Why does the rest of football find the Brighton/Palace rivalry so bizarre?

[Vegas Seagull]

It is a totally unnatural rivalry...a South London club v a South Coast club.
It doesn't sit comfortably and we all know that it was artificially created in the mid seventies.
Up to that point Palace always clashed with Millwall. They were natural rivals..geographically close and generally, hated each other.
Brighton sat alone, 50 miles from the nearest league opposition. We couldn't hijack the Pompey/ Saints thing...too well established. We were a stand alone club, quietly going about our business, with a dolphin on our badge.
And thats how it probably would have stayed had the upwardly mobile careers of messrs Venables and Mullery not brought them into sharp conflict with each other.
Former teammates they desperately wanted to get one over each other and never hesitated in stirring things up and fanning the flames. The two sets of fans got sucked into it and hey presto, before you knew it, we hated each other.
We got a new rival, a new nickname and for the angry and aggressive young men of the 70's, a focus for their hate and violence.
Young Palace fans were only too happy to jump on the bandwagon and abandon Millwall. After all, it was more fun to create mayhem on the coast, than in the gloom of Bermondsey, Peckham and New Cross. They fancied themselves more against Brighton. We were seen as a slightly ' softer touch ' than that lot from the Den.
And it just grew to where it is today. Unless you are over 50, you've known nothing else. Successive generations of Millwall fans have switched their attentions to West Ham and left us to it.
So there it is....without messrs Venables and Mullery there would be no rivalry.

innacurate & misleading. It was not 'artificially created' There was nothing artificial about Mullery throwing money into a puddle & screaming at them. It was very REAL. And from then it grew with many REAL incidents. And it sits VERY comfortably, thank you, you don't sound as if you've not missed one of 'our' games home or away since 79, unlike me, hence your dispassionate post??

 

[catfish]

I might well get a kicking for this...but can someone explain how Brighton took part in a Charity Shield if they had not won the top tier league or FA cup the season before?

Apologies to all for being a bad fan.

In those days it was contested between the winners of the Southern League & Football League.

 

[HenryC]

I don't believe Murray has experienced a BHA Palace derby yet has he?

Oh dear!!!

He is going to SO wish he'd stayed with us!

 

[Brovion]

It is a totally unnatural rivalry...a South London club v a South Coast club.
It doesn't sit comfortably and we all know that it was artificially created in the mid seventies.
Up to that point Palace always clashed with Millwall. They were natural rivals..geographically close and generally, hated each other.
Brighton sat alone, 50 miles from the nearest league opposition. We couldn't hijack the Pompey/ Saints thing...too well established. We were a stand alone club, quietly going about our business, with a dolphin on our badge.
And thats how it probably would have stayed had the upwardly mobile careers of messrs Venables and Mullery not brought them into sharp conflict with each other.
Former teammates they desperately wanted to get one over each other and never hesitated in stirring things up and fanning the flames. The two sets of fans got sucked into it and hey presto, before you knew it, we hated each other.
We got a new rival, a new nickname and for the angry and aggressive young men of the 70's, a focus for their hate and violence.
Young Palace fans were only too happy to jump on the bandwagon and abandon Millwall. After all, it was more fun to create mayhem on the coast, than in the gloom of Bermondsey, Peckham and New Cross. They fancied themselves more against Brighton. We were seen as a slightly ' softer touch ' than that lot from the Den.
And it just grew to where it is today. Unless you are over 50, you've known nothing else. Successive generations of Millwall fans have switched their attentions to West Ham and left us to it.
So there it is....without messrs Venables and Mullery there would be no rivalry.

It wasn't artificially created at all. It had been building for about a year (Mullery and Venables not being the best of friends, us adopting their 'Eagles' chant etc) but it really came to a head with that infamous Cup replay when 'Challis of the Palace' defrauded us out of a victory. (Photo above)

For about four years or so it was really intense, and I mean REALLY intense. I suppose, to answer the OP's original question, the reason why the rest of football find it so bizarre is because the rivalry isn't an ancient enmity, it came out of nowhere and for the last twenty five years or so the only real reason to keep it alive is the memory of that short, intense period.

 

[Questions]

Its all very well taking an end at 2.15 when there was no one in it apart from a few young kids but the art was hanging on to it and not cowering in the corner once the home sides big boys had turned up.

Palace ? I shit em.

 

[brightn'ove]

o/t i just found out me and mullery share the same birthday, cracking!

 

[Weststander]

It started before Mullery. Peter Taylor was the manager. M.Allison theirs.
Jan 1976, CPFC were the league visitors.
33,000 one evening.
Players fought like dogs to win. Crowd trouble.

Was it just because we in the same divisions, both on the rise, and it grew from there?

And later fuelled further by Challis, etc.

 

[perseus]

Londoners are best if they stay in London.

At school in Lancing, the biggest antagonism was with Chelsea supporters, and at that time, we had never ever played them! (not quite right, we beat them in 1933.)

