[Politics] Tory meltdown finally arrived [was: incoming]...

[Pevenseagull]

He doesn't do empathy at all well ....

Greedy sociopaths don't.

His chat with the homeless guy at the soup kitchen was all I needed to see. Not a clue.

 

[WATFORD zero]

This thread is such a depressing list of what a corrupt cabal in complete breakdown keep doing whilst the fabric of the UK implodes around them.

The only highspots are the occasional forays into whataboutism by the last desperate dregs of the cabal's support. Betting odds, misogyny, but, but, but what about Starmer, wokeism etc etc ............... very brief comical interludes amongst the death throes. If only someone had warned about what would happen ..... oh

 

[Is it PotG?]

This thread is such a depressing list of what a corrupt cabal in complete breakdown keep doing whilst the fabric of the UK implodes around them.

The only highspots are the occasional forays into whataboutism by the last desperate dregs of the cabal's support. Betting odds, misogyny, but, but, but what about Starmer, wokeism etc etc ............... very brief comical interludes amongst the death throes. If only someone had warned about what would happen ..... oh

Chin up chap.

 

[Tubby Mondays]

He doesn't do empathy at all well, which you'd have thought was a core attribute for a politician to rise to the top of the greasy pole. He just comes across as very detached ("I don't have any working class friends") and that the PM job is all part of his career trajectory.

Like Handcock. He was/is a personality vacuum. He shouldve been sacked for the failure to produce fake tears episode alone.

Yet Ed Miliband was vilified for looking a bit strange whilst eating a bacon sandwich.

I still cant work out all these years later why they didnt just get him a cup of tea/coffee or a glass of water.

 

[pb21]

Like Handcock. He was/is a personality vacuum. He shouldve been sacked for the failure to produce fake tears episode alone.

Yet Ed Miliband was vilified for looking a bit strange whilst eating a bacon sandwich.

I still cant work out all these years later why they didnt just get him a cup of tea/coffee or a glass of water.

Ah, Ed Miliband, reminds me of my favourite all time tweet.

 

[A mex eyecan]

Ah, Ed Miliband, reminds me of my favourite all time tweet.

View attachment 175106

that’s not worn well has it?

 

[Gwylan]

He doesn't do empathy at all well, which you'd have thought was a core attribute for a politician to rise to the top of the greasy pole. He just comes across as very detached ("I don't have any working class friends") and that the PM job is all part of his career trajectory.

It's not just the lack of empathy: he can't think on his feet either. He turned up today with pre-scripted answers and looked lost when Starmer departed from his expected attack. His transphobic response was appalling but anyone with real political instinct would have shied away. Cameron wouldn't have done it, Major wouldn't have done it, Hague wouldn't have done it, I don't even think May would have done, even Johnson would have thought better of it ... but Sunak blundered right in.

The leader debates before the election are going to be a bloodbath. Sunak has no debating skills whatsoever and he's going to be up against a KC whose entire professional life revolves around thinking on his feet. And he won't have the help of a compliant Speaker either but a hard-nosed journalist who'll want to see blood. The Tories must be dreading this.

 

[Machiavelli]

It's not just the lack of empathy: he can't think on his feet either. He turned up today with pre-scripted answers and looked lost when Starmer departed from his expected attack. His transphobic response was appalling but anyone with real political instinct would have shied away. Cameron wouldn't have done it, Major wouldn't have done it, Hague wouldn't have done it, I don't even think May would have done, even Johnson would have thought better of it ... but Sunak blundered right in.

The leader debates before the election are going to be a bloodbath. Sunak has no debating skills whatsoever and he's going to be up against a KC whose entire professional life revolves around thinking on his feet. And he won't have the help of a compliant Speaker either but a hard-nosed journalist who'll want to see blood. The Tories must be dreading this.

Agree with most of this. Johnson would have waded in if he sensed political advantage, and I suspect Truss would too (not that she left too many clues while PM).
While not exactly looking forward to the leader debates (if they happen), I doubt KS will inspire too many through his thinking on his feet, nor will it cause voters to switch parties -- he's just not an engaging speaker (like Blair, Hague and Johnson was/is and, to a lesser extent, Cameron too). KS is, however, doing a pretty good job at presenting himself as a 'public servant' committed to service and carving a frontier on which sits the other side.

 

[pb21]

that’s not worn well has it?

Aged like milk.

The leader debates before the election are going to be a bloodbath.

Won't be a bloodbath as he'll give them a swerve, like you he'll know he doesn't stand a chance.

 

[Tubby Mondays]

Aged like milk.

Won't be a bloodbath as he'll give them a swerve, like you he'll know he doesn't stand a chance.

Bit odd isn’t it?

They’ve pushed for making people go to court to face being sentenced (rightly or wrongly).

But won’t do the same probably/possibly/maybe.

