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[Politics] Tory meltdown finally arrived [was: incoming]...



Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
56,097
Faversham
To an extent, we absolutely are.

Johnson is on the ropes and probably gone within six months. The Tories will have a choice between one of his cabinet, guilty by association, or to take a tack more to the centre. In the latter, more likely, scenario it's better deals all round for ALL the British public.

I'm sure there are levers the RMT can pull without national strike. Overtime bans, sudden bouts of "Covid", steering Sir Keir down their path by, well, the old fashioned art of sitting down and talking, getting the message that Boris is a fat oaf, convicted and fined even more out there.

Now the Tories can say "see - if you don't vote for us you get the Unions".

It's exactly what Thatcher did. She was utterly useless in her first term and heading for defeat until she flew the Union flag over The Falklands and started to remind people about the winter of discontent under Labour. For today, swap in Ukraine and a national rail strike. And Labour? They opposed her with Foot :facepalm:

:lolol: Yep.

The trouble with some unions is the SWP element. They no more want a labour government than they want a tory government. They imagine that somehow constant nit picking will drive the proletariate into their arms. But we don't even know who they ****ing are. I couldn't name their supreme Dalek let alone any of their mid-range thinkers.

This always got me. The UCU had a legitimate case a few years ago about the erosion of pensions. The employer (HMG) changed its arrangement with the pension company to greatly reduce benefits to ongoing pensions. Even this is a tad nuanced, but it effectively resulted in a 40% reduction in final pension for a young lecturerer, already 10 years into the scheme. This is not an easy sell because you could argue that just as interets rates go up and down, the return on an investment pention may go down. I 'lost' maybe £40K when my pension went for final salaray to average salary when for the final 7 years of its lifetime. Could have been worse....makes the job far less attractve though and 2 young lectureres left work recently for the private sector - unheard of in my previous 35 years...

What did UCU do? It campaigned on behalf of those who would lose out most - those yet to join the scheme. What? And then it combined the pensions issue with unequal pay for women. Women are not paid unequally in the higher education sector. Fact. But average income for women is lower. This is because the older we get the fewer women stay in the game due to deciding parenting will be more fun, meaning there are fewer female professors (who can negociate whatever salary they can get away with). There is also an argument that women professors earn less than male professors because they are poor at negociating their salaries. I call that sexist bollocks. Nevertheless the UCU conflated sex discrimination ('the gender pay gap') with pensions in their campaign.

Then there is the issue of short term contracts. This is where it gets silly. I have recently employed someone on a short term contract. It is a 3 year postdoctoral contract, starting at around £40K. It is funded from a British Heart Foundation grant, which I wrote (with the assistance of the person I have employed). She knows it is a 3 year contract. The idea is she publishes some papers and applies for her own fellowship, the next rung on the ladder. The UCU, however, expect my college to guarantee my post doc a job for life. Far cough. If you have done 3 or 4 postdocs where somene else raised your salary, and you either can't or won't write your own fellowship or apply for a lectureship elsewhere, maybe you should be looking a bit lower down the employment latter.

Anyway.... it's all bollocks and I will sit back and wait for the next GE, putting right any wrong nonense that floats past my peripheral vision :wink:
 








Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
56,097
Faversham
That's an extreme view Harry, I can't believe that this (or the last ) Tory government had the brains and the ability to carry this out... I'd like to think so at least.

It's what I would do were I a free market tory. :shrug:

Wouldn't you like to be better off with more freedom and more choice? There is no choice in the state education system. What if you would prefer your child to not follow the national Curriculum? And what about health? You have no choice in the NHS.

No, the conservative party believes that working men and women should keep more of what they earn and be given more choice and freedom. The conservative party does not believe in soaking hard working people for tax to subsidise the inefficient and inflexible national Health and Education systems.

With more of the pound you earn left in your pocket you can choose what is best for you and your family

The government may also consider creating specialist technical schools, free to attend but with a flexible curriculum matched to the employment requirements of the nation. Computing, engineering, and skills needed for self employment. There is no point wasting taxpayers' money forcing working people's chldren to attend lessons on gender identity, sociology, and the like.

It's all very simple. And under President Johnson we now have the leadership to deliver on this bold agenda.

