[Albion] Was it a penalty?

[Seasider78]

Watch any corner in any division and you will see plenty of players holding, arm grabbing and shirt pulling. The only difference with this incident was it meant his shirt came up his back which is not a reason to act differently

Technically it is a foul but these are never given week in week out. What is even more bizarre from corners is you only have to breathe on a goalkeeper to concede a free kick yet grabbing and hugging outfield players is seen as part of the game.

Yet another example of pathetic inconsistency from those officiating games.

General practice in these instances is for the referee to see this occurring before the corner is taken, warn the players and if it proceeds after his warning then he makes the decision. What we saw at the weekend is completely out of kilter with how referees have been managing these situations for sometime now and that is why I think we have been harshly treated.

Luckily for us it did not alter what was otherwise a fair result for both teams

 

[Easy 10]

For me, it was a penalty. The rules are clear, the grabbing of a shirt is a foul, and that was as blatant an example as any you could ever see. There was jostling between them beforehand, but once Dunk got a fistful of his shirt and started yanking it off his back, there was only one decision to give.

The fact that referees so rarely seem to give pens for this offence is aggravating - they SHOULD clamp down on it 100%. That doesn't mean the decision in this instance was wrong though, he applied the laws correctly.

As an aside, the huge split in opinion over this decision just goes to show how totally unworkable TV replays for penalty decisions would be.

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

Definite pen.

No matter what the Burnley player is doing, it's not an excuse to commit a deliberate foul. He didn't force Dunks hand onto his shirt and close it onto the material. If the Burnley player is fouling you, don't foul him and the ref will give you a free kick. If he doesn't, THEN you can moan.

I LOVE the argument that "6 pens a game would be given if the refs start giving these". Well maybe the refs should start giving them then?

 

[Pavilionaire]

Holding in the penalty area has become endemic, players do it without thinking why they do it or what the consequences will be.

A great example this weekend was Spurs second goal vs West Ham. The Hammers centre-back James Tomkins is one of their best defenders at corners, yet stood on the line holding Harry Kane with a full body lockdown so neither could move. Consequently, Toby Alderweireld ghosted in to head home at the near post, the nearest "defender" being Andy Carroll, his body in entirely the wrong position to effect any sort of meaningful challenge.

 

[Big Bill]

Did Dunk have any sensible reason to pull the other guy's shirt?

 

[Simster]

For me, it was a penalty. The rules are clear, the grabbing of a shirt is a foul, and that was as blatant an example as any you could ever see. There was jostling between them beforehand, but once Dunk got a fistful of his shirt and started yanking it off his back, there was only one decision to give.

The fact that referees so rarely seem to give pens for this offence is aggravating - they SHOULD clamp down on it 100%. That doesn't mean the decision in this instance was wrong though, he applied the laws correctly.

As an aside, the huge split in opinion over this decision just goes to show how totally unworkable TV replays for penalty decisions would be.

Definite pen.

No matter what the Burnley player is doing, it's not an excuse to commit a deliberate foul. He didn't force Dunks hand onto his shirt and close it onto the material. If the Burnley player is fouling you, don't foul him and the ref will give you a free kick. If he doesn't, THEN you can moan.

I LOVE the argument that "6 pens a game would be given if the refs start giving these". Well maybe the refs should start giving them then?

Surely it's only a definite pen if Dunk is clearly adjudged to have made the initial offence? Having watched the footage a few times, I don't think this is the case. I maintain that this nonsense should have been stamped out around the time the corner was taken. Blow up to hold up play, have a word to both players jostling, then get on with it. Instead, he's made a contentious and debatable decision that has directly affected the result. Attention seeking from a ref.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Wasnt a pen for me as they both seemed to being the same thing.

However from where the ref was standing he would have only seen Dunk so I can see why he did give it.

Actually think the linesman are useless and less so the refs, they never give anything and what the normally give is wrong.

The linesman was on that side of the pitch and should have had a much better view

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

Did Dunk have any sensible reason to pull the other guy's shirt?

