[Politics] Brexit

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I have always said that both sides are treacherous, you can't convert the preached too.

I momentarily unblocked you to see if you have begun to talk sense.

Nope. Not even in English.

Don't put yourself through this humiliation. This is like a 'look at the inside of my pants' competition. I think that you, and the entirety of NSC, would benefit enormously by a period of your silence. But mostly you. It can't be easy.....

 

[The Clamp]

I momentarily unblocked you to see if you have begun to talk sense.

Nope. Not even in English.

Don't put yourself through this humiliation. This is like a 'look at the inside of my pants' competition. I think that you, and the entirety of NSC, would benefit enormously by a period of your silence. But mostly you. It can't be easy.....

 

[dingodan]

I never said that. I said the brexit party are racist and people who support those racist views are racist. Some people who voted brexit party will have been duped into supporting racism without themselves being rasict.

Which Brexit Party candidates are you referring to exactly? What have any of them said or done for you to accuse them of racism? That's a pretty serious charge.

There were some very controversial UKIP candidates, they certainly had some poor quality candidates, but the calibre of Brexit Party candidates are a different kettle of fish. The Brexit Party is a very different animal to UKIP. It would be a grave mistake to assume that The Brexit Party will simply have the same success in a General Election as UKIP did.

 

[dingodan]

I refer you to Nigel Farage.

Yeah you don't like him. I get that. You say he's racist, you point to a poster about immigration numbers, Ok you say it's a racist poster, I don't agree. The fact is, if he was accepted as being a racist, and that was clear, he wouldn't even be allowed to have a twitter account these days, let alone be allowed to run a political party and be given a platform by every media outlet around. The fact is you have no real basis for calling him a racist.

But you said that the Party was racist. Was that based only on your views on Nigel Farage, which doesn't seem to be a view shared by many other people at all?

Like I said, the Brexit Party are not UKIP. If you are assuming that they are then I think you are going to be in for a surprise in the event of a Brexit triggered General Election.

 

[LlcoolJ]

Which Brexit Party candidates are you referring to exactly? What have any of them said or done for you to accuse them of racism? That's a pretty serious charge.

It's not controversial to say that Nigel Farage is a racist. Because he is a racist.

 

[dingodan]

It's not controversial to say that Nigel Farage is a racist. Because he is a racist.

Calling Nigel Farage a racist is like calling Jeremy Corbyn an anti-semite.

It's easy to do, but it's cheap, it's done for political reasons, and it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.

 

[LlcoolJ]

Calling Nigel Farage a racist is like calling Jeremy Corbyn an anti-semite.

It's easy to do, but it's cheap, it's done for political reasons, and it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.

Yes it does. Because he's a racist.

 

[Gwylan]

(from the other thread)

Here's how I see where we are.

Assuming we end up with a WTO exit PM, there will only be one way to prevent it, and that would be for Conservative MP's who oppose that to vote against the Government in a no confidence vote. Those MP's will lose their seats.

That's a bold statement. First of all, there'll be MPs like Grieve who won't be standing again and who have nothing to lose. Then, there are quite a few like Mid-Sussex and Lewes that voted Remain - I can certainly see Soames voting against the government. Next, there those MPs who have a solid personal following and can do what they like - Ken Clarke springs to mind. Finally, there are some MPs who think that a no deal Brexit would be such a disaster that they, in all conscience, couldn't vote for it.

EDIT: One more thing: if Johnson were PM, there could be Tories who vote against him simply because they hate his guts

Just a reminder: it would take just six Tory MPs to vote against the government to defeat it (assuming that just three Labour vote for the government and no other opposition MP votes against it).

I wouldn't like to be a PM gambling that Tories won't vote the government down - those don't like good odds to me. There'd be an inner Clint Eastwood asking "Do I feel lucky?"

 

[The Clamp]

Calling Nigel Farage a racist is like calling Jeremy Corbyn an anti-semite.

It's easy to do, but it's cheap, it's done for political reasons, and it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.

He agrees it’s fine to call a Chinese takeaway a chinky.
He said you wouldn’t want Romanians living next door to you.
He used to go around town in his CCF uniform singing Nazi songs.
He lies about immigration.
He said hearing foreign languages on a bus is scary.
He claims foreigners block motorways with their sheer numbers.
He’s a racist.

You can disagree all you like. It’s not a matter of opinion. He’s a racist.

 

[sydney]

You could have posted the link or reference which would have been helpful to your argument.

helpful...?? what's that...??

 

[dingodan]

That's a bold statement. First of all, there'll be MPs like Grieve who won't be standing again and who have nothing to lose. Then, there are quite a few like Mid-Sussex and Lewes that voted Remain - I can certainly see Soames voting against the government. Next, there those MPs who have a solid personal following and can do what they like - Ken Clarke springs to mind. Finally, there are some MPs who think that a no deal Brexit would be such a disaster that they, in all conscience, couldn't vote for it.

EDIT: One more thing: if Johnson were PM, there could be Tories who vote against him simply because they hate his guts

Just a reminder: it would take just six Tory MPs to vote against the government to defeat it (assuming that just three Labour vote for the government and no other opposition MP votes against it).

I wouldn't like to be a PM gambling that Tories won't vote the government down - those don't like good odds to me. There'd be an inner Clint Eastwood asking "Do I feel lucky?"

You are right to a point. But no doubt they will also be aware of how the numbers play out. They can stop a WTO Brexit. But the cost may be getting a WTO Brexit anyway, and destroying the Conservative Party. Their choice may actually end up being between having extra shit in their shit sandwich or not.

