Black managers

[pottert]

I have just watched a debate on the footballers football show about the lack of black managers.Very interesting to hear Keith curle say that he was the only mixed race member on a pro licence course out of 26.
Football in England may have many faults but rasism is not one of them.The majority of clubs in the premier league are owned by foreigners & have a high quantity of foreign players playing for them.
The problem is that football is very tribal & fans will say anything to insult a rival player.A player they insult playing for their club one day will be supported playing for their country another day.

It's not an exact science but the majority of managers in England are either ex players that have played for a certain club or ex players that have played at the highest level either home or abroad.
If a club is willing to invest millions of pounds to buy a black player why would they not invest the same for a black manager.

 

[Ninja Elephant]

You could look at the 1 in 26 statistic one of two ways. You could say that not enough is being done to encourage black or mixed race people to take up coaching, or you could look at it and suggest that maybe there isn't the interest. I'd say the truth is probably somewhere between the two.

 

[8ace]

A lot of managers are from Scotland and there aren't many black people there.

 

[pottert]

If a Swedish man dosent get the job (it's because he is not qualified)
If a African man dosent get the job (it's because he is black)

 

[Leekbrookgull]

If a Swedish man dosent get the job (it's because he is not qualified)
If a African man dosent get the job (it's because he is black)

Oh dear,The Thought Police are after you !

 

[GingerBeerMan]

I don't understand your logic. They buy players if they are good enough regardless of skin colour, and the same applies to managers. The reality is that there just aren't enough black managers who are good enough in the game.

In regards to this debate, it's worth considering that black people are statistically less academic outside of football too. This is probably cultural, but it's not the kind of thing you are allowed to discuss because you will be called a racist.

More black people in gangs. Or is that just going totally off the point with zero evidence?

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

If a Swedish man dosent get the job (it's because he is not qualified)
If a African man dosent get the job (it's because he is black)

No. If a black man doesn't get a job even if he is consistently as qualified and is as impressive as the others at an interview, it's not because he's black, but because of the attitudes and behaviour of others.

 

[Beach Hut]

Could always adopt the NFL rule where for any Head Coach vacancy you have to include a black person to be interviewed.

 

[beorhthelm]

If a club is willing to invest millions of pounds to buy a black player why would they not invest the same for a black manager.

good question, and most of the answer is:

Very interesting to hear Keith curle say that he was the only mixed race member on a pro licence course out of 26.

this suggests there are few black or mixed race players interested in coaching. when there are as many non-white players in the class room but not in the coaching jobs, then we can talk about them not getting the oppurtunities.

 

[Garage_Doors]

Could always adopt the NFL rule where for any Head Coach vacancy you have to include a black person to be interviewed.

If all the all the applicant are black, do they have to include a white person?

 

[ali jenkins]

Its simple. If you look at the times that most current managers were players there was hardly any black players at that time. Where are all the black managers going to come from if its not ex-players?

Give it 20-30 years and there will be a much greater ratio of White to Black managers, much like there is on the pitch now.

 

[Deleted member 2719]

Did Keith Curle say that there was 26 managers on this course and there was no women, the guy is a knob just like Rio and anton all looking for self promotion. why the F*ck they always feel the need to stir it up i don't know, just get on and use your skills you were given and shut those big gobs up, maybe they just want to cause riots and unrest.

 

[Waynflete]

good question, and most of the answer is:


this suggests there are few black or mixed race players interested in coaching. when there are as many non-white players in the class room but not in the coaching jobs, then we can talk about them not getting the oppurtunities.

But more deeply, why aren't there more non-white players in the classroom? That would be a complex question potentially including that black players are put off management because of societal bias/prejudice. That is also part of whether they get opportunities, not just whether they're employed after they have their badges.

 

[Waynflete]

Its simple. If you look at the times that most current managers were players there was hardly any black players at that time. Where are all the black managers going to come from if its not ex-players?

Give it 20-30 years and there will be a much greater ratio of White to Black managers, much like there is on the pitch now.

I hope you're right, but on that basis I'd have thought there would be more black managers by now. A lot of the top managers are in their 40s (Lambert, Rodgers, Mancini, Dimatteo, Laudrup, McDermott, Hughes) so were playing in the 90s when there were plenty of black players. Hughton as a mixed race manager is a rarity, despite having played in an era that had many great black players.

