[News] When council estates were a dream.

[Leekbrookgull]

A decent review from someone born on a council estate,even as a soft Tory i don't agree with 'Right to Buy' as councils build and need these houses. These estates when i grew up had Police Houses,shops even the odd pub and a Church,everybody seemed to know each other,doubt its the same now ? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/extra/iZKMPd0wjP/council_housing

 

[Brian Parsons]

My parents were the first occupants of a council house in Storrington. Being post war all the families were on a similar "boat". There was a terrific camaraderie among everyone. I fondly remember my childhood there. But sadly I went back two weeks ago and every single one was privately owned and according to a school friend nobody talks to each other now, sadly a sign of the times. Incidentally they were genuine "Jerry built houses". Built by prisoners of war and my Dad who was Home guard used to escort them to and from Barns farm camp.

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[Raleigh Chopper]

I am from Council house stock, absolutely nothing like it today.
You always had a couple of problem families but they were ok.
Everyone knew each other, the houses and gardens were clean and looked after, no trouble, no drugs, very rarely saw the police. That was for about 20 years, I don't remember a single serious issue.

 

[BensGrandad]

The downfall was the buying of the estates by private companies rather than have council owned and run houses. Were we live was owned by Downland Housing who sold out to Affinity Sutton who in turn have sold out to Clarion and as each sell out came so the standard and concern dropped to the low that it is now as Clarioin are awful to deal with and have no social conscience whatsoever.

 

[Raleigh Chopper]

The downfall was the buying of the estates by private companies rather than have council owned and run houses. Were we live was owned by Downland Housing who sold out to Affinity Sutton who in turn have sold out to Clarion and as each sell out came so the standard and concern dropped to the low that it is now as Clarioin are awful to deal with and have no social conscience whatsoever.

I am sure that had something to do with it but something has changed over a generations whereas people are like caged animals and don't mind living in a zoo.
Most places have a couple of really bad areas, unfortunately Plymouth has at least 7 and whilst there are many decent people living there, there are many real knuckle draggers on the estates down here.
A lot of the estates have been demolished and redeveloped but they still choose to live and behave like pigs.

 

[BensGrandad]

It appears that council tenants nowadays seem to have a 'badge and image'; that they have to live down to and is expected of them.

 

[Blues Rock DJ]

From my time in Sussex Police, residents in Council housing like Whitehawk, Moulsecoombe, were salt of the earth. In those days (1970's), we had time to talk to people, gain their trust (of course some scrotes slipped through the net !)

 

[Weststander]

A decent review from someone born on a council estate,even as a soft Tory i don't agree with 'Right to Buy' as councils build and need these houses. These estates when i grew up had Police Houses,shops even the odd pub and a Church,everybody seemed to know each other,doubt its the same now ? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/extra/iZKMPd0wjP/council_housing

Not disagreeing, but the “everybody seemed to know each other” phenomena has ended generally.

As a kid in the 70’s/early 80’s in a non-council house, neighbours very rarely changed (which was not an entirely halcyon or salad days thing ... some miserable old gits really hated happy kids).

In modern times families are far more transient, moving to work elsewhere in the UK or overseas, or to move up or down market.

 

[beorhthelm]

From my time in Sussex Police, residents in Council housing like Whitehawk, Moulsecoombe, were salt of the earth. In those days (1970's), we had time to talk to people, gain their trust (of course some scrotes slipped through the net !)

so where do they (and estates in general) get the reputations from?

 

[Surrey_Albion]

Loved growing up on an estate, we were toerags but still had morals, the old Bill treated you with respect and Visa versa, salt of the earth people, bits of trouble but self policed , i 3ven remember back in the late 80s a group of pikies invaded our playing field, all the Dads (some were even of traveller stock) ernt down there and removed them. Everyone knew each other , you could nick a pint of milk f4om the milk man but still help Margaret or mabel with their shopping, no malice in being a bit "dodgy"

Unlike today,if you had a "run in" with someone and stabbed them you would a coward and scum and the estate would outcast you, if you gave it a fair go theyde back you all the way

 

[Raleigh Chopper]

As far as I was aware.
Nobody thought about or took drugs.
Nobody drank excessively.
Nobody stole cars and had the police chasing them through the streets.
When the police did have to turn up, there was not a gang of kids and parents giving the old bill a hard time.
Nobody had fridges, long grass and 20 kids bikes in the front garden.
And, most importantly of all, the cigarette and XL chewing gum machine (free pack every 4th turn) remained on the wall outside the paper shop for my entire time there.
Today, I don't think it would last an hour.
What has happened?