Starting with ****ing up the public sector workers and their silly-arse unions.
 


darkwolf666

Well-known member
Nov 8, 2015
7,651
Sittingbourne, Kent
It's what I would do were I a free market tory. :shrug:

Wouldn't you like to be better off with more freedom and more choice? There is no choice in the state education system. What if you would prefer your child to not follow the national Curriculum? And what about health? You have no choice in the NHS.

No, the conservative party believes that working men and women should keep more of what they earn and be given more choice and freedom. The conservative party does not believe in soaking hard working people for tax to subsidise the inefficient and inflexible national Health and Education systems.

With more of the pound you earn left in your pocket you can choose what is best for you and your family

The government may also consider creating specialist technical schools, free to attend but with a flexible curriculum matched to the employment requirements of the nation. Computing, engineering, and skills needed for self employment. There is no point wasting taxpayers' money forcing working people's chldren to attend lessons on gender identity, sociology, and the like.

It's all very simple. And under President Johnson we now have the leadership to deliver on this bold agenda.

Starting with ****ing up the public sector workers and their silly-arse unions.

Yet where education is concerned they appear to be doing the complete opposite of what you say, with less choice and more state control...

We really are sleepwalking into a dictatorship...

https://schoolsweek.co.uk/schools-bill-ex-ministers-line-up-to-criticise-dfe-power-grab/
 




beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
36,014
It's what I would do were I a free market tory. :shrug:

Wouldn't you like to be better off with more freedom and more choice? There is no choice in the state education system. What if you would prefer your child to not follow the national Curriculum? And what about health? You have no choice in the NHS.

No, the conservative party believes that working men and women should keep more of what they earn and be given more choice and freedom. The conservative party does not believe in soaking hard working people for tax to subsidise the inefficient and inflexible national Health and Education systems.

With more of the pound you earn left in your pocket you can choose what is best for you and your family

The government may also consider creating specialist technical schools, free to attend but with a flexible curriculum matched to the employment requirements of the nation. Computing, engineering, and skills needed for self employment. There is no point wasting taxpayers' money forcing working people's chldren to attend lessons on gender identity, sociology, and the like.

It's all very simple. And under President Johnson we now have the leadership to deliver on this bold agenda.

Starting with ****ing up the public sector workers and their silly-arse unions.

i'd wager you've given it a lot more thought, and expressed more policy, than Johnson ever has.
 


beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
36,014
Yet where education is concerned they appear to be doing the complete opposite of what you say, with less choice and more state control...

We really are sleepwalking into a dictatorship...

https://schoolsweek.co.uk/schools-bill-ex-ministers-line-up-to-criticise-dfe-power-grab/

that seems to contradict the direction of travel with academies. why go to the trouble of moving schools into self-governing academies, then insisting the DfE and minister are responsible for what happens there?
 


Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
56,097
Faversham




Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
56,097
Faversham
i'd wager you've given it a lot more thought, and expressed more policy, than Johnson ever has.

:lolol: Johnson was growing up when Sir Sheath Joseph and Thatcher were ripping up the post war concensus. He's seen successive tory leaders take their eye off the ball, bottling it and losing any kind of vision, with 'call me Dave' and Theresa May embracing much of the socialist state and May herself actually finding ways to support it. Johnson's vision is simple: a skeleton health and welfare infrastructure for the iredeemably poor, and an aspirational society with the goal of self-dependence for the rest of us. I think Johnson genuinely believes this. Along with the right of those on power to make the rules fit with their imperatives, because the people who should be most free are the ones gifted with the decision-making responsibilities. If I were a psychopath, that's eactly what I would think and do. Cheeky smiles, and a bit of repartee, thrown in for free ???
 


Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Its the same everywhere TB, everywhere you look Public Services are suffering either by a lack of investment or deliberate cuts. There's not enough Police, there's not enough Legal Aid, there's not enough prison cells, not enough prison officers. Then look at the NHS and its a shortage/ retention crisis of GP's, Nurses, Mental health services, Midwives, A&E capacity. Then you look at education, Schools falling down, experienced teachers being forced out by funding cuts, SEN underfunded, Specialist Reading and Mathematics interventions cut... I've missed out loads of others ... its a bit like "What did the Government used to do for us ? " a la Monty Python. Its the result of a combination of privatisation, the decline of Union rights and membership, changes in employment law and the cut in the central government grant to councils, and trying to save cash and hope nothing bad turns up... plenty more reasons left that I have missed out too but nearly all of them hinge on trying to muddle through by trying to save or make a bit of money and hoping people cope/muddle through/ don't notice.

