[Brighton] Western Road Redevelopment

[Sid and the Sharknados]

I understand your cynicism and the funding question is of course the fundamental. But I think it's this type of attitude which would prevent ANY project from getting off the ground. The reality is that because of our minority council, nothing positive can realistically happen in Brighton and Hove at the moment. The thinking is muddled, the planning is a joke and their priorities are completely at odds which each other because there is a total lack of leadership.

What the City really needs is to sit down and properly consider how we can get back to being a positive stand out in the UK. I think the reputation of this city has fallen dramatically over the last decade because every department of the council is poorly run and it shows. There are potholes in every road, rubbish piles up throughout the city because the collections are infrequent and unreliable. Recycling bins aren't emptied quickly enough so people start stacking on the street next to them, then the team who collects the recycling is different to the on-street team so they'll leave behind anything stacked next to the bin. And so on and so forth.

All the time we have a minority council these problems can not be solved because the councillors simply do not work together for the benefit of the city.

To be clear, I'm not cynical about construction projects per se, I'm just not clear what problem we're solving other than Herr Tubthumper finding the bus stops outside Churchill Square a bit confusing.
Fundamentally, that's a problem that could be improved for a few grand spent on better signs and timetabling around the stops. I'm also not minded to view there being lots of buses as a problem, it's a good thing if they're being used.

It's an investment and I'm certain that it would be a money making machine if probably implemented and well priced, plus selling advertising rights left, right and centre. I don't think the cost of the thing is the biggest barrier to getting it done, it's an excellent investment and one which is well worth making in towns and Cities like ours.

I'd have to check, but I'm not sure that any of the tram systems in this country make money. For that matter, based on a quick skim of the article above, I'd guess they don't make money in Germany either.
It's never going to be built just because it's a nice idea or to service the uni/Amex, there's got to be a clear case that thousands of people a day every day will be using it to get town and back again, who aren't already using the buses or existing railway.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

That's alright then, they can spend that time saving up for the £500m it would probably cost.

It would pay for itself in all sorts of ways

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

It would pay for itself in all sorts of ways

Except the only way that actually matters, unfortunately

 

[Notters]

A

well yes they both have slight inclines (certainly western road less so) when you usually see them in very flat areas. mind your point about elm grove is correct and if they can manage in Sheffield they'd be fine here I guess

Allow me to go full geek on this.
Pameira Square is 13 metres lower than Churchill Square, and is 1,300m distance, so the gradient is approximately 1:100

 

[macbeth]

A

Allow me to go full geek on this.
Pameira Square is 13 metres lower than Churchill Square, and is 1,300m distance, so the gradient is approximately 1:100

i'll take your word for it but if that's the case bring on the trams!!

 

[talk2knighty]

It's an investment and I'm certain that it would be a money making machine if probably implemented and well priced, plus selling advertising rights left, right and centre. I don't think the cost of the thing is the biggest barrier to getting it done, it's an excellent investment and one which is well worth making in towns and Cities like ours.

I’m all for trams but it’s a pipe dream expecting BHCC to manage this, they can’t even be trusted to look after basic services such as keeping the streets clean, free from weeds and don’t get me started on the i360, Black Rock conference centre and Ice stadium anyone

 

[talk2knighty]

It seems Bristol scrapped a super tram system, see below….

What happened to the £200m plan for Bristol Supertram?

The scheme was scrapped in 2004 after delays, political rows and cost overruns in plans for trams in other cities

www.bristolpost.co.uk

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

It seems Bristol scrapped a super tram system, see below….

What happened to the £200m plan for Bristol Supertram?

The scheme was scrapped in 2004 after delays, political rows and cost overruns in plans for trams in other cities

www.bristolpost.co.uk

If people think B&H council are bad...

 

[clapham_gull]

It's a measure which would actually alleviate traffic congestion on the outskirts of Brighton, something which critics singularly fail to point out, perhaps because it doesn't quite fit in with their blinkered view of the world.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

If people think B&H council are bad...

My opinion is that you are talking a lot of sense and most of the others are talking a lot of bollocks

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Anyway. The western road works. Huge traffic disruption for the next 18 months. I hope the outcome is worth it, but yeh it looks quite unambitious given the incredible time frame.

There are also works going to be happening near the sea life centre going on in parallel. More I think on madeira drive. So Brighton might not be its usual traffic friendly self in the coming months

 

[Super Steve Earle]

There's barely any shops left in Western Road already. Make it harder for shoppers to get there for 18m and there will be even fewer. It will look more pleasant once it's done but the actual shopfronts appear about 50% closed up. With high rents, business costs, less money to spend in shops and expensive parking, this will only be a cosmetic job that will only make a small debt in revitalising the area.

You can't keep trying to squeeze more and more cars into Brighton, its just not suited to cars. A tram would be a great idea, say from Worthing to Lewes with a tram every 5 minutes. It's not impossible. Look at the Elizabethan Line. It's transformed London travel (yes I know its not a tram but Brighton's project would be easier to do)

I think you are replying to the wrong post. Apart from mentioning expensive parking, my point was that the shops in Western Rd are failing fast. I was there just before Christmas and it seemed like about 30% of the shops were boarded up. C & H Fabrics soon to follow. Filling the road with roadworks for 18m will mean fewer shoppers. High rents and business rates etc. don't help, and like it or not, neither does expensive parking. The shops need shoppers, not tree lined boulevards.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

That's alright then, they can spend that time saving up for the £500m it would probably cost.

This is just two days of the Brexit bus with 200m to spare. Come back on Wednesday and it’s funded. Job done. Next?

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

This is just two days of the Brexit bus with 200m to spare. Come back on Wednesday and it’s funded. Job done. Next?

First of all, we both know that claim was bollocks.
B). It was £350m a week, not a day.
3: that's how much I'd guess a single line would cost nowadays in Brighton, not any sort of network.
iv - the running costs would need to be subsidised on top of existing subsidies for all the other public transport.
And finally, there's barely enough money to run the existing transport infrastructure. There's lots of things that money could be better spent on to improve public transport around Brighton and elsewhere before we get to a tramline through Brighton.

Anyway, I don't get off on telling people their hopes and aspirations are unaffordable, so I'll just leave this thread now to the people who want to talk about the Western Road works. Have a nice evening, and week now that I think about it.

 

[beorhthelm]

something just realised is 18mth to do this. for half a mile of road thats a bloody long time to do not very much.

 

[Marty___Mcfly]

Monorail?

 

[Stat Brother]

I'll wager the reason the area is looking rundown is because of the constant through traffic, as can be said for the rest of Brighton.
Anything being done to take cars out of the city has to be a good thing.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Had to chuckle at the artist’s impression in the plans. As though it will look like that. Gridlocked with buses and scores of overweight people carrying Primark and Sports Direct bags more like.

 

[BNthree]

Travelled from Hove into town on the bus this morning, had no problems at all with this diversion and hardly any extra time on the journey. Probably won't always be like that but seems a good start at least.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

something just realised is 18mth to do this. for half a mile of road thats a bloody long time to do not very much.

Dread to think how long Tubthumper Trams will take to build.