 

[sydney]

I googled Pope visits Britain, 125,000 attendance in Edinburgh for a Parade on the 16th September 2010, closing major streets in the City, and 65,000 attended a Mass in Glasgow, but apparently Susan Boyle was performing there too, so maybe they came for the singing more than the praying.

The Pope went on to have meetings with the Prime minister, deputy Prime minister, ride from Lambeth to Westminster in the Pope Mobile, referenced the sexual abuse of children by Catholic Priests at a mass in Westminster, held a vigil in Hyde Park with 80,000 attending.

The final day of the Pope's visit saw the Pope fly by helicopter from London to Birmingham for the main event of his visit, the beatification of Cardinal John Henry Newman in Cofton Park in Birmingham. Local residents were required to carry vehicle passes as well as to carry proof of identity in order to leave their own homes, but only 55,000 people were at this mass, not 130,000.

Only cost £10 million of tax payers money (excluding policing costs)

yes , well, the pope is head of the christian/catholic church and Britain is still , currently a christian nation........currently....i will put vids up later , going to work now.

 

[portlock seagull]

I just don't buy the church / monarchy / Britain / nation states ceasing to exist part of it. There's no doubt multi-cultralism is here in certain areas so that's the one point I didn't mention in my reply. But it is only in certain areas / cities. Brighton is quite diverse but more in the way that you are accepted if you are a gay couple with kids or you want to spend your weekends doing cosplay or reading James Joyce books dressed in leather chaps. Ethnically it isn't at all.

I work on sites around the UK quite a lot and you soon get to see how "diverse" places are. I've regularly stayed in Birmingham and one thing I'll agree with 2p on is that is is certainly ethincally diverse. The area around New St where the office was would be unrecognisable from 50 years ago to many and that's before we hit the suburbs and the council estates. I also work in Lytham in Lancs which is probably 99% white, middle class and over 40. There isn't a single Eastern European in the hotel I stay in there - they're all English and have been there for years (and they all know my name and what I drink). And Edinburgh (in Scotland, which 2p hilariously tried to claim had former EU residents in the majority!) where, actually, the hotel I stay in had a mix of Scots and foreign staff but the office I go to is, again, dominated by White British Scots. So revolution? No. I can certainly see racial tension in places like Birmingham but don't expect the citizens of Brighton, Lytham and Edinburgh to join in.

If anything Brexit is strongest in white dominated areas that are poorer than any of the places named above. Skegness. Barnsley. The Meday. And therefore your "revolution" of a sort is really down to the age old issue of not having any cash, nor any hope of getting any.

Head office is London though which is one of the most multi-cultral places on earth and voted Remain, and has just returned Liberals and Greens almost across the board. ACTUAL multi-cultralism doesn't seem to scare the natives much at all.

The last census (2011) for England & Wales is hard to believe living in and around London I.e. 85% of population identifies as White British, when I’d say it’s the polar opposite or more even in much of the capital and surrounding areas. That said, a lots happened in the past 8 years. And there’s an estimated 1 million illegals in the UK who by definition aren’t British never mind White!! Regardless, one things for sure. Our population, and others, will continue to diversify at an accelerating rate which could see National states as we currently know them dissolve into geographically smaller but more powerful metropolises instead. Interesting times as someone once said!

 

[Gwylan]

You are right to a point. But no doubt they will also be aware of how the numbers play out. They can stop a WTO Brexit. But the cost may be getting a WTO Brexit anyway, and destroying the Conservative Party. Their choice may actually end up being between having extra shit in their shit sandwich or not.

There are two different things here. If they stop a WTO Brexit, then the chances of a WTO Brexit diminish. There are two ways in which it could happen: either a 2nd referendum where that's a choice or a general election. As I said, it would be a huge gamble by the Tories to go an election - the last opinion poll I saw had Labour comfortably in the lead - would they risk it?

Would bringing down the government destroy the Tory party? Quite possibly and that would a big call for a rebel MP. But if we go to a WTO Brexit and it's a big a disaster as economists say it will be (and even Farage and Rees-Mogg have said that there'll be a massive hit), it could destroy the party anyway.

What a choice to have to make.

 

[Sussex Nomad]

I momentarily unblocked you to see if you have begun to talk sense.

Nope. Not even in English.

Don't put yourself through this humiliation. This is like a 'look at the inside of my pants' competition. I think that you, and the entirety of NSC, would benefit enormously by a period of your silence. But mostly you. It can't be easy.....

What an utter contempt for a human being you are.

 

[The Clamp]

What an utter contempt for a human being you are.

You have got to be a spoof account. “contempt for a human being”. You’re good. Nice work.

 

[Sussex Nomad]

You have got to be a spoof account. “contempt for a human being”. You’re good. Nice work.

Find your person, pick up their posts, abuse them in the simplest way you can, nice work. Two days in a row now.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

It you stand for, represent, vote for or join a racist party you are a rasict. Simple as that.

You are manipulating what I say and lying again. Voted pro- or anti- recut does not make you racist. Voting for and supporting a party with a racist leader does. That is all.

I never said that. I said the brexit party are racist and people who support those racist views are racist. Some people who voted brexit party will have been duped into supporting racism without themselves being rasict.

And yet you did say it ( I've highlighted above where you said it because I know you struggle remembering what you've typed in your rage ). At least we have proof for me to be able to truthly call you a liar. Calling people racist is a very dangerous game Plooks - stop it now. Invite is still open as I note you've neither accepted or rejected it.

 

[nicko31]

Corbyn inching towards a second referendum, not fully there yet. Probably holding off till the Tories choose their leader

 

[The Clamp]

London falls from top financial spot as Brexit bites.


https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/news...behind-new-york-as-top-financial-hub-11729892

Brexit to cause more damage to our steel industry

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....-economy-industry-damage-uk-a8931071.html?amp