[Albion] Transfer Strategies

[Springal]

Players from the Championship can clearly make the step up, look at Madison and Brooks, both have had excellent seasons.
The main failing however regarding recruitment is to not have competition for Groß we didn't have competition for him last season.
To then go into this season with the same scenario is just careless.

I see Andy Naylor is now using Gross being missing as the source of all our problems. Which makes the fact we are so reliant on him with no natural back up pretty criminal IMO

 

[SollysLeftFoot]

I see Andy Naylor is now using Gross being missing as the source of all our problems. Which makes the fact we are so reliant on him with no natural back up pretty criminal IMO

But one could be forgiven for this being a fact of hindsight. Prior to Gross' injury. He didn't have that much of an obvious impact on our games, we were winning but Gross was not being seen as crucial in those wins. Since he has been off injured, we've tweaked our formation and now it becomes obvious that we're missing Gross.

 

[Eric Youngs Contact Lense]

You're not discussing with NSC and any old thread started, you're discussing this point through NSC with me, specifically. Someone starting a Montoya thread 6 months ago is irrelevant.

My point was you said each signing had shown ability far beyond their transfer fee.

I am really struggling with any of them showing far beyond their fee, in fact some of them not getting anywhere near showing even glimpses they were worth their fee. Andone I grant you looks a great buy at £5m or so. If we go back to Gross and compare him to recent signings, he was a steal at £15m let alone the £3m we paid.

Perhaps some of them will show a glimpse tonight.

I guess the trickier part of the argument is the "far beyond the transfer fee", but we have seen contributions from Locadia vs. Everton, Arsenal for example whereby many of us were impressed with his contributions from wider left. His turn and shot against Millwall was a class finish. Fleeting but flashes that make you frustrated because you feel it is in there. The same for Ali J as far as I am concerned : the shot vs Huddersfield, his general contribution vs. Palace - fleeting moments. Bissouma, Montoya, Balogun have all had those moments too - if they were able to produce these moments with anything approaching consistency, the transfer fees would seem "steals" I think? But I guess that is why they were the price they are : potentially brilliant with huge question marks still hanging over them..

 

[Hugo Rune]

I see Andy Naylor is now using Gross being missing as the source of all our problems. Which makes the fact we are so reliant on him with no natural back up pretty criminal IMO

No need to worry.

Mac Allister is coming.

 

[One Love]

But one could be forgiven for this being a fact of hindsight. Prior to Gross' injury. He didn't have that much of an obvious impact on our games, we were winning but Gross was not being seen as crucial in those wins. Since he has been off injured, we've tweaked our formation and now it becomes obvious that we're missing Gross.

At some point in the past CH said that it's so important to our play that the guy playing the no 10 role has a high workrate and makes himself available at all times. Gross fulfills this though a bit slowly IMO.

Bissouma has replaced him while he is injured but has not been playing the same role.

The other reason we have struggled for me is Locadia being played out of position on the left. He doesn't have the defensive nous to do this.

I'm hoping for a far improved performance with these two changes.

 

[Seasidesage]

Because I agree about Montoya. But to suggest Bernardo isn't quick is ludicrous.

He's the quickest we have but we lack pace all around the pitch which was the point....

 

[Bold Seagull]

I guess the trickier part of the argument is the "far beyond the transfer fee", but we have seen contributions from Locadia vs. Everton, Arsenal for example whereby many of us were impressed with his contributions from wider left. His turn and shot against Millwall was a class finish. Fleeting but flashes that make you frustrated because you feel it is in there. The same for Ali J as far as I am concerned : the shot vs Huddersfield, his general contribution vs. Palace - fleeting moments. Bissouma, Montoya, Balogun have all had those moments too - if they were able to produce these moments with anything approaching consistency, the transfer fees would seem "steals" I think? But I guess that is why they were the price they are : potentially brilliant with huge question marks still hanging over them..

