[Misc] Who on here has been to walk past the Queen's coffin?

[Bakero]

That’s how it is.

It’s called history, it is one of the things that make our country great.

Get over it.

Do you truly believe that due to history the UK must forever remain an unequal society? "Get over it" is just a depressing comment.

 

[Weststander]

I'm sorry but I don't understand why they get a free pass. How can we ever hope to have a more equitable society when the head of state sits on a throne wearing a crown and only ends up in that position as they developed in the right womb?

Because the UK is already 100x more equitable than it was in 1900. Countless folk, even in this parish, went to state comps and have succeeded in the professions, science/medicine or business. The royal family aren't grabbing the best jobs, they don't occupy normal posts, they're a side issue.

In France, Germany, Switzerland and the US, class is alive and well based on background, race, old money and family. It’s all pervasive.

The UK really isn't a cruel place holding back the entire middle and working classes, Starmer said last week that "this is a truly great country". There are thousands crossing The English Channel, very often from French-speaking Africa, who want to join this society.

 

[cunning fergus]

I'm a photographer and was in London yesterday photographing 'the Queue'. It's an an absolutely incredible sight, how many people are in it isn't known but it's four deep in many places, densely packed and stretches for six miles. People were incredibly good natured and happy despite many of them having been in the queue for up to 11 hours.

There were young people, old people, people with obvious disabilities and people of all ethnicities, to me it was Britain at its very best.

Yep, couldn’t have put it better, I passed through WH at 9.45 this morning.

The process was tough, it was over 14 hours of either walking or standing during a pretty chilly night/morning but the experience could not have been more rewarding. It was like a cross between a charity event and that first Fans United match.

The people queuing around me were from different parts of the U.K. and could not have been a more diverse bunch. The generosity of spirit from these people was inspiring, sharing their food and drink with strangers and helping those struggling with the challenge of the queue (it didn’t move from 3-430 whilst we were by the globe theatre, and the cold was getting into the bones).

If the purpose of the lying in state was to bring hundreds of thousands of people together from vastly different backgrounds that live in this country through a single positive shared experience then the process was an unmitigated success, and bravo HMQ and those that took part. Proof if needed that London can host events in its streets with hundreds of thousands of people that doesn’t result in mass arrests.

The only trouble makers were the Eastern European pickpocketers in and around Southwark Park the police/stewards warned people about, and the Herbert that sexually assaulted 2 women who has since been charged, although he may have not been familiar with this particular cultural practice.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

It’s funny how people dismiss marriages and treaties as money producing. Women had dowries, and rich people married rich people. Wealth breeds wealth

 

[Bakero]

That’s life.
Why do you have good health, enough food and clean running water, and not suffer from leprosy, cholera or dysentery? Because you happened to come out of the right womb when you mother was in the right country.
Compare to 80% of the world, you and I live in luxury.

I'm surprised at you, TB. Of course, through accident of birth, we've been lucky. But why does that mean we can't expect a better society? Just because it's worse elsewhere, British people should accept their lot, tug their forelocks and carry on?

 

[Weststander]

It’s funny how people dismiss marriages and treaties as money producing. Women had dowries, and rich people married rich people. Wealth breeds wealth

 

[Bakero]

Because the UK is already 100x more equitable than it was in 1900. Countless folk, even in this parish, went to state comps and have succeeded in the professions, science/medicine or business. The royal family aren't grabbing the best jobs, they don't occupy normal posts, they're a side issue.

In France, Germany, Switzerland and the US, class is alive and well based on background, race, old money and family is all pervasive.

The UK really isn't a cruel place holding back the entire middle and working classes, Starmer said last week that "this is a truly great country". There are thousands crossing The English Channel, very often from French-speaking Africa, who want to join this society.

Have a read of this from the FT: https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https://www...45e8-497b-b308-c951baa68945?sharetype=blocked

"Norway is a good place to live, whether you are rich or poor.

Britain is a different story. While the top earners rank fifth, the average household ranks 12th and the poorest 5 per cent rank 15th. Far from simply losing touch with their western European peers, last year the lowest-earning bracket of British households had a standard of living that was 20 per cent weaker than their counterparts in Slovenia."

