90% of schools on strike 30th Nov..

[seagull_special]

Your children's education is in the hands of teachers, it is in your interest that the best people apply to be teachers and for that to happen, the job must be engaging stimulating and well rewarded. Teachers do get reasonably paid, with great holiday times but work extremely hard and are dedicated and have the interest of future generations at heart. I don't think anybody has ever gone into teaching for financial gain! and to hear people harping on about how easy teachers have it, shows how ignorant some people are of the job demands. There is a risk that the UK will be left behind in education standards as China and India make massive investment in education and strive for outstanding results whilst teachers in the UK have to deal with poorly disciplined kids, ignorant parents, excessive red tape and a government who hold teachers in contempt and brand them all as money grasping parasites. The respect for teachers has been eroded and this can only be a bad thing.

 

[bluenitsuj]

You are assuming all teachers both agreed with the strike and went on strike. This is not true.

Sorry, I am aware of that, did not make it clear in my rant. Corrected

 

[DJ Leon]

As per others on this thread I totally diagree with the OP, however what really interests me is this prevailing desire to see people do badly. My view, for what it's worth, is that a teacher is not paid enough unless they are on at LEAST £45k a year. Who cares if it's better than other people in the private sector? Their worth to society is surely higher than almost all people in the private sector. In fact, what is salary enough for people like the OP to accept a teacher's complaint? Presumably it's well under 15k, somewhere on a par with a shelf stacker at Tesco's?

All of this petty and jealous arguing about whether public sectors salaries and pensions are too generous is a deflection from putting scrutiny on our bankers, business leaders and politicians who created this mess in the first place. Remember this - our government wants to make sure that our teachers and nurses are not given a pay rise or the pensions they've been promised, but they're happy that the same bankers whose arrogance and recklessness caused this problem are able to be disproportionately rewarded for the actual good they have done overall. They also insist that teachers and nurses are the kind of people who must 'face reality' and 'tighten their belts' but they have no intention of making the wealthy of this country (personally or via their businesses) pay the same taxes that our nurses and teachers pay. And this is leaking BILLIONS from our economy. The government have decided on their priority so answer only this, regardless of how much a teacher is paid - WHOSE SIDE ARE YOU ON?

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

You are assuming all teachers both agreed with the strike and went on strike. This is not true.

My daughter's school has not closed today, although the teachers agree with the strike they've decided to work. Personally I wish they had gone out on strike, its very justified.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

Not everyone who works in the education service is a teacher. There are plenty of low-paid staff who work to a term-time only contract. This isn't ten weeks paid holiday. It's ten weeks of guaranteed unemployment.

 

[Guinness Boy]

My son has just started infant school. His teachers (yes plural, more of which in a minute) are wonderful and he is superbly looked after. In just a term he has progressed so far in Maths that they have given him additional challenges while he is now starting to read simple words too. I have gone in to the school during book week to read a story to the children and the way the teachers control a class of 4 and 5 year olds is amazing. All in all I'm a big fan of the school. The aforementioned teachers job share. I cannot imagine that working part time in an infants school with the prices in our City is exactly lucrative.

They are on strike today and given all the above they do NOT have one iota of my support. Odd you say given the gushing praise above? Not really. Strikes are for when you are about to lose your livelihood. For when serious pay and job cuts are threatened. For when your working conditions are about to change so amazingly that you might as well have a new (worse) job. They should not be about protecting pensions that the country cannot afford, particularly when the credit crisis also junked the private, non final-salary pensions of everyone in the private sector. My pension and everyone who does not have a final salary scheme is worth shit but no-one is striking over that. They're just getting on with it.

There's a country where, until recently, you could retire suitably early on a massive pension after a (short) life of teaching. It's called Greece

 

[Titanic]

...They are on strike today and given all the above they do NOT have one iota of my support. Odd you say given the gushing praise above? Not really. Strikes are for when you are about to lose your livelihood. For when serious pay and job cuts are threatened. For when your working conditions are about to change so amazingly that you might as well have a new (worse) job. They should not be about protecting pensions that the country cannot afford, particularly when the credit crisis also junked the private, non final-salary pensions of everyone in the private sector. My pension and everyone who does not have a final salary scheme is worth shit but no-one is striking over that. They're just getting on with it...

Cue "race to the bottom" platitudes.

 

[spongy]

I don't agree with the strikes.

Times are hard for a lot of people.

I'm 33 and haven't started a pension yet, I can't afford to as I don't earn a lot.

The company I work for doesn't have a pension scheme as we're only a small engineering firm.

Last year for 5 months we had to drop to a 3 day week to keep the company afloat and in turn to keep our jobs. Everyone took it on the chin and now we're back to 5 days but more importantly we're still working.