Yes exactly, and I agree, I only picked up on that part. Gross is the only player I think we have signed over 2 years that went far beyond his fee, and we'd get good money for him if we sold. Not sure any of the others are in the Gross bracket though, perhaps Andone at £5m is. Very few others are fulfilling the price we paid. At £15m+ whether time to settle or not, at the bare minimum you would be expecting more fleeting moments than we've had. We can't run off potential and promise for long.

 

[mackieaj]

And what I can’t understand is, that we buy youngsters from abroad and then loan them to clubs back in their own/another country (Tau & Arce excepted as no work permit), Surely they’d get used to English conditions quicker by being loaned to L1 or L2 clubs

We should definitely be doing this, buy them in young and then loan them out to English teams. Get them used to playing in the English leagues and also living here which must play a big factor.

 

[Ernest]

I see Andy Naylor is now using Gross being missing as the source of all our problems. Which makes the fact we are so reliant on him with no natural back up pretty criminal IMO

And to not address it in January was even worse as we knew Gross was struggling injury wise

 

[casbom]

David Brooks and Daniel James were both identified in the Championship by scouts last season & highly recommended for recruitment over the summer but whatever algorithm is used by the analysts at the club it rejected them. They would have cost less than £20m for the pair and Brooks would cost a lot more than that by himself today.

I thought this went out with previous Management? The Moneyball approach? or is it a case that it's now a mesh of the Moneyball and Scout recommendations, which then Winstanley goes to see that target in action?

 

[Surf's Up]

Copying the Chelsea model ... if it comes off, you make an overall profit with later sales.

It's called "fattening for market" in farming terms.

 

[Stat Brother]

You're not discussing with NSC and any old thread started, you're discussing this point through NSC with me, specifically. Someone starting a Montoya thread 6 months ago is irrelevant.

My point was you said each signing had shown ability far beyond their transfer fee.

I am really struggling with any of them showing far beyond their fee, in fact some of them not getting anywhere near showing even glimpses they were worth their fee. Andone I grant you looks a great buy at £5m or so. If we go back to Gross and compare him to recent signings, he was a steal at £15m let alone the £3m we paid.

Perhaps some of them will show a glimpse tonight.

Fair enough although you seem to have missed my HUGE caveat albeit through various levels of fleetingness I can only assume you keep blinking at the wrong time.

I was merely implying I feel ALL of the summer transfers have have shown why they were bought.

The obvious clubhouse leader being Bernie, in disputably
Some have done it over a few games, like Montoya.
Some have over a couple of games, a la Balogan (not played for so long I can't even spell his name)
We can all but guarantee Bissouma having '3' moments a game, then he shoots.
Locadia needs to only shoot, as he's probably the player I'd want to score 'the' chance.
Andone is a cross between whippet and pitbull which is nice!
Leaving just Ali J - Bless him.

I totally agree most haven't shown value, but I feel all (nearly) have shown why they were valued.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Fair enough although you seem to have missed my HUGE caveat albeit through various levels of fleetingness I can only assume you keep blinking at the wrong time.

I was merely implying I feel ALL of the summer transfers have have shown why they were bought.

The obvious clubhouse leader being Bernie, in disputably
Some have done it over a few games, like Montoya.
Some have over a couple of games, a la Balogan (not played for so long I can't even spell his name)
We can all but guarantee Bissouma having '3' moments a game, then he shoots.
Locadia needs to only shoot, as he's probably the player I'd want to score 'the' chance.
Andone is a cross between whippet and pitbull which is nice!
Leaving just Ali J - Bless him.

I totally agree most haven't shown value, but I feel all (nearly) have shown why they were valued.

I imagine your fleetingness has been used to good effect over the years.

I think Bernie is a good left back, but I've not seen a £9m contribution yet. I'd love to see him beat his man or get a cross in. I was hoping that is what £9m gets you.
Montoya has been steady enough, but compared to other full backs in the league well under £7m, I've not seen even fleeting contributions going forward.