 

[Silverhatch]

My son's just doing an assignment on the History of Slavery. I've learnt stuff I never knew (or didn't want to know). Explains a lot about institutionalised racism in Europe and America. Ask yourself a question, if your son or daughter said they were going to marry a black guy or girl, what would be your very first thought (before your rational mind kicked in). Then imagine the thought processes of older white guys running the football authorities and football clubs.

 

[Beach Hut]

If all the all the applicant are black, do they have to include a white person?

I very much doubt it

 

[Billy the Fish]

including that black players are put off management because of societal bias/prejudice.

I keep hearing people mention stuff like this, and I just can't buy into it. This country is now one of least racist and most diverse places on the planet. Racism in britain, especially towards black people, has gone the way of drink driving - it is considered to be socially unacceptable by the vast majority and gets stamped on.

Look at the reaction towards Edgar Davids coaching at Barnet, it is only positive because he's a millionaire footballer who wants to learn his trade as a coach - skin colour doesn't even come into it. The opportunities are there if people want to find them, and there is no social bias or predudice stopping them.

 

[Bold Seagull]

I keep hearing people mention stuff like this, and I just can't buy into it. This country is now one of least racist and most diverse places on the planet. Racism in britain, especially towards black people, has gone the way of drink driving - it is considered to be socially unacceptable by the vast majority and gets stamped on.

Look at the reaction towards Edgar Davids coaching at Barnet, it is only positive because he's a millionaire footballer who wants to learn his trade as a coach - skin colour doesn't even come into it. The opportunities are there if people want to find them, and there is no social bias or predudice stopping them.

I don't think anyone is actually proclaiming "Football is definitely still racist, there are no back managers", this is surely still just a question "why are there not more black managers?".

It's easy to jump to one side of the fence or another, but it is important to understand why don't you think, beyond simply people's opinion?

When you consider the diversity on the playing side for the past 3 decades or so, it is an anomaly that from the top through to non-league the management side represents a fraction of this representation.

Now whether this is cultural, discriminatory, or other factors is simply not clear. That it's being looked into is what society does, or at least should do. Perhaps the conclusion is as you say not to do with discrimination, but there is nothing wrong with finding out either way with proper research based evidence and not just conjecture and opinion.

 

[Waynflete]

I keep hearing people mention stuff like this, and I just can't buy into it. This country is now one of least racist and most diverse places on the planet. Racism in britain, especially towards black people, has gone the way of drink driving - it is considered to be socially unacceptable by the vast majority and gets stamped on.

Look at the reaction towards Edgar Davids coaching at Barnet, it is only positive because he's a millionaire footballer who wants to learn his trade as a coach - skin colour doesn't even come into it. The opportunities are there if people want to find them, and there is no social bias or predudice stopping them.

It's not as simple as overt racism and discrimination though is it? It's about an engrained social structure that still contains inequality, with some groups having less access to good education, more likely to live in sh!tty areas, being put off prestigious careers etc. It's obviously extremely complex, but it adds up to a situation where some minorities are less likely to get into positions of authority (including football management).

Not just minorities either, by the way. Women are still paid less for doing the same jobs as men, and there is an extraordinary lack of women in top positions across business, politics etc. That's not about overt sexism, but about a system that is not well-set-up to allow women to succeed.

 

[Billy the Fish]

When you consider the diversity on the playing side for the past 3 decades or so, it is an anomaly that from the top through to non-league the management side represents a fraction of this representation.

Now whether this is cultural, discriminatory, or other factors is simply not clear. That it's being looked into is what society does, or at least should do. Perhaps the conclusion is as you say not to do with discrimination, but there is nothing wrong with finding out either way with proper research based evidence and not just conjecture and opinion.

Agree with what you say.

I see it as a statistical anomoly, nothing more nothing less. It will iron itself out over the next couple of decades.

You could ask the same question as to why there are so few english managers at the top level, but nobody goes on about it because it's a less obvious anomoly and obviously doesn't have the undercurrent of racism in society as a driving force behind it.