 

[Gwylan]

I doubt KS will inspire too many through his thinking on his feet, nor will it cause voters to switch parties -- he's just not an engaging speaker (like Blair, Hague and Johnson was/is and, to a lesser extent, Cameron too).

I'm not sure I'd agree with this. The leader debates do have an impact - look at the boost it gave Nick Clegg in 2010, there was an immediate leap in the LD showing and they scored the most seats for some time. Clegg wasn't a particularly engaging speaker, but he handled himself well in the debates. And we haven't seen a leader fall apart yet but, if anyone will, I think Sunak will.

I do agree with your line "if they happen", I can see the Tories pulling out of these because they know what a disaster they'll be for Sunak. And I'm not sure swapping leaders will help - unless they pick Mordaunt - the others all look pretty hopeless. Mordaunt isn't: she's a skilled debater but she's not a members' favourite, so has no chance.

 

[Tubby Mondays]

I'm not sure I'd agree with this. The leader debates do have an impact - look at the boost it gave Nick Clegg in 2010, there was an immediate leap in the LD showing and they scored the most seats for some time. Clegg wasn't a particularly engaging speaker, but he handled himself well in the debates. And we haven't seen a leader fall apart yet but, if anyone will, I think Sunak will.

I do agree with your line "if they happen", I can see the Tories pulling out of these because they know what a disaster they'll be for Sunak. And I'm not sure swapping leaders will help - unless they pick Mordaunt - the others all look pretty hopeless. Mordaunt isn't: she's a skilled debater but she's not a members' favourite, so has no chance.

Yeah and Brown was rubbish in those and looked dreadful.

 

[Tubby Mondays]

I'm not sure I'd agree with this. The leader debates do have an impact - look at the boost it gave Nick Clegg in 2010, there was an immediate leap in the LD showing and they scored the most seats for some time. Clegg wasn't a particularly engaging speaker, but he handled himself well in the debates. And we haven't seen a leader fall apart yet but, if anyone will, I think Sunak will.

I do agree with your line "if they happen", I can see the Tories pulling out of these because they know what a disaster they'll be for Sunak. And I'm not sure swapping leaders will help - unless they pick Mordaunt - the others all look pretty hopeless. Mordaunt isn't: she's a skilled debater but she's not a members' favourite, so has no chance.

And swapping leaders isn’t out of the question given the local elections in May.

 

[nicko31]

PMQ's was horrendous today.

Really not looking to the election campaign when it kick off, the Tories are a wounded animal fighting to survive and they are to fight very dirty. 2019 was pretty bad but I fear this will reach new depths.

 

[Is it PotG?]

PMQ's are horrendous today.

Really not looking to the election campaign when it kick off, the Tories are a wounded animal fighting to survive and they are to fight very dirty. 2019 was pretty bad but I fear this will reach new depths.

I agree totally.

Today's comment was clumsy at worst, yet the political capital sought and screaming for policemen is embarrassing and a sign of poor things to come.

 

[keaton]

I agree totally.

Today's comment was clumsy at worst, yet the political capital sought and screaming for policemen is embarrassing and a sign of poor things to come.

No at best it was clumsy . at worst it was a clueless twat trying to inflame more culture wars against vulnerable people to deflect from his parties failings.

 

[Stat Brother]

No at best it was clumsy . at worst it was a clueless twat trying to inflame more culture wars against vulnerable people to deflect from his parties failings.

Trying to claw votes away from The Reform Party isn't a good look for the Tories.

Imagine how different this country would be if they just cuddled Farage and stuck him in an unloseable seat, all those years ago.

 

[WATFORD zero]

I agree totally.

Today's comment was clumsy at worst, yet the political capital sought and screaming for policemen is embarrassing and a sign of poor things to come.

What, you think the political brilliance of your preferred cabal's last 4 and a bit years in charge may be coming to an end

 

[Machiavelli]

I'm not sure I'd agree with this. The leader debates do have an impact - look at the boost it gave Nick Clegg in 2010, there was an immediate leap in the LD showing and they scored the most seats for some time. Clegg wasn't a particularly engaging speaker, but he handled himself well in the debates. And we haven't seen a leader fall apart yet but, if anyone will, I think Sunak will.

I do agree with your line "if they happen", I can see the Tories pulling out of these because they know what a disaster they'll be for Sunak. And I'm not sure swapping leaders will help - unless they pick Mordaunt - the others all look pretty hopeless. Mordaunt isn't: she's a skilled debater but she's not a members' favourite, so has no chance.

Without wanting to be too argumentative they obviously aren't that impactful if you can only point to one four elections ago in which the leader of a third party did well -- he had somewhat of a free pass in that one which was the first IIRC. That said, the core point I was trying (and failing) to make is that KS is not a great speaker, and I doubt he'll win too many over in the debates -- not that he'll need to, he'll just need to ensure he doesn't fall apart and I doubt he will largely for the reasons you identify: he can think on his feet, knows his brief and doesn't get flustered.

 

[clapham_gull]

Good analysis of the mess they are in.