 

[Knocky's Nose]

I grew up on a council estate in Bradford... It was so rough other kids weren't allowed to 'come round' - which annoyed me so much as a child it gave me immense drive to do well as an adult, so not all bad.

To quote :

Nobody thought about or took drugs. : Agreed.. drugs just weren't even a 'thing' back then. Not even weed!

Nobody drank excessively. : They did on our estate. We had paper thin walls and I used to lay in bed at night being kept awake by the jail-hopping scrotes next door shouting down the great white bugle come 11.30pm most nights. Arguments and squabbles used to echo across the estate on Friday and Saturday nights like kicking out time at Mordor...

Nobody stole cars and had the police chasing them through the streets. : Plenty of stolen cars ended up on our estate, but none were taken from it. They were all crap cars.

When the police did have to turn up, there was not a gang of kids and parents giving the old bill a hard time. : I never really saw the police, apart from when they were arresting one of the scrotes next door. They were beyond stupid and used to commit a crime (burglary usually) then bring home their stolen stuff and have it in their house! The rest of the estate were a bit sharper.

Nobody had fridges, long grass and 20 kids bikes in the front garden. : Yes they did on my estate.. Most front yards looked like Steptoes back one.

And, most importantly of all, the cigarette and XL chewing gum machine (free pack every 4th turn) remained on the wall outside the paper shop for my entire time there. Today, I don't think it would last an hour. : Ours would have 'Daz 4 Kaz' marker penned on it, but you're right - it never got smashed or stolen.

Still... it was up North...

 

[Questions]

Bought their council houses, stuck a brass door knocker on and then voted Tory.

 

[AmexRuislip]

It appears that council tenants nowadays seem to have a 'badge and image'; that they have to live down to and is expected of them.

But that's the point.
These types have a choice, in either acting up in emulating their inbred elders, or change and act like normal residents, that don't act like they're owed.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I lived in a non estate street but had a paper round in a council house (and flat) area in the very early 70s. That's Mill Lane and Foredown Road, Portslade, for locals who know it. There was an obvious difference between private and council, but this was mostly quality of build (inclusion of garages), and the identikit paintwork and doorage. The houses were well kept and the residents perfectly fine. The flats weren't too bad either (albeit they were a bit smelly around the entrance, but aren't we all?).

The whole lot was flogged off by Thatcher. I just google mapped it and it now looks pretty much like Foredown Drive (always private). I do recall however back in the late 60s folk on the estate having two foreign holidays a year when we struggled to do a week in a caravan in Dawlish. Seemed a bit weird and.....unfair.

So my view is.....council estates were great and offered people a chance to live much better than the likes of their forebears (my mum grew up in a shit rented flat in Clarendon road, long demolished). However, giving folk a home for life at low rent did seem to encourage profligacy that, by the late 70s, started to foster the 'three generations, never worked, never will work, on the 'soash'' phenomenon that wrankled with 'ordinary hard working men and women'.

The solution might have been to use council housing as a stepping stone, with help and incentives to move on to home ownership (or at least try to do this), but unfortunately a lot on the left saw a council house as a permanent posession, and indeed one that should be handed on to the kids (inherited wealth, FFS!). Meanwhile, the rest of us operated in the financial real world......

Some on the left offered the solution 'all property is theft and all homes should be nationalised' but that was never going to catch on.

Overall then, a slightly peculiar set of arrangements whereby if you got a council house you were 'made for life'.