"It’s a similar story in the middle. In 2007, the average UK household was 8 per cent worse off than its peers in north-western Europe, but the deficit has since ballooned to a record 20 per cent. On present trends, the average Slovenian household will be better off than its British counterpart by 2024, and the average Polish family will move ahead before the end of the decade. A country in desperate need of migrant labour may soon have to ask new arrivals to take a pay cut."

 

[Bakero]

Yep, couldn’t have put it better, I passed through WH at 9.45 this morning.

The process was tough, it was over 14 hours of either walking or standing during a pretty chilly night/morning but the experience could not have been more rewarding. It was like a cross between a charity event and that first Fans United match.

The people queuing around me were from different parts of the U.K. and could not have been a more diverse bunch. The generosity of spirit from these people was inspiring, sharing their food and drink with strangers and helping those struggling with the challenge of the queue (it didn’t move from 3-430 whilst we were by the globe theatre, and the cold was getting into the bones).

If the purpose of the lying in state was to bring hundreds of thousands of people together from vastly different backgrounds that live in this country through a single positive shared experience then the process was an unmitigated success, and bravo HMQ and those that took part. Proof if needed that London can host events in its streets with hundreds of thousands of people that doesn’t result in mass arrests.

The only trouble makers were the Eastern European pickpocketers in and around Southwark Park the police/stewards warned people about, and the Herbert that sexually assaulted 2 women who has since been charged, although he may have not been familiar with this particular cultural practice.

3 racist jibes in one post. That's impressive even for you.

 

[Swansman]

All their sealed wills suggests to me they possess a lot more personal wealth than people realise. They haven’t earned that. It’s come from somewhere.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...-for-change-in-law-to-hide-her-private-wealth

She hid it with the political power she allegedly didn't have.

 

[cunning fergus]

3 racist jibes in one post. That's impressive even for you.

I know, for you the truth is no defence.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Do you truly believe that due to history the UK must forever remain an unequal society? "Get over it" is just a depressing comment.

Sorry, but yes. (Apologies for using “get over it”, probably silly on my part, but I am a big supporter of the monarchy).

What sort of unequal society do you have in mind?

 

[Bakero]

Sorry, but yes. (Apologies for using “get over it”, probably silly on my part, but I am a big supporter of the monarchy).

What sort of unequal society do you have in mind?

I'd rather a society with a more even distribution of wealth. I think most people would.

 

[Weststander]

Have a read of this from the FT: https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https://www...45e8-497b-b308-c951baa68945?sharetype=blocked

"Norway is a good place to live, whether you are rich or poor.

Britain is a different story. While the top earners rank fifth, the average household ranks 12th and the poorest 5 per cent rank 15th. Far from simply losing touch with their western European peers, last year the lowest-earning bracket of British households had a standard of living that was 20 per cent weaker than their counterparts in Slovenia."

"It’s a similar story in the middle. In 2007, the average UK household was 8 per cent worse off than its peers in north-western Europe, but the deficit has since ballooned to a record 20 per cent. On present trends, the average Slovenian household will be better off than its British counterpart by 2024, and the average Polish family will move ahead before the end of the decade. A country in desperate need of migrant labour may soon have to ask new arrivals to take a pay cut."

Sticking to facts in 2020 rather editor's commentary,
https://www.statista.com/forecasts/1171540/gini-index-by-country
the UK's in the same ball park for Gini-measured wealth equality/inequality as:
Portugal
Spain
Canada
Australia
Switzerland
Italy
France

Far fairer than the USA, obviously.

It really isn't this completely awful place, spear headed by the Windsor's.

Scandinavia's an interesting one, I've brought up this many times over my nsc time. They do no tax the rich until the pips squeak. Everyone pays far, far greater tax, social security and local taxes, than in the UK. You can work this out on eg net pay calculators in their currency. The person on the equivalent of £30,000 in Stockholm pays 49% in taxes. Funding a superior social care system and health service.

High tax revenues do not flow from Swedish aristocrats and industrialists, everyone's in it together.

Brits will never want that system, instead wanting the best of all worlds in their minds.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

I'd rather a society with a more even distribution of wealth. I think most people would.