This country simply cannot afford to pay these pensions as it stands, things have to change and so do peoples attitudes. It seems to me that they're being selfish, its all me me me and why I should I work just as hard to have a smaller pension?

There are some in the world who are struggling like hell who don't even have the chance to have a say in these things, yes, I don't like it and my situation is really pissing me off, but I'm had to suck it up and deal with it.

I think they should do the same.

This is only my opinion and no doubt a lot of people will slate me for it but this a discussion forum and I'm entitled to my say on it.

 

[ATFC Seagull]

Teachers are not badly paid. They start at about £22k outside London and £27k inside London with a fair amount of lee-way in between. That's STARTING pay and is pretty near or over the average working man's salary. Add on top of that a generous pension scheme and 10 weeks holiday a year and whatever the rights or wrongs of this strike involve - that is not a bad whack.

Here's the scales: Qualified teachers' pay scales from September 2011 - Career - TES

There is no "lee-way" in between - a teacher in Brighton earns the same as one in Motherwell or Middlesbrough. It is not a terrible deal and teachers aren't starving, although it is considerably less than most graduate schemes. Equally, in this climate it is not enough to cover living costs and save up for a deposit on a house (I know, lots of people in the country are in the same position). However, don't forget to minus the minimum 4 years worth of student debt that every teacher has by rule to have accumulated - which wipes out at the very least a good percentage of the month pay check, not to mention overdrafts etc. As for the 11 weeks holiday, its lovely not having to get up at the alarm, but it's not quite as it sounds - a huge whack of this would be basically "in lieu" for the hours accumulated through "unpaid" hours put in during term time, and a lot of work needs doing in these periods. A very very minor point as well, but this time off is completely inflexible - no chance are you having a Friday off for a mate's wedding, or a few days off to join a stag weekend, or a half day to go to a football match etc etc.

It's a cracking, rewarding job, and the minutes of the day fly past, BUT with results, government initiatives and more bosses than any job I can think of, not to mention parents (I teach 300 kids, that's 600 bosses who can demand results at any stage), I genuinely can't think of many jobs that are more demanding and stressful at times.

As you rightly point out, this is all mostly irrelevant to today's strike - but I think its important to dispel this myth that we have an absolutely fantastic lifestyle with an amazing salary and benefits.

 

[Peteinblack]

I always wonder why people who sneer that being a teacher is a 'cushy' job don't apply to become teachers themselves?

 

[Uncle C]

Three men died on Christmas Eve and were met by Saint Peter at the pearly gates.

'In honor of this holy season' Saint Peter said, 'You must each possess something that symbolizes Christmas to get into heaven.'

The man from Nova Scotia fumbled through his pockets and pulled out a lighter. He flicked it on. 'It represents a candle', he said.

'You may pass through the pearly gates' Saint Peter said.

The man from Saskatchewan reached into his pocket and pulled out a set of keys. He shook them and said, 'They're bells.'

Saint Peter said 'You may pass through the pearly gates'.

The Newfoundlander started searching desperately through his pockets and finally pulled out a pair of women's panties.

St. Peter looked at the man with a raised eyebrow and asked, 'And just what do those symbolize?'


The Newfie replied, 'These are Carols.'

 

[Peteinblack]

As per others on this thread I totally diagree with the OP, however what really interests me is this prevailing desire to see people do badly. My view, for what it's worth, is that a teacher is not paid enough unless they are on at LEAST £45k a year. Who cares if it's better than other people in the private sector? Their worth to society is surely higher than almost all people in the private sector. In fact, what is salary enough for people like the OP to accept a teacher's complaint? Presumably it's well under 15k, somewhere on a par with a shelf stacker at Tesco's?

All of this petty and jealous arguing about whether public sectors salaries and pensions are too generous is a deflection from putting scrutiny on our bankers, business leaders and politicians who created this mess in the first place. Remember this - our government wants to make sure that our teachers and nurses are not given a pay rise or the pensions they've been promised, but they're happy that the same bankers whose arrogance and recklessness caused this problem are able to be disproportionately rewarded for the actual good they have done overall. They also insist that teachers and nurses are the kind of people who must 'face reality' and 'tighten their belts' but they have no intention of making the wealthy of this country (personally or via their businesses) pay the same taxes that our nurses and teachers pay. And this is leaking BILLIONS from our economy. The government have decided on their priority so answer only this, regardless of how much a teacher is paid - WHOSE SIDE ARE YOU ON?

Superb Post. Totally agree.

As always, the Tories are promoting 'divide and rule' among ordinary people to divert attention from the obscene salaries being paid in 'the City' and many company boardrooms. If we can't afford decent pensions for ordinary people - public AND private workers sector alike - then how can we have a situation where pay at the top increased by 49% last year, and those on the highest salaries now earn an average of 100 times more than those at the bottom.

You won't solve the scandal of low (or no) private sector pensions by attacking public sector pensions.