[Football] Why fewer bums on seats at PL games?

[Weststander]

Sad to see so many consistently empty seats, even several vacant rows. However, I have some sympathy and agree there are a number of factors at play:

- Covid concerns, not just at The Amex but especially on public transport. A very real consideration for those who travel some distance. Train is our preferred mode but the combination of covid (during a 350 mile / 6 hour round trip) and general unreliability of trains now unfortunately makes car travel our first choice.

- Even taking the car is fraught with risk - M25, Insulation protests etc

- Changes to KO times are becoming a pain, particularly where this snookers pubic transport options.

- Therefore the Boxing Day KO time seems a complete piss-take

- Parking issues for some STHs with mobility issues in our group who lost their traditional spaces at the Uni. Now partly resolved but a real issue earlier this season

- The ticket sharing policy & additional fee

- Ticket exchange process

- escalating fuel costs

- catering not always value for money

These are issues that seem to rumble around our group, contributing to a growing view that (sadly) the football is becoming more of a faff and question whether they will bother with an ST in future. The sad thing is these are proper fans whose mojo is being eroded.

- I also question the flat atmosphere inside the Amex, something us fans need to address. The pre-match build up often seems a bit tame, not helped by a barely audible PA system

Finally, we do seem to have been unlucky with some shitty weather for home games. which must deter some families and less hardy types.

We'll still do the hard yards because for 90+ minutes among all of the above there is mostly some very decent football to be savoured and a team that needs our support.

I do suspect that if the Albion were banging in the goals to go with the progressive football then these 'issues' might recede in people's thoughts and actual attendances & atmospheres would be greater... far better to be singing the roof off the place than venting frustrations via a few meek boos.

I call it being punch drunk with 4.3 seasons of rarely winning at home, so often finding it hard to score a brace.

Numbs the experience for those who go just for the football.

 

[faoileán]

I endorse much of what has been said, but personally speaking I say that the gaps are due to:

1. the pain in the backside of transferring tickets. I agree that a lot of season tickets will not be renewed next year because of this.
2. 95% of fans refusing to abide by Covid protocols and the club ignoring it

 

[raymondo]

It is all of the above, include into that mix a general apathy about everything. nearly two years out of normality brings with it a certain "I can't be bothered". I feel like this about going anywhere, I can't be bothered with the crowds of folks downtown for shopping or going to the pub or a gig, Maybe it is an age thing, but we have just cancelled our flights to America for this Christmas due to the quarantine rules changing and not being able to take time off work and school when we were due back, just feel like giving up. Also is it just me, but we don't know what to get people for this Christmas, you used to see friends and family more before the pandemic and get ideas through normal conversations, now they don't happen, The Pandemic has sucked the fun out of life, football included.

It's us as well re Christmas. It feels less special for us this year (even our 12 year old is feeling the vibe). For us, it's a combination of:
- covid e.g our son constantly has 2 or 3 kids in his tutor group off with covid, which means being very careful with our car sharing to and from school - who plays with who etc; and I'm really struggling to get him his jab ( he's recently turned 12) with school group jabs having stopped and little helpful info from the NHS in our area. It remains on the to-do list.
- and Climate change/environmental issues. We've never been wasteful, recycle as much as we can, I even reuse Xmas paper from last year (humbug),bring up our two kids to do the same (well, we try, and they're not bad), but the focus on climate has made us think even more deeply. What's the point of recycling carefully if we're still going to buy Xmas crackers (mainly crap), and those little fun presents often made of plastic, and extra clothes that we frankly don't need etc (unless we turn off the heating to help of course...)... ?? The one thing our son does need (and wants) is a decent computer for his school homework (my priority) and his gaming fun(his priority), so we'll buy him that in the Spring (not tied to a mad rush for Xmas) using the £ presents he's had in prior years plus our donation. Christmas presents for all of us will be very light on the ground, and we'll try to refocus the family on a lovely Christmas lunch, a walk, some movie time together, and away from 3 hours spent opening presents, debating them, and immediately recycling loads of cardboard and unusable paper..
We'll give it a go anyway - wish us luck!

 

[Joe 90]

Really can't be bothered anymore, everything is a hassle. Just watch some old clips of a bouncing terrace and tell me modern football is even a patch on what it used to be. Sick of the politics as well TBH, make of that what you wish.

 

[chaileyjem]

Yes. But no one swallows that it is about security do they.

Regardless of whether its inconvenient (it is- i used to like bringing a flask), very very low risk (i think it is but i'm not privy to police briefings), then the idea of it being introduced to sell a few more cups of tea is quite the stretch ,

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Regardless of whether its inconvenient (it is- i used to like bringing a flask), very very low risk (i think it is but i'm not privy to police briefings), then the idea of it being introduced to sell a few more cups of tea is quite the stretch ,

I agree. It is an added benefit though and incurs cost on the little guy. For no good reason.

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk

 

[Danny Wilson Said]

I agree with people who say that everything has become too difficult. Difficult kick-off times, difficult travel - I counted three people wearing masks in my train back from the Leeds game), difficulty in lending season tickets to friends and family, difficulties with parking.