How would it be distributed?

IMO You have to have leaders and people making difficult decisions, policy or otherwise, that level of authority should come with recognition financially. Prime minister’s have sought advice from royalty over time, and of course historically the royal family have had a major role to play.

The fact that titles and wealth continually get handed down, is effectively recognition of previous events. I think the Royal Family are working hard to modernise, remembering they bring in significant funds annually (my understanding is that it is greater than the cost).

I’m sure people will disagree, but I am proud of the majority of the royals (well, those that perspire), and believe the Queen was truly incredible, and remai very sad about her passing.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Yet the number of obviously under 24yr olds in a real time queue suggests otherwise. And why stop at the over 65's. Absolutely every age group, colour and creed is in the queue to pay their respects. Sometimes real life is a better guide than the media social or traditional.

The article was not just somebody’s opinion, it was based on research and opinion polls over a period of time.

It was in the Guardian - or rather I read it on the Guardian website this morning. I can’t find it now, otherwise I would post a link.

I expect some people would dismiss it because it is based on opinion polls. I expect some people would dismiss it because it is from the Guardian.

I expect some people would dismiss it on both counts, just as I would take with a hefty pinch of salt everything I might read in the Daily Mail, not that I read the Daily Mail.

Don’t shoot the messenger.

P.s. …. And I’m not accusing you of shooting the messenger.

 

[Bakero]

Sticking to facts in 2020 rather editor's commentary,
https://www.statista.com/forecasts/1171540/gini-index-by-country
the UK's in the same ball park for Gini-measured wealth equality/inequality as:
Portugal
Spain
Canada
Australia
Switzerland
Italy
France

Far fairer than the USA, obviously.

It really isn't this completely awful place, spear headed by the Windsor's.

Scandinavia's an interesting one, I've brought up this many times over my nsc time. They do no tax the rich until the pips squeak. Everyone pays far, far greater tax, social security and local taxes, than in the UK. You can work this out on eg net pay calculators in their currency. The person on the equivalent of £30,000 in Stockholm pays 49% in taxes. Funding a superior social care system and health service.

High tax revenues do not flow from Swedish aristocrats and industrialists, everyone's in it together.

Brits will never want that system, instead wanting the best of all worlds in their minds.

That's where the UK sits in terms of income inequality amongst OECD countries. 7 are more unequal (Turkey, USA, México, Bulgaria, Chile, Costa Rica, South Africa), 30 are more equal.

 

[Is it PotG?]

https://news.sky.com/story/second-hand-wristbands-from-queens-laying-in-state-queue-selling-for-triple-figures-on-ebay-12699578#



What a strange world.

 

[Weststander]

View attachment 151909

That's where the UK sits in terms of income inequality amongst OECD countries. 7 are more unequal (Turkey, USA, México, Bulgaria, Chile, Costa Rica, South Africa), 30 are more equal.

So on a par with Spain, Japan, Italy and Australia, a tiny degree of difference. What’s holding the Italians back, unhindered by the Windsor’s?





Before and after Brexit stats, we’re not the stand out unequal and unjust nation.

 

[pastafarian]

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...-for-change-in-law-to-hide-her-private-wealth

She hid it with the political power she allegedly didn't have.

Um, perhaps its time to understand that parliament voted and passed the Companies Bill and all the clauses contained within it. (under a Labour government that one as well)
Your increasingly ridiculous posts suggesting the Queen yields all sorts of political power in our countries system of constitutional monarchy is just plain daft.

 

[Bakero]

So on a par with Spain, Japan, Italy and Australia, a tiny degree of difference. What’s holding the Italians back, unhindered by the Windsor’s?

View attachment 151915

View attachment 151916

Before and after Brexit stats, we’re not the stand out unequal and unjust nation.

The UK is by any measure a grossly unequal society. You can say "whatabout insert-county" as much as you want but it doesn't change that fact. Would getting rid of the royals be an instant fix? Of course not. Just look at the US. However, the monarchy is the class system, inequality and privilege personified. A constant reminder and legitimisation of the fact that some are destined to have a higher status.