I saw the difference after 2010 until I retired in 2014. I don’t know how my colleagues manage now. I don’t think they do as it is broken. Ministers try to cover up by criticising working from home and the blame game.
 


Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
:lolol: Johnson was growing up when Sir Sheath Joseph and Thatcher were ripping up the post war concensus. He's seen successive tory leaders take their eye off the ball, bottling it and losing any kind of vision, with 'call me Dave' and Theresa May embracing much of the socialist state and May herself actually finding ways to support it. Johnson's vision is simple: a skeleton health and welfare infrastructure for the iredeemably poor, and an aspirational society with the goal of self-dependence for the rest of us. I think Johnson genuinely believes this. Along with the right of those on power to make the rules fit with their imperatives, because the people who should be most free are the ones gifted with the decision-making responsibilities. If I were a psychopath, that's eactly what I would think and do. Cheeky smiles, and a bit of repartee, thrown in for free ???

You’re giving Johnson credit for actually having a vision?
 




Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Because they were so much better before?

Sorry but this is like a Brighton player improving when he’s not playing…… my recollection is that British Rail was a shitshow at the best of times, rarely on time, terrible carriages, unreliable, cancellations - kind of the same as it is now, (though the carriages are better IMO).

Tickets were affordable as shareholders weren’t getting paid out.
 




dazzer6666

Well-known member
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Mar 27, 2013
55,518
Burgess Hill
Thread started in December….when is the actual meltdown happening? Johnson isn’t going to fold….he’s the card player that carries on betting even though he knows his hand is a pile of shite. When does he go all in ?
 






Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
56,097
Faversham
You’re giving Johnson credit for actually having a vision?

As you must have noticed, I am an extremely generous person :wink:

There was (meant to be visibly) a rich vein of irony in my last couple of posts.

Of course 'small state, low tax, subsistence public services, no red tape, and I shall do what I like' isn't a 'vision'. It is simply Thatcherite buzzwords, with a pinch of Napoleon (and eventually Nero) chucked in.

He is very good at remembering a script, like a comedy sketch, and ad libbing around it. I can see some talent there. However, Frankie Boyle has a similar skill set.

Johnson, the PM with a vision. The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist. And like that, he's gone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OAFtr-ciQE
 
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beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
36,014
It’s cheaper to fly than to use the train, which is ludicrous.

it is. yet flying is a profitable operation while rail has about third costs subsidised by tax payers. probably need to ask why.
 


The Clamp

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jan 11, 2016
26,182
West is BEST
Thread started in December….when is the actual meltdown happening? Johnson isn’t going to fold….he’s the card player that carries on betting even though he knows his hand is a pile of shite. When does he go all in ?

I don’t think anyone can predict what is going to be the story that actually sees him booted out. Or when it will break. But it is in the post.
History is not kind to tyrants.
 




Jim in the West

Well-known member
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Sep 13, 2003
4,951
Way out West
it is. yet flying is a profitable operation while rail has about third costs subsidised by tax payers. probably need to ask why.

There are probably two fundamental reasons:
1. Much of the “infrastructure” for flying is free - there’s the bit at the beginning and the end (airports) which needs to be paid for, but everything in between is nearly free (airlines pay navigation fees, but not much else);
2. There’s no tax on aviation fuel, whereas the electricity which powers much of the rail network includes lots of add-ons.

There are no doubt others, but I think they are the main reasons. I’m sure there’s a whole load of extra cost in what the train operating companies need to pay to the government, but I’m no expert on all that.
 


dazzer6666

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Mar 27, 2013
55,518
Burgess Hill
I don’t think anyone can predict what is going to be the story that actually sees him booted out. Or when it will break. But it is in the post.
History is not kind to tyrants.

He’ll probably have some kind of historically significant demise……..maybe choking on his own vomit at a Bullingdon Club reunion perhaps ?
 


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