Thatcher's solution of flogging them off cheap to the owners was genius in some respects (and not dlagged in her first manifesto). I hated it at the time (as a lefty). If sales had been on a more realistic basis and folk were not allowed to quickly sell on for a massive profit, or even more absurd, have their estate flogged off over their heads to private estate managers, I might feel a bit more sanguine. But, no, Thatcher sold the houses off as an attack on socialism, regardless of the cost to the national purse or the consequence for access to housing. Who knew, eh? Who knew. And yet, the consequences may be more trivial than anticipated.

The estates left that are still council are (I would suggest) either unsellable because they are really shit, or in an area where everyone is skint. On an individual level, I know an elderly couple (he still works) with over £100K in the bank who live in a gorgeous council house in rural England, who simply never got around to thinking about buying. This means their kids won't make a financial killing when the parents die (rules now are the house goes to new tenants - albeit I expect the coulcil will sell it).

Finally we have a council estate over the back of where I live. I can often hear late night shouting from my garden, and there is a rife drug culture (so the taxi drivers have been telling me for the last 30 years, but maybe that's just Bob Geldorf and his kids in the manor on the nearby hill). It looks qute nice on google maps (I never go there, obviously). On the whole, it seems no worse than the Portslade estates of the late 60s and early 70s. In case anyone is interested in the demographic, the estates in Portslade in the 60s and the ones here in Faversham today were/are both 99% white. The tattoo density however has gone from under 10% to considerably closer to 100%, so some things have changed. I make not inferences about either statistic (because none can be made, except prejudicially).

 

[Surrey_Albion]

But that's the point.
These types have a choice, in either acting up in emulating their inbred elders, or change and act like normal residents, that don't act like they're owed.

Not that easy... the answer is education. Some of the 4th 5th generation benefit scroungers have no clue, back on the day we all had the opportunity to "Better ousrselves" not anymore the harder you work, unless already a gome owner or middle class, the harder it is

 

[AmexRuislip]

Not that easy... the answer is education. Some of the 4th 5th generation benefit scroungers have no clue, back on the day we all had the opportunity to "Better ousrselves" not anymore the harder you work, unless already a gome owner or middle class, the harder it is

I totally agree.
Near us we have an estate, which is commonly known as the bronx.
The local rednecks have progressed from riding dirt bikes at all hours to quad bikes, having a total disregard for locals and the Met police.
The council need to put in powers to deal with these types IMO

 

[Surrey_Albion]

Loved growing up on an estate, we were toerags but still had morals, the old Bill treated you with respect and Visa versa, salt of the earth people, bits of trouble but self policed , i 3ven remember back in the late 80s a group of pikies invaded our playing field, all the Dads (some were even of traveller stock) ernt down there and removed them. Everyone knew each other , you could nick a pint of milk f4om the milk man but still help Margaret or mabel with their shopping, no malice in being a bit "dodgy"

Unlike today,if you had a "run in" with someone and stabbed them you would a coward and scum and the estate would outcast you, if you gave it a fair go theyde back you all the way

I totally agree.
Near us we have an estate, which is commonly known as the bronx.
The local rednecks have progressed from riding dirt bikes at all hours to quad bikes, having a total disregard for locals and the Met police.
The council need to put in powers to deal with these types IMO

Not sure that putting rules in would help imho, need to change society completly and share the wealth , education and earning a livable wage is the answer, minimum wage doesnt cover rent and council tax, the worlds gone wrong

 

[Pickles]

A decent review from someone born on a council estate,even as a soft Tory i don't agree with 'Right to Buy' as councils build and need these houses. These estates when i grew up had Police Houses,shops even the odd pub and a Church,everybody seemed to know each other,doubt its the same now ? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/extra/iZKMPd0wjP/council_housing

You have described the top end of Hangleton way, 45 years ago. The police dogs in the kennels of the police houses never gave up barking.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I am from Council house stock, absolutely nothing like it today.
You always had a couple of problem families but they were ok.
Everyone knew each other, the houses and gardens were clean and looked after, no trouble, no drugs, very rarely saw the police. That was for about 20 years, I don't remember a single serious issue.

At one stage, if you didn't keep the garden neat & tidy, and the house clean, you could get evicted. The rent man came round and checked it every week.