And, it has to be said, frustrating football - fantastic but too often impotent. All that effort to get there and then we don't get the results that we deserve.

I am fully aware that we have a brilliant team playing at a brilliant ground in the self-styled Best League In The World and that I would gladly have said I would put up with all the above if offered it while traipsing to Gillingham. But it does wear you down a bit.

 

[luge]

Speaking form personal experience....

Work keeps me off alot of games, and with a fair amount of foreign travel coming up i may skip a few more games to avoid risk of catching covid (not because i am scared of having it. but it would stop me working).

Times. I have a young family, hardly any 3pm kick offs. Night games used to be great but they go over bedtime now.

Generally i have found less of an interest in football etc post pandemic. I still go, i still love a good game - but i think i was saturated with it during the pandemic....

Amount of games - same as above really. Plenty of periods where there are three games in a row, which is just too many times to be away in a short space of time.

as for the villa reference in the OP - i have some villa mates and they were saying that tickets for shit seats were starting at 55 quid. They rekon they'd have sold em for 30.

 

[Superphil]

I have missed the four homes games so far this season, and will be missing Spurs, and the Boxing Day game because of the fixture time/date changes not fitting in with other prior commitments.

 

[Charlies Shinpad]

The answer should be "because it's fun".

I've always had the attitude of preferring to be there at the ground compared to watching on TV, even if it was free, but with reduced staff on the trains leading to cancellations and overcrowding, expensive tickets and rules for everything it's no surprise many can't be bothered. I hated lockdown football so I'm still liking being back but I can see why some don't.

I agree wholeheartedly.
I do prefer away games to home games now sadly.
Mind you home or away it's still a long trek either way for a lot of us on here

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[GT49er]

For various reasons I'm an armchair fan these days, but even if I wanted to start attending matches my answer would be, it's too bloody complicated. Registering, membership, booking in advance, tickets on smart phones (I haven't got one) - it's just not the way I watched football (though these days I would be glad of the change to sitting rather than standing). Yes, I'm a dinosaur, OK - those of you who've got used to 21st. century football ticketing and admission to the ground, well done you.
But what I would ask, out of interest, is this: are other clubs as obsessed as PB is about ticket sharing, membership, loyalty points, not opening the ticket exchange unless they absolutely have to, the need to have the life history of the occupant of every seat (well, maybe not quite, but you know what I mean) - not to mention the hunt for illegal bottle tops - or are they just more relaxed, and dare I say, normal about letting people just buy or borrow a ticket and come in?
I appreciate Covid has added difficulties, but the things I mention above are not Covid related obstacles.

 

[chaileyjem]

I've missed one home game this season due to having Covid. First one I missed in several years.
My son has a season ticket but went to university in September. Since then my other son has had his ticket via the sharing scheme - apart from Leeds when he went on holiday.
My other son hasn't missed a game with his ticket.
Partly because i missed football and partly because my youngest son will soon also be going to university (next year). I've been to nearly all the away games this season with him bar Liverpool and Burnley.

My Dad though has a season ticket and sits with us but has missed all the home games this season except Everton due to not being 100% (he's 84). He hasn't shared his ticket with anyone because he often makes the decision not to go at very short notice and because its a bit of a faff (see other posts).

 

[dazzer6666]

Yes. But no one swallows that it is about security do they.

There is a reason the phrase 'comparisons are odious' has remained in our language for a long time and it plays out well here. Telling someone that something they've enjoyed for donkeys years will not be okay (without good reason) due to this rule being enforced elsewhere is specious to say the least.

There would be many more effective ways to hurt people in a football crowd if terrorists wanted to, than making a fake flask of tea.

No one advocates banning cars from near large crowds leaving the match. Yet that would be highly effective in causing mortality. Flasks are banned as it is easy to do so and clubs can make a little more $$$ at the same time.


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Haven’t even been patted down or ‘screened’ with metal detectors the last couple of games, so claiming it’s security is patently bollocks………

 

[Uter]

Playing back the highlights of Saturday there are loads of blocks of empty seats at Saints, even more than I noticed on the day. Burnley always looks half empty on the telly. We are certainly seeing far fewer actual fans than our tickets sold. Even Villa where you couldn't see a spare seat for Stevie G's debut against us had a few blocks of noticeable empties on Sunday.

Why do we think this is? If data was collected on actual people at games instead of ticket sales it'd be a noticeable decline I reckon.

For Southampton this is a continuation of a trend over the past few seasons. Every season since 2016/17 they've lost a few hundred fans. 9 nil defeats probably don't help.

2016/17 30,936
2017/18 30,794
2018/19 30,139
2019/20 29,675
2021/22 28,996

Don't forget our capacity has increased a bit this season, so even if we we have the same number of supporters physically in attendance as last season, there will be more empty seats on show.

In general, I am not sure that PL attendances are noticeably worse than recent seasons. In fact, this season the average attendance is on course to be the highest ever for a top flight in the history of English football. Given that attendances normally rise towards the end of a season, we could see the average top 40,000 for the first time ever, COVID permitting.