 

[severnside gull]

From my memory the rivalry didn't exist significantly pre-Alan Mullery and in the 35 years that it has been around we have probably only been directly competing against them for half a dozen seasons or so. That doesn't mean that the rivalry doesn't exist or that it isn't fairly torrid but I suspect that without the internet to keep it alive it would long since have been consigned to history. Our "problem" (if you are desperate for rivalry to supplement the appeal of following the Albion) is that all the potential opponents are geographically a fair distance away - very few clubs are in a similar position. Had Crawley been a FL club for any significant proportion of their history I am sure they would have been even better candidates for the honour than Palace.

Back in my day (1960's through the 70's) the main rivalries were against the likes of Bournemouth/Reading/Swindon/Aldershot/Orient for no other reason than they were reachable easily (given that transport and mobility were not as accessible as they are now) and were invariably knocking around in the same league as us.

The creation of the Palace rivalry largely coincided in my memory with the rise of football hooliganism and a mindless violence, particularly among the late teens to late 20's group, that has disturbing echoes in the recent riots. I'm not suggesting that our locking horns again after another gap of some years will necessarily result in disorder but I can certainly forsee that it might be the most challenging evening stewards and police will have endured for many a year.

I certainly can't think of better candidates for those who crave something extra than this "as near to a local derby as we get" encounter. I am not entirely convinced though as I don't think we have any natural rivals and it is all a bit contrived and to that extent I can understand why an outsider might be slightly surprised.

 

[Paxton Dazo]

I can't even pass Shitwankhurst park on the train without sticking my fingers up! Now, people do find that odd, especially the opera-goers.

Wow.

 

[chimneys]

Wow.

Come on, admit it- you do the same when you pass Brisbane Road!

 

[User removed 4]

Millwall have always had west ham as their proper rivals, simply because Millwall is on the Isle of dogs. Palace were not really thought of as a london club for years also. Geography is irrelevant, just ask Real Madrid and Barca. The trouble up at Selhurst and at the Goldstone cemented the rivalry tho'.

You're wrong on two counts, there is a lot of mythology around the west ham and millwall rivalry, the fact of the matter is, that there really wasnt anything over and above normal london rivalry until the 70's and hooligans, and your comment about palace not being seen as a london club is laughable.

 

[Norman Potting]

I am surprised that Gerry Ryan's leg hasn't been mentioned as fanning the rivalry flames in 198?

 

[northstandsteve]

Too much time spent in different divisions over recent years possibly?

Geographically other teams expect the usual south coast suspects to be more of a rivalry?

The fact that there are many albion fans (me included) that were too young or born after the rivalry at its peak only see it as a historical thing and recent head to head games have been far and few between and largely uneventful.

You will surprised by the intensity of both fans tuesday week. Ask anyone who was las Scumhurst the night we won 1-0 one of the best atmospheres for many years and you couold feel the intensity.

 

[perseus]

Cold Blow Lane

You're wrong on two counts, there is a lot of mythology around the west ham and millwall rivalry, the fact of the matter is, that there really wasnt anything over and above normal london rivalry until the 70's and hooligans, and your comment about palace not being seen as a london club is laughable.

One of the biggest mob of seventy or so uniformed Police actually in a ground I have seen was at the Old Den separating two groups of feuding Millwall supporters. Altogether a bizarre and very cold afternoon. During the game, two supporters completely unconnected with the feud, and in two separate events ran on the pitch shouting "Kill the Ref" and were immediately followed with three burly guards who rugby tackled them to the ground and sat on them before they did any damage.

None of this made the news.

And the chestnuts were still mouldy.

 

[HH Brighton]

Mate anyone who doubts the rivalry and intensity of this game will realise after next Tuesaday.

 

[northstandsteve]

innacurate & misleading. It was not 'artificially created' There was nothing artificial about Mullery throwing money into a puddle & screaming at them. It was very REAL. And from then it grew with many REAL incidents. And it sits VERY comfortably, thank you, you don't sound as if you've not missed one of 'our' games home or away since 79, unlike me, hence your dispassionate post??

Disagree, can't find my copy at the moment but there is a picture from around 1910 showing the rivalry then, it was on the cover of a recent Albion historical publication. There is a history on one of the Palace forums which is quite a good read. Rivalry intensified in the 70's, can't wait !!!

 

[Paxton Dazo]

Come on, admit it- you do the same when you pass Brisbane Road!

Nah mate, my real hate in football is Enfield Town Football Club.

 

[Dr. Notthenineo'clocknews]

Nah mate, my real hate in football is Enfield Town Football Club.

no wait, I want to hear what the guru of fan culture has got to tell us on this subject, after all i've only been going for 35 years but i'm always ready to listen to an 'elder'

 

[Rich Suvner]

It is a totally unnatural rivalry...a South London club v a South Coast club.
It doesn't sit comfortably and we all know that it was artificially created in the mid seventies.

Brighton clearly has significant links with London, whether people like it or not, and the population reflects this - large swathes of Sussex is populated by familiies who've moved out of London during recent generations. A significant number of people commute between the two cities and Brighton has historically grown off the back of London's daytrippers.