Bio Fuel, is it really as Green as we think ?

[bhaexpress]

I see that Americans are being encouraged to start being more ecology conscious. In recent weeks California Govenor Arnold Schwarzenegger has decided to drive around in a (large) vehicle fueled by Bio diesel and also Sheryl Crowe has been touring the US in a tour bus powered by the same fuel.

The thing is this though. Bio diesel is from discarded vegetable oil. Now, in order to have a sufficient supply of waste oil people are going to have to eat even more fried food. This means the consumption of more burgers and fries. This in turn means more meat. From there farmers in South America will have to cut down even more Amazon rain forest to allow for extra grazing land for the higher demand for beef.

Doesn't that slightly defeat the object of the exercise ?

 

[Trufflehound]

Most biodiesel is made from specially-planted fuel crops. These are considered carbon-neutral as although they emit CO2 when burned, they have already absorbed the same amount of CO2 when growing.

How green they are depends on what was in your field before you planted the crop. If you're getting rid of a field of methane-producing cattle to plant rapeseed, that is good. If you chop down rainforest to grow oil palms, that is bad...

 

[rool]

There is also a company over here, the carberry group, who make yoghurts and dairy stuff who now also make biofuel from the by products of that industry.

I think one major concern is that the growing of crops specifically for bio fuels will push up the price of same crops that are used for food. Not sure how that works or whether it's just scare mongering from the petro chemical industries.

 

[Ozymandias]

The thing is this though. Bio diesel is from discarded vegetable oil. Now, in order to have a sufficient supply of waste oil people are going to have to eat even more fried food. This means the consumption of more burgers and fries. This in turn means more meat. From there farmers in South America will have to cut down even more Amazon rain forest to allow for extra grazing land for the higher demand for beef.

Doesn't that slightly defeat the object of the exercise ?

No, one big problem with vegetable oil is how do you dispose of it, using it as bio fuel is as good as it get's.

 

[bhaexpress]

Actually I just thought it was a bit ironic that Arnie has jumped on the Green band wagon. The vehicle he'll be using is reputedly a Bio fueled HumVee. Still, I guess it's good news for MacDonalds.

 

[Stinkers Bridge]

I'm not sure what colour Biofuel actually is.

 

[Monkster]

If you chop down rainforest to grow oil palms, that is bad...

Which is exactly the problem they have in largest biofuel consuming & growing country....Brazil

 

[NMH]

The enemies of Bio-fuel might be 'Big Oil', aka the oil industry itself, from G.Bush's Texas mates, right through to the Bin-Ladens and Amir and all those other loveable A-rabs we love to throw our dosh at.

I doubt they could dream up some convoluted, but short and easily understandable premise with which to fight bio-fuel production and sales - naaahhh!

Oh, but here's one;
"The thing is this though. Bio diesel is from discarded vegetable oil. Now, in order to have a sufficient supply of waste oil people are going to have to eat even more fried food. This means the consumption of more burgers and fries. This in turn means more meat. From there farmers in South America will have to cut down even more Amazon rain forest to allow for extra grazing land for the higher demand for beef.

Doesn't that slightly defeat the object of the exercise ?"

That works for me, I'm off to buy a 4wd 8cyl tank, to keep those nice men in business!

 

[NMH]

Incidentally, you diesel car drivers might do well to find out how much rapeseed-oil you can mix in to your tank with the station-sold diesel. I hear it works out quite a lot cheaper, and can be easily done at every fill you make.

The hundreds of ££ that can be saved, might cover an Albion Season ticket...... or something

 

[Muzzman]

I still think that some bright spark has already invented an engine that can run on sea water, but obviously the patent has been bought by one of the big oil producing companies to prevent this engine ever being built..

*conspiracy theory*

 

[Monkster]

I still think that some bright spark has already invented an engine that can run on sea water, but obviously the patent has been bought by one of the big oil producing companies to prevent this engine ever being built..

*conspiracy theory*

Ben Elton's "Gridlock"

 

[Silent Bob]

If you chop down rainforest to grow oil palms, that is bad...

Especially if you then ship it round the world on vehicles not run by biofuel.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

No way near as green as is being said - and a big worry as it will clearly take off big-time. Whilst we use rape-seed oil over here, it cannot meet anywhere near the expected capacity. The major crop for producing bio-fuel is oil palm. 2 million hectares of primary rainforest is in the process of being cleared in southern Borneo for this, as well as huge areas in the rest of Borneo and Sumatra. Say bye-bye to the orangutan, sumatran tiger and more. Whilst there is plenty of land already cleared that could be used for this purpose, the oil palm companies prefer forested land as they can sell the timber and finance their early operations from this revenue - it takes 10-20 years to produce a sustainable crop from a newly-planted oil palm plantation.

Meanwhile in Uganda, a country with a pretty-decent track record in conservation post-Idi Amin, they have in the last year degazetted 20 virgin-forest reserves and production-forest reserves in order to grow oil palm. These include the Budongo forest, which has the largest population of chimps remaining - all that footage of chimps hunting colobus comes from here.

Over in Vietnam, what is left of the forest from the war is being replaced by sugar cane and other low-intensity crops - all for biofuels. Its pretty easy to see a world not to far in the future that is one big plantation, 'growing oil' for our cars. And this is supposed to be green?

Happy days.

 

[NMH]

I still think that some bright spark has already invented an engine that can run on sea water, but obviously the patent has been bought by one of the big oil producing companies to prevent this engine ever being built..

*conspiracy theory*

There are loads of these sorts of rumours, based on nonsense. Of course cars can run on water..... and mix in a little horse manure and cow farts, space dust from the planet Zbjshd, and uranium juices.

The hybrid cars that are coming onto the market now (petrol and electric combination) are a better idea, and at least a step in the right direction.

 

[Trufflehound]

The hybrid cars that are coming onto the market now (petrol and electric combination) are a better idea, and at least a step in the right direction.

If you start getting into hybrids you have to look at the bigger picture.

The battery in one of the top hybrids, the Toyota Prius, contains nickel that is mined in Sudbury, Ontario. Pollution from that mine has turned the surrounding area into a moonscape, and is widely regarded by environmental lobbyists as among the biggest environmental catastrophes in North America