produce at the various sites. 3 main players. In the “box”, Mr Wade our lighting expert, our counsel Mr Clay and Lewes DC’s Mr White.

Our counsel took Mr Wade through his report. To cut a long story short, Community Stadiums at Falmer, Withdean, and Sheepcote would have acceptable levels of lighting. All other sites are no go. Lewes Mr White was much exercised to prove that Toad hall Valley was acceptable in lighting terms. He tried to convince the Inspector that as THV was surrounded by urban Brighton & Hove no one would notice a few more lights. Our Mr wade strongly put his view that Stadium lights plus those from any associated commercial development would be unacceptable to the hundreds of residents of surrounding area and compared that to the low impact there would be to Falmer Residents from a community stadium at Village Way, especially as already there are A27 lights, Brighton Uni lights, Sussex Uni lights, tennis Court lights etc, etc, etc.

The highlight was a bit of a duel between White and Clay over who had said at a the previous inquiry that our proposed floodlights were in operation at Christ Hospital Scholl playing fields (Horsham) and there they produced high lighting impact. Apparently it was a Mr Wade of Lewes DC who had introduced this previously but Mr White representing Lewes thought it was our Mr Wade. Thought not only did our Mr Clay make Lewes look silly but it gave our expert the chance to explain that our floodlights would be within a Stadium pointing down so negligible light outside.

So thought our expert did well but the Falmer Nimbys must be pleased that Sheepcote and Withdean still there. Not sure what weight the Inspector will give to the lighting issue but there was talk of night time visits. That should be fun giving the amount of lights I see when driving through Falmer.

Also thought that our Mr Clay was excellent and put Mr White in his place. But it ain't over 'til the fat lady (man) sings!
 




Tom Hark Preston Park

Will Post For Cash
Jul 6, 2003
71,897
Fine report Gaffer :clap:

And a tremendous illustration for any Albion fans who happen to fall within Lewes District Council's, er, district, that your Council Tax is helping pay for this bullshit. Don't get mad, get EVEN. Report them to the Audit Commission for wasting your money.
 


Rangdo

Registered Cider Drinker
Apr 21, 2004
4,779
Cider Country
So LDC's top notch solicitor got confused by two people with the same name? Love it :lolol: .
Excellent reporting :clap:
 


ShorehamGull

He's now back
Jul 6, 2003
1,945
Shoreham of course
I remember that bit, very funny, had everyone in the Chamber laughing, what a Pratt Mr White is:lolol:
 


The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
I must have missed you by a few minutes. I turned up for the half hour until 11.45.

Talking to Lord Bracknell for about 15 minutes afterwards, it appears that with all the evidence being presented (albeit from our side), it is boiling down to a dogfight between Falmer and Sheepcote, as one by one the other sites have been identified as having too many problems (traffic, environment, ecological, financial) - plus ones which people on here would not necessarily have considered.

Sheepcote is appearing to be an suitable and available site an all issues except one - transport. However, if Prescott follows his own government's policy on sustainable transport, Falmer ought to be given the nod. Brighton & Hove City Council are due to give evidence at the Inquiry. Hopefully, they will put in a fair bit of weighty information about traffic management in the city - including how central and east Brighton would be brought to a standstill on alternate Saturdays. Hopefully.
 




Tom Hark Preston Park

Will Post For Cash
Jul 6, 2003
71,897
The Large One said:
Talking to Lord Bracknell for about 15 minutes afterwards, it appears that with all the evidence being presented (albeit from our side), it is boiling down to a dogfight between Falmer and Sheepcote.

Does this infer that at the very worst we'll be given the green light - even if the recommendation from the ODPM is not thje Albion's site of choice? Or are we looking at round of Inquiry - with associated costs - to decide between a shortlist of non-insane sites? Can this inspector call for a re-match between Falmer and a Plan B which may or may not be Sheepcote? Or can he just say, bollocks to it, neither Falmer nor Sheepcote are acceptable, stay at Withdean and muddle through til you go bust?

And is there any point in this inquiry when the inspector can actually call the NIMBYs to account and order them to stop talking bollocks about Cement works and Airports and the like?

Getting a bit tired of the democratic process here... :angry:
 


Tom Hark said:
Can this inspector call for a re-match between Falmer and a Plan B which may or may not be Sheepcote? Or can he just say, bollocks to it, neither Falmer nor Sheepcote are acceptable, stay at Withdean and muddle through til you go bust?
The Inspector has made it clear that he will NOT recommend a site.

He will advise Prescott on the issues set out in the letter from the ODPM, dated 26 July:-

For each site:

a)
(i) Is the site within the conurbation of Brighton and Hove, thereby complying with Football League requirements?
(ii) Is site acquisition a realistic proposition?
(iii) Is the site large enough for a 22,000 capacity community stadium together with a bus/coach park?
(iv) Can a stadium be built without incurring unaffordable development costs on the site?
(v) Can a stadium be built on the site without resulting in any over-riding safety/stadium management problems?
(vi) Are there any over-riding site specific planning issues?
(vii) Is the site accessible by sustainable modes of transport?
(viii) Can a stadium be built on the site without resulting in any unacceptable environmental impacts?
(ix) Can a stadium be built on the site without any unacceptable visual impacts?

b) The estimated cost of the development at Falmer and all of the above sites having regard to the advice in PPG7 "The Countryside - Environmental Quality and Economic and Social Development" that major development proposals in Areas of Outstanding Natural Beauty should be demonstrated to be in the public interest and should include assessments of the cost and scope of developing elsewhere outside the AONB or meeting the need for it in some other way

c) Whether there are any other sites that could be suitable for the proposed development, having regard to the above criteria.

d) The implications for the application site and for any of the other alternative sites located within the Sussex Downs Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty of the proposed designation of the South Downs National Park.