"Because the other guy started it", seems to be general consensus.

 

[Big Bill]

"Because the other guy started it", seems to be general consensus.

So he fell for a pro's trick then maybe.

 

[Easy 10]

Surely it's only a definite pen if Dunk is clearly adjudged to have made the initial offence? Having watched the footage a few times, I don't think this is the case. I maintain that this nonsense should have been stamped out around the time the corner was taken. Blow up to hold up play, have a word to both players jostling, then get on with it. Instead, he's made a contentious and debatable decision that has directly affected the result. Attention seeking from a ref.

Players always jostle for position when they're trying to get in front of each other and theres bound to be contact. Personally I don't think jostling for position is automatically foul, but it depends on the extent of it, and that's where it becomes a bit of a grey area. Players naturally push it as far as they can to try and gain an advantage, and from what I saw of the incident that's what they were both equally guilty of. But once Dunk started ripping the guys shirt off his back, that took it up to another level and it cost us dearly.

The bloody idiot.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

The bloody idiot.

He is not the sharpest.

That will have been noted by every opposition player he is going to mark.

 

[Easy 10]

He is not the sharpest.

That will have been noted by every opposition player he is going to mark.

Other than the shirtswapping, I thought he had a decent game. But yes, you seriously have to ponder what on earth is going on between his ears.

 

[Shropshire Seagull]

It was a penalty. If you pull the shirt of the opponent in such a blatant way, in the box, you can have no complains. I don't understand why Refs don't take a harder line on shirt puling. If they did, it would stop very quickly.

The egg-chasers now wear lycra tight fit shirts specifically to stop opponents grabbing them by the shirt.
Can see this filter in to football at some point - may also mean a stop to players pulling off their shirt after scoring a goal [yellow card offence anyway]

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

The egg-chasers now wear lycra tight fit shirts specifically to stop opponents grabbing them by the shirt.
Can see this filter in to football at some point - may also mean a stop to players pulling off their shirt after scoring a goal [yellow card offence anyway]

That is interesting. You are right. I suspect once one Club does it - they all will.

 

[ferring seagull]

Never a penalty! I was there and it all seemed a bit weird now I've seen the video. They were holding each others arms but their guy was pulling Dunk away, then ducks out of the header, ridiculous decision.

That's how it appeared to me. The mutual shirt pulling was nothing like as much of a foul as the pulling of Lewis Dunk away from the action (where the ball was).

Nonetheless, given the outcome, it was staggering that Dunk did exactly the same thing in the second half !

 

[grawhite]

Of course it was a penalty. Not sure how anyone can claim otherwise. Dunk nearly had the shirt off the guys back. Keane may well have been holding Dunk's arm but the more obvious was the shirt pulling..

If you watch it carefully, yes Dunk was pulling his shirt, but their number 6 didn't help by pushing his shirt further up his back making it look more obvious.

 

[Saladpack Seagull]

Technically yes, but harsh. Makes up for the blatant one not given against MKD so can't complain really.

Certainly WAS harsh, but my immediate thought was, well, we got away with it against MK, swings and roundabouts. Then again, having been awarded a pen you've got to put it away - let's hope we manage that when it's our turn!!

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

The egg-chasers now wear lycra tight fit shirts specifically to stop opponents grabbing them by the shirt.
Can see this filter in to football at some point - may also mean a stop to players pulling off their shirt after scoring a goal [yellow card offence anyway]

Interesting but let's hope it doesn't go as far as you say. Booking players for celebrating scoring a goal should be abolished. It is simply absurd to penalise players for doing what everyone has paid to come and see.

 

[Silk]

No. The guy appeared to be pulling Dunks arm, and Dunk was trying to stay on his feet. why give one foul and not the other?

 

[ringmerseagulltoo]

Ignoring the specifics of this match, I wish every ref would punish shirt pulling wherever on the pitch it happens. It is against the rules and hinders skillfull play succeeding. Initially the continued stoppages would be exceedingly irritating, but once the players got used to not committing the foul, we would have better games to watch.