These two especially I think we were banking on reinforcing our wing play and creating more chances. It just hasn't clicked between wingers and full backs this season. It goes beyond tactics. The contributions just haven't materialised.

 

[Icy Gull]

I imagine your fleetingness has been used to good effect over the years.

I think Bernie is a good left back, but I've not seen a £9m contribution yet. I'd love to see him beat his man or get a cross in. I was hoping that is what £9m gets you.
Montoya has been steady enough, but compared to other full backs in the league well under £7m, I've not seen even fleeting contributions going forward.

These two especially I think we were banking on reinforcing our wing play and creating more chances. It just hasn't clicked between wingers and full backs this season. It goes beyond tactics. The contributions just haven't materialised.

Didn’t Montoya hit the bar with a shot recently which would have brought us to 1-1 against Saints?

 

[Pavilionaire]

I've noticed that the players who have under-performed under Hughton have tended to be the foreign players, while he seems to have got the max out of the British players.

As a club if our budget is, say, £50 million a season on transfer we want to be buying 2 1st XI players for £20 mill each and maybe a decent bench player at £10mill. Bringing in 3 quality signings is where we should be at this point - too many more and you disrupt the spirit.

I admire Burnley for pulling clear of the drop zone despite their season starting ages ago on 26th July and them not making any big signings. Dyche now is like the Tony Pulis of old - his teams are well-drilled and tough to beat but still with a cutting edge. They'll concede more than us but they'll score more too.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Didn’t Montoya hit the bar with a shot recently which would have brought us to 1-1 against Saints?

He did. I thought £7m bought you in off the bar though.

 

[Perkino]

It's about being solid and the back and hard to score against, if we do that we have a chance of beating anyone. We've lost Gross and changed formation and those who have come in find themselves chasing shadows

 

[Stat Brother]

I imagine your fleetingness has been used to good effect over the years.

I think Bernie is a good left back, but I've not seen a £9m contribution yet. I'd love to see him beat his man or get a cross in. I was hoping that is what £9m gets you.
Montoya has been steady enough, but compared to other full backs in the league well under £7m, I've not seen even fleeting contributions going forward.

These two especially I think we were banking on reinforcing our wing play and creating more chances. It just hasn't clicked between wingers and full backs this season. It goes beyond tactics. The contributions just haven't materialised.

I guess I should have known the spend before equating them to the player.

I did have both Montoya and Bernie in the £6m bracket.

I'm not sure it 'goes beyond tactics', although I understand what you mean.
I see Bernie in the 4-3-3 team as an out and out wing-back, while Montoya is a more conventional full back assisting his winger.

Yes esp recently there's been a lot of missteps from those positions, but none of them have been helped from the midfield or forward.
What's the point of playing for crosses when nobody, I can genuinely write 'literally nobody', is in the penalty area.

The wronger the team have become the more they've looked like a team playing of corners and free kicks.
That's understandable v City, less so at home to Southampton.

 

[Don Tmatter]

And to not address it in January was even worse as we knew Gross was struggling injury wise

We did address it but then loaned him back to the club we bought him from.

 

[Stat Brother]

I've noticed that the players who have under-performed under Hughton have tended to be the foreign players, while he seems to have got the max out of the British players.

As a club if our budget is, say, £50 million a season on transfer we want to be buying 2 1st XI players for £20 mill each and maybe a decent bench player at £10mill. Bringing in 3 quality signings is where we should be at this point - too many more and you disrupt the spirit.

I admire Burnley for pulling clear of the drop zone despite their season starting ages ago on 26th July and them not making any big signings. Dyche now is like the Tony Pulis of old - his teams are well-drilled and tough to beat but still with a cutting edge. They'll concede more than us but they'll score more too.

Is there any difference between our season and Burnley's?

Theirs ran from January to May the Albion's ran from August to December.
Clearly both can be good for 5 months proper shitehouse for the rest of the time.