Prescott will then consider this Inspector's Report and the previous one and will make a decision on whether or not to grant planning permission at Falmer.
 


The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
Are you suggesting an armed struggle, here? Go for it... :lolol:

In answer to your question about another round of Inquiries, you need to ask 'Why? What would it achieve?' All the questions are being asked - and answered - at this inquiry.

Theoretically, Prescott could pick one of the barmier sites, but that would fly in the face of the government's own policies and would open a real can of worms. He could say 'Sheepcote is the preferred site', although Brighton & Hove City Council, as the planning authority, would be EXTREMELY pissed off if he did. And for those who like political conspiracy theories, pissing off the City Council is not something this particular government is keen to do.

However, as Lord B said on another thread, Sheepcote is not considered viable.




Bollocks - too slow. Thought Ed had gone to the pub...
 
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Hey, let's look on the brightside, if Prescott does recommend Sheepcote Valley then touch wood they will build a 6 lane motorway from the A27 down to the Marina - with a turn-off at Sheepcote.

The turn-off fom the A27 onto this road would be at Falmer (2yrds to the right of the pond), and personally I'd be travelling so fast at that turn-off that the NIMBY'S won't be able to pull out onto it in their 4X4s.
 




Robot Chicken

Seriously?
Jul 5, 2003
13,154
Chicken World
Okay, so suppose the Inspector goes back to Prescott and says the only other site that passes all 9 points of criteria is Sheepcote South...then what would happen?

Would Prescott tell us to build at Sheepcote instead? This has to be the Worst Case Scenario but something has to be in place in anticipation. Surely.
 


The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
Downloaded Penguin said:
Okay, so suppose the Inspector goes back to Prescott and says the only other site that passes all 9 points of criteria is Sheepcote South...then what would happen?

1. That's a bloody great big IF.
2. Sheepcote does NOT do that.

Wait til the traffic bloke from the City Council speaks.

Downloaded Penguin said:
Would Prescott tell us to build at Sheepcote instead? This has to be the Worst Case Scenario but something has to be in place in anticipation. Surely.

Remember, this Inspector is not making a recommendation, merely reporting the facts. On balance, I would see that as a good thing for us. And even if he does make a recommendation, Prescott is free to ignore it. Or not.

There are some things, I am afraid, where we will just have to wait and see.
 
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Downloaded Penguin said:
Okay, so suppose the Inspector goes back to Prescott and says the only other site that passes all 9 points of criteria is Sheepcote South...then what would happen?

Would Prescott tell us to build at Sheepcote instead?
That won't happen. The most that Prescott could do is invite us to submit a planning application for Sheepcote Valley to Brighton & Hove City Council.

He wouldn't call it in for another Public Inquiry, though.

The only scenario that would lead to a third Inquiry would be if the City Council turned down the planning application and the Albion decided to appeal against that decision. But the Council would be advised that Prescott would be certain to rule in favour of the planning application and that there was no point in refusing it in the first place.

In other words, we'd get a stadium at Sheepcote Valley.
 
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Robot Chicken

Seriously?
Jul 5, 2003
13,154
Chicken World
Of course, in this scenario the Albion will have run out of money way before this happens....
 


Rangdo

Registered Cider Drinker
Apr 21, 2004
4,779
Cider Country
I don't think it will be an issue. Sheepcote is certainly a possibility but does not come as close to meeting the criteria as Falmer. It looks to me that the criteria has been deliberately written that way.
 


Robot Chicken

Seriously?
Jul 5, 2003
13,154
Chicken World
Then that sort of insinuates that Prescott is intending to say yes and only called a second Public Inquiry to avoid any Judicial Review being called on the first one after the two Inspectors both said no to Falmer.
 


Rangdo

Registered Cider Drinker
Apr 21, 2004
4,779
Cider Country
Rangdo said:
I don't think it will be an issue. Sheepcote is certainly a possibility but does not come as close to meeting the criteria as Falmer. It looks to me that the criteria has been deliberately written that way.

Possibly. It's purely my own perception but no matter how many times I read that list of criteria there is only one site that meets them all. From that it seems to me that the criteria has been defined with one purpose in mind.
 






coach03 said:
I've got a couple of days off work next week, Thursday and Friday. Where do I find the times of the enquiry and am I allowed to just pitch up and watch for a bit?
:falmerspi
Tuesdays to Thursdays:- 10 am - 1 pm; 2 pm - 5 pm
Friday:- 9.30 am - 1.30 pm

Just turn up. It's in the Council Chamber on the top floor of Brighton Town Hall.
 


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