I haven't noticed too many empty seats in most PL stadiums. Certainly not enough to say with any confidence that there are more than previous seasons.

Championship attendances seem to be well down on the last season not impacted by Covid, even after taking into account better supported teams being promoted/relegated. This is a little concerning given the precarious finances of many teams at that level. League One and Two crowds have held up well.


___18/19 21/22
PL 38168 39964
Ch 20181 16257
L1 8,741 9,704
L2 4,467 4,609

 

[chaileyjem]

For various reasons I'm an armchair fan these days, but even if I wanted to start attending matches my answer would be, it's too bloody complicated. Registering, membership, booking in advance, tickets on smart phones (I haven't got one) - it's just not the way I watched football (though these days I would be glad of the change to sitting rather than standing). Yes, I'm a dinosaur, OK - those of you who've got used to 21st. century football ticketing and admission to the ground, well done you.
But what I would ask, outof interest, is this: are other clubs as obsessed as PB is about ticket sharing, membership, loyalty points, not opening the ticket exchange unless they absolutely have to, the need to have the life history of the occupant of every seat (well, maybe not quite, but you know what I mean) - not to mention the hunt for illegal bottle tops - or are they just more relaxed, and dare I say, normal about letting people just buy or borrow a ticket and come in?
I appreciate Covid has added difficulties, but the things I mention above are not Covid related obstacles.

My Dad this season is also a "dinosaur" i guess but i managed to arrange a physical season ticket, and a paper Covid pass for him so he could attend matches without a phone etc And the club were very helpful sorting it. Several calls checking in with how it was going etc. And there are physical options (print off tickets) available for single tickets too (if thats what you want or need). I think nearly all games this season have gone to general sale. (Wolves and Brentford currently are - requiring no points or membership).

 

[chaileyjem]

Haven’t even been patted down or ‘screened’ with metal detectors the last couple of games, so claiming it’s security is patently bollocks………

The club do spot checks for Covid docs and screening i guess.
But do you really think its all a ruse to sell more tea ?
Why don't they just ban you from bringing in sweets or crisps or sandwiches etc if they wanted to make more ££ from the catering . Cinemas do.

 

[goldstonegull]

Used to go to all home games, and most away games from Plymouth, football was a massive part of my life, but when the pandemic hit and football was played behind closed doors I found I hardly missed it at all, and found other things to do. Although Brighton F.C. are still a huge part of my life, I do not miss the football or the journey. I can watch it on the telly most weekends anyway,

 

[dazzer6666]

The club do spot checks for Covid docs and screening i guess.
But do you really think its all a ruse to sell more tea ?
Why don't they just ban you from bringing in sweets or crisps or sandwiches etc if they wanted to make more ££ from the catering . Cinemas do.

I don’t think, and haven’t said, it’s a ruse to sell more tea - I just don’t think it’s ‘security’ (or if it is, it’s not an effective measure).

 

[GT49er]

My Dad this season is also a "dinosaur" i guess but i managed to arrange a physical season ticket, and a paper Covid pass for him so he could attend matches without a phone etc And the club were very helpful sorting it. Several calls checking in with how it was going etc. And there are physical options (print off tickets) available for single tickets too (if thats what you want or need). I think nearly all games this season have gone to general sale. (Wolves and Brentford currently are - requiring no points or membership).

Yes, I know there are paper options and all that - but one phrase in your post sums up the sea-change that has occerred in recent years, which regulars like yourself have grown used to and accept: "Several calls checking in with how it was going etc." - as if it was quite normal. In 50 years of watching football - not regularly, but when I got the chance - I don't think I ever once phoned a football club. Why would I?
I haven't been to a match since we were promoted (apart from the EFL Trophy at Forest Green), but up until then I regularly watched the Albion away when they were in reasonable driving or train-ride reach - Swindon, Bristol, Cheltenham, Birmingham, etc. - and never did anything except turn up and ask them nicely if I could buy a ticket and come in. Never ever turned away. The only time I'd ever had a booked ticket was Bristol City in our promotion year - my son-in-law in Bristol purchased the tickets in advance (and there's a story about that which would make PB's hair curl (which in itself is a pretty tall order!))

 

[chaileyjem]

I don’t think, and haven’t said, it’s a ruse to sell more tea - I just don’t think it’s ‘security’ (or if it is, it’s not an effective measure).

The club have insisted its for security reasons multiple times.
https://www.theargus.co.uk/news/16596721.albion-chief-executive-paul-barber-defends-flasks-ban-amex/

And Barber explained it in more length at the start of this season...

"Unsurprisingly, and in the interests of keeping players, officials and other supporters, particularly children, as safe and as secure as possible, hard metal (or hard plastic) glass-lined flasks (which can easily conceal any kind of substance, not just tea and coffee) are banned at many top flight football stadia up and down the country, as are glass or hard plastic bottles with lids (this is because bottles secured with lids travel farther, faster and have greater force on impact than those without)."
https://www.theargus.co.uk/news/19197928.paul-barber-responds-